I pour mine into the 2 gal containers I put my used motor oil in. then take it to the recycle place and dump it in their tank. Don`t ask, don`t tell :rolleyes:.

one of these threads a few year back I remember someone pouring it into his new filter. :eek: NOT a good idea.

I have a piece of screen placed over a drain pan the filters sit on upside down to drain out. then I throw them in a 5gal bucket. then when Iam burning my brush piles, it keeps the fire going. :D

Charlie

I've thought about doing that (mixing it with the used oil), but one of our local auto parts places recently stopped accepting used oil because they had a contaminated batch and decided it wasn't worth the trouble anymore. They didn't say what the contaminant was, but it does make me reluctant to play tricks with the few places I have left that will still take it...

the only thing oil recyclers don't want in their oil is WATER/antifreeze.

Do you have any substantiation for that claim?

Pour it around your fence posts, great for the termites. :D

If these drop off places want to ge chicken "____" about it..........

you can do what a lot of people do, go out on some County road or along a State Hwy. and set your containers on the shoulder and drive off.

Then later about 25 cars, PU`s and special Haz-Mat crews will drive up and analyze the substance, there will be a bunch in their white Haz-mat uits and OBA`s running around doing testing. then they will set it in the back of a PU and drive off. then later to fill out a pile of forms and other paper work. should only cost $25 - $30K to dispose it.

Now before I get flammed, I use to work for the State Hwy Dept. in Calif. seen it done time and time again.

So far, I go the the County Dump and haven`t had a problem. Kragans use to take it, maybe still do.

Charlie

I went and checked... all 3 of my 83's have the 01 filter base, with the crush washer, and the lack of o-rings...:confused::o

it's what's written on the barrel where I recycle my oil at advance auto parts.

The lack of a lower o-ring means your fuel is only being partially (at best) filtered by the secondary filter.

^Agreed, install some "O" rings.

Great... all this time I've been changing the filters wrong... arrrrrgggghhhhh!
now I gotta go pull the filters from all my cars, and check the bolts for o-ring grooves...:mad:

Crush washer issues
 

So I ordered viton O-rings for the 01 model shaft from McMaster Carr, and now have to solve the leaking at the top. The original copper ring just doesn't seal anymore and so I have taken it off and made measurements. My vernier measurements are 18.2mm inside and 21.4 mm outside. I tried making a new ring out of gasket material but it leaks too. I'll find something.

What a silly pain.

if I'm not filtering the fuel properly, how come the filters getting clogged up slows me down?

You're burning dirty fuel, it gets circulated and eventually the filters will get clogged up.

How come you don't recognize the correct answer when told?

Maybe that o-ring is just a decoration and actually serves no useful purpose.

Hey! I believe you, I'm just throwing info out there. I'm glad to know I'm an idiot about these things. I've got a brand new box of o-rings and I'll be installing them on ALL my and my customer's cars. everything I read about these cars said the 01 base had no o-rings, just the 02, now I see that the 01 has one o-ring, and the 02 has 2 o-rings. yes?

Island300, Sent you a pm about your seal. Also, see my last reply above. I found a solution for 4 bucks at Autozone.

You should be able to get a copper washer the same size or close to it from an auto parts store. My local one has bubble packs of them near the oil change stuff, and a drawer full of bulk ones in assorted sizes at the parts counter. A crush washer with a 3/4-inch center hole would probably be close enough. The outside diameter is not critical.

The reason yours doesn't seal anymore is the copper has become work hardened. If you're really stuck for a replacement, heat it with a torch until it glows red and then let it cool. This should anneal it and make it soft again.

This has become a PIA and yet silly problem to deal with. To think a washer would cause such grief. I went today and bought the #30 cap thread gasket that had been recommended, which was plastic, and that leaked like it wasn't even there. I also sized and bought a fiber gasket that fit very well, but it saturates and leaks actively too.

I got so frustrated I took a file and lightly filed the top of the housing to make sure it wasn't deformed or dented in some way, and found there had been a few depressions and divits that I cleaned up, but this has gotten ridiculous. It still leaks. I'm tempted to order Viton orings in the right size since I could be certain they would crush to fill gaps and would seal, but McMaster sells them in bulk and they are a bit pricey.

I live on an island with no auto stores but next time I'm off island I'll maybe buy the copper set that has been recommended. Jeez, it's a damn washer for a low pressure fuel situation...it's easier to replace the brake pads.

Hopefully in the (near) future you'll obtain and consult an FSM before you start working on these cars, especially if you charge folks to do so.

Did you try annealing the copper washer like I suggested? Unless it's really badly deformed that may get you a leak-free seal again. When the copper gets crushed it work-hardens, and pretty soon it's too hard to deform when you tighten the bolt. Annealing it undoes the work hardening and makes it soft again.

Thanks for the suggestion, and no I haven't tried it yet. Will a heated and softened copper washer work as well as a new one? Wonder what the atomic reality of this hardening and softening with heat is as I have heard about this before. Maybe I'll look that up tonight.

^ Yes.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annealing_(metallurgy)

Most folks can simply replace the existing item.

I use a #30 cap thread gasket, it'a an SAE measurement, 3/4 inch ID. The older ones are made of composite material and work very well.

It should work. Of course if you keep annealing and re-using the same washer, eventually the washer will get too thin, but right now the main problem is probably that it's just hardened too much to crush easily.

If you're curious you can demonstrate the work hardening effect pretty easily with a length of solid wire -- like copper house wire, or even a steel paper clip. Flex it repeatedly in the same spot and you'll feel it get stiffer; if you keep going it'll get so hard it'll fracture.

This is why you see stranded wire used in applications that see flexing and vibration -- like in cars. If the wiring in your car was solid, engine vibration would cause it to gradually harden and eventually break at connection points.

I just went through this thread again. wow, what a bunch of Gnashing of teeth and wringing of hands just to change a filter. :D

The drama, the suspense, this is like a soap opera :P. Who shot JR? (those of you old enough to remember)

It almost seems like maybe this aluminum washer is another Unobtanium part by how difficult it is to find one. I think it Fastlane it is listed as a hollow Bolt seal Ring.

It seems like it would be easier to find the second version of the filter housing/head.

First version part# 615 092 01 08 uses one rubber "O" ring on bolt shaft and 1 aluminum washer under bolt head.

^ If Charlie runs out of "02" filter heads, let me know. Mine include all new washers for all banjo bolts that need 'em and and two new "O" rings.

I think the problem is mostly that island300D is on, well, an island, with limited parts options.

Personally I don't find crush washers hard to find. The main problem is remembering that I need to buy one when I get the filter. ;)

advance auto parts has the right size aluminum crush washer on the shelf with the oil plugs...

You know how you sometimes run into problems that defy all logic and attempts to solve them? Evidently, this damn oring for the fuel filter is one for me. I give up. I bought and installed a properly sized copper and aluminum oring and tightened them first by hand with the filter, and they leaked. Then I tightened them down a bit more with a wrench on the bolt head, and they still leaked.

I'm going to remove the entire fuel filter housing. I'm looking to replace the whole thing with the newer 02 version which I hear is better, just to avoid this problem anymore. Can't find it on peach parts.

I've never in my life, a lifetime of working on engines, had two surfaces refuse to mate and seal with a washer. I'm astounded. I know anyone reading this will think what I would think, which is that I must be missing something obvious, but I tell you, I'm not. Something must be warped or cracked or something, that is not at all apparent.

To be continued...Any leads on a new filter housing?

LMK, I'll send you one... PM for shipping etc...

I took a wetstone to the sealing surface of the filter housing on my 300TD to flatten it out and smooth the surface and it worked for me.

Problem solved
 

I'm happy to report that I have solved the leaking problem, albeit with an unorthodox solution. I welded it closed. Just kidding. Although having access to the oring on the bolt is the only reason for this thing to be removable, and wouldn't that be easier to solve with a ring inside the fuel filter itself!!!!! This is the worst design of a filter I have ever seen. But on to my solution.

I used a fiber washer meant for oil pans and coated it with gasket maker meant for use around fuels. I put it all together, let it set up, and whammo, no leak. Damn thing. Won't move that bolt again so long as I own this great car, which may be forever.

In fact, it would be easy enough to remove that oring on the bolt from below with a dental mirror and pick. That's the ticket from here on at fuel filter changes. Thanks for the help everybody.

I've not been able to unscrew the filter without loosening the bolt... I hope you have better luck than I do!

Great to hear you finally got it, island! i've been following the updates, and I felt bad for you. I would have been glad to send that copper washer set to you if you wanted me to, though! What's really strange is that I was looking at my 81 300D today when I checked my oil and radiator, and it has an 01 type filter housing, too. And I've changed the filter on it at least 4 times and never had a leak problem. Go figure! Anyway, glad the headache is over for you!:)

Thanks guys. And yes, I'd changed my filter many times before without this problem but I guess the original copper washer just got hardened and tired. I did have new copper washers to try and they didn't work. I even tried annealing them and they still didn't work. Ultimately, there must have been some micro deformity in the top of the housing that even a soft copper washer couldn't fill. I had lightly filed the top of the housing but that didn't catch it.

Since I only put about 1,000 miles a year on old Gunther I don't know when I will have to change that filter again. I've been changing them annually but the last two times I cut them open afterwards they looked pristine. Maybe I'll let this one go for a few years and a few more thousand miles! I've been running a high % biodiesel for 4 years and so my tank and lines are probably clean enough to sparkle.

On my 1991
 

On my car, I had a leak from the big fuel filter, took it to a MB independent mechanic, and he tightened it SUPER tight, so tight, that the engine torqued to the side when he did it. That could be the source of your leak, but yours is a different model than mine.

jeff

In the FSM "Service Manual Engine 617.95 Turbo Diesel", section 47-700, the torque for the fuel filter is 35 - 43 nm.

I don`t have a FSM for the 60X engine, but I bet the torque for the filter is about the same. It probably has the 2 "O" rings also and not a metal seal ring under the filter bolt.

I think I would be looking for a different mechanic if the guy is cranking down on the filter bolt and the engine is torquing over to one side. :eek:


Charlie

It could be the same guy who says the bolts often snap off when he changes the filters! (Sorry I posted something about this guy about 4 pages ago - amazing thread this one eh?)

Well Iam learning what not to do ;). I just changed one a couple weeks ago. replaced both "O" rings, filled the filter, spun it onto the bolt, and snugged the bolt down.

That bolt is pretty stout, how many ft lbs or Nm does it take to twist the head off? :confused:

A few days ago I pulled a filter head off an 83 300D at PNP. It has the #2 in the part# and the 2 "O" rings. someone also added a copper washer under the bolt head. :eek:

Iam going to see if I can get a Government grant to do a study at the local PNP`s to see the various techniques of sealing the filters.:D
Maybe we can slip in in under the "National Recovery Act". :rolleyes:
My recovery.;)

Charlie

:)signing off

I'm glad I read this thread, I recently changed my secondary without paying attention to the type of banjo fitting I have. As it turns out, I have an "01" and will now be ordering a new rubber O ring and copper crush washer.

I'd like clarify, as I don't have a the 617.XX FSM yet, that members are using a wrench to tighten the filter down. There is no way, as far as I can see it, that this filter will ever seal properly without applying at least a little torque on the banjo bolt to ensure a proper seal. The torque rating you specify would be approximately 25-31 lbs-feet and given the thickness of this bolt, I don't see that amount posing any risk.

In addition, I also noticed that the banjo bolt has its center section drilled out, for the fuel to come up after passing through the filter, and one outlet hole about halfway up the shaft. That outlet hold should be aligned with the outlet line going to the IP, correct? Maybe I got lucky on this when I originally did it but I may have had mine completely unaligned.

I don`t think it makes any difference where the bolt is aligned.

I just snug it down, and don`t use a torque wrench. but then I have the filter housing with the #2.

Charlie

The above is correct. The idea behind a banjo bolt is you don't have to line the hole up. The banjo fitting has a channel machined so the fuel/air can flow around it and through the bolt.

jbach, find another mechanic! Please!

Really?

Looking at the banjo bolt I would have never thought that fuel/air would be able to flow around it to the outlet port without first going through the center section of the bolt. There really is enough clearance? Whats the point of drilling the center section and horizontal hole if there exists enough clearance to circumvent that?

I'd like to just take the opportunity to clarify with you the steps of fuel flow in our w123 series.

1. Fuel flows from the primary (clear plastic filter) through the lift pump.
2. Fuel exiting the lift pump flows to the inlet port on the secondary filter housing into the filter itself through the various holes that punched into the outer diameter of the secondary fuel filter.

3. Fuel passes through the membrane into the center section of the secondary filter up through--and I guess around?-- the the banjo bolt.
4. From the banjo bolt, fuel is then delivered directly to the IP.

Do I have these steps correct?

The fuel flows from the lift pump to the top of the filter housing, down through the hole (pic 3), through the filter, up through the banjo bolt, around the banjo fitting and on to the injection pump.

The lower rubber "O" ring prevents the dirty fuel from going to the IP, directing it instead back to the tank. The upper "O" ring prevents any leak from the bolt.

I believe it would be possible to have everything line up, but that would take excessive engineering to be used on a production line.

So, yes, you have the steps correct and a hollow (banjo) bolt is necessary to facilitate the process.

The final answer to the leaking spin-on filter bolt!

I posted this about 5 years ago:

Use a "Nu-Lip" bonded aluminum washer (18Ø). It has a bonded lipped seal on the inside diameter of the washer and seals perfectly even at finger tight. I am still using the original washer I fitted on my car when it was new 26 years ago! They are great for all banjo bolts and available at all specialist hydraulic stores. No need to use a wrench on the bolt when you change the filter.