OM616 Projects Help! - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Steiner · #16 05-03-2011, 09:06 PM

I love this forum! This has to be the most educated forum on Mercedes. Thanks so much for your replies.

If anyone knows of a list of parts/steps required to swap a 300D engine into the 240D, I'd be interested in seeing how difficult it really is.

Thanks so much everyone!

gastropodus · #17 05-04-2011, 01:42 AM

Steiner, I know that everyone has different expectations on what constitutes "acceptably nimble," shall we say... but have you really given your 240D a chance to shine? By that I mean, have you tuned it up completely within spec? You're contemplating some expensive modifications; I hope that you have at least done all the standard maintenance tasks:

- adjusted the valves to perfect
- verified that your lift pump is delivering fuel at 15 psi plus to the IP
- changed out fuel filters
- replaced air filter
- inflated tires (this is a sleeper, too; many tires may be run above what Mercedes specs, and it makes a big difference in rolling resistance)
- checked your throttle linkage to make sure that when your pedal is to the floor the IP lever is very close and almost touching the full throttle stop
- replaced fuel injectors, or at least had them pop-tested for spray pattern

Finally, although the engine may have been rebuilt 15k miles ago, are you certain that the injection pump was rebuilt as well? Many times people will skimp on this, and the end result is that you have an engine with great compression, and poor fuel delivery.

You'll notice from my sig that I also have a 240D with the four speed manual. I've been continually amazed at this car. Even before I swapped in the rebuilt engine I felt that it ran well, so well that I mentally christened it Reinhart the Lion-Hearted - that little engine pushed that big car pretty well. Now that mine has the new engine in it I feel like the slowest thing that keeps me back is just my own ability to run through the gears - the car is quick through the RPM range all through the first three gears, and it is only in fourth gear that I notice, OK, it's taking some time to build up speed here. Your mileage may vary...

Kurt

47dodge · #18 05-04-2011, 08:16 AM

Gastropodus hit the nail on the head so to speak. You may want someone to adjust your ip, or if you are very mechanically inclined learn all you can before getting into it, and do it yourself. You will be amazed how this can bring it to life. Of course all other items in G's post need to be done first.

If your 240d is really cherry then I would think twice about engine swaps.

Steiner · #19 05-04-2011, 05:39 PM

I changed the in-line fuel filter and the car was suppose to have a valve adjustment when it was rebuilt. I'm willing to check them again if anyone knows where I can get the specs. I have specs for the W123's OM 616 but I'd like confirmation that they are the same.

The air filter is an oil bath filter and I haven't heard of people replacing them. I just cleaned it and replaced the oil.

I have not checked my injectors or fuel pump, but have bleed the lines of air using the primer and manual bleeding of the pump.

As far as tires, I check them every time I fill up and run them higher than spec.

I'll check my throttle linkage with the other things.

Again, I really appreciate everyone's help. This forum has been more helpful than I could have imagined. Also, as my first post stated, these ideas were going to be implemented this summer as I am booked full time until then.

leathermang · #20 05-04-2011, 05:45 PM

What PAPER Factory Shop Manuals do you own ?---- Mercedes related.... the Haynes and/ or from Mercedes ?

If you keep new oil in that filter... it actually has the capacity to catch smaller particles than a paper element... they stopped using them because owners were lazy.... not because they were not good...

Steiner · #21 05-04-2011, 05:53 PM

I have the Haynes manual for the W123.

For the air filter, should i be concerned about air flow?

Thanks leathermang!

leathermang · #22 05-04-2011, 06:11 PM

Air flow... is great if you cleaned the ' webbing ' stuff....and did not overfill it ... did you find the marks on the inside for max filling ?

That Haynes manual has better pictures of some of these things than the MB FSM...but on some other things it is not as clear.....and tries to do too many models without being clear...

Sit down and READ the Haynes manual... front to back.... it will open you up to lots of strange thinking on the part of MB...
and expose you to some of the important warnings..which never get mentioned on the web...

charmalu · #23 05-04-2011, 06:30 PM

Reading through this, I was thinking you had a W123, your last post you list a W115. I think the W115 had a 617 5 cyl engine, but the filter is mounter under the engine. If you install a 617 turbo, you will have to use a mounting plate on the engine to attach the oil hoses to a remote filter.

Don`t know the HP rating of the W115 240 eng, but my 80 240 is 67 hp. as Kurt mentioned, raising the air pressure in the tires will give an increase in milage. I had 28lb, and raised it to 42lb. side wall shows a max pressure of 44lb. I increased from 28 mpg to 31 + mpg going to Oregon and back.

When i replaced the automatic in our 85 300D with a 240D 4-spd, the front end raised up quite a bit. made the front end wander. I added 240D front springs and dropped her down. rides good, just a little soft in the turns on a mountain road. a 300TD front sway bar will fix that.

The 240 is a light nimble handling car to our 300D which seems like a more solid heavier handling car. I know they are the same chassis except for the 300 having one more cylinder and a turbo.

Since you have been over to superturbo.com. have you read through this thread on using a 5-spd from a W201 in a W123? It has been done, a lot of work for some, and a challenge to others.

http://www.superturbodiesel.com/std/thread-how-to-adapt-a-w201-5-speed-to-om616-om617-applications

I would recommend to keep the W115 as it is designed and drive it as is, and get a 300D turbo in addition to it if you can afford 2 cars. only thing wit the 300D 82 - 85, you loose the simplicity of the 240D.

Charlie

Steiner · #24 05-04-2011, 11:37 PM

It looks like my best bet is tuning my 240's engine to spec. I really appreciate all your help, and I'll be back in the summer when I have time to start working.

The engine runs like new, just very noisy and has a jumpy first gear.

leathermang · #25 05-04-2011, 11:43 PM

If you do not have Redline MTF in the trans.... you might consider doing that... very easy...
A lot of people have been surprised at how much faster their cars were when they got the linkage set to specs....they were really surprised !!!
Did you check your insulation under the hood ? that sure makes a difference in the noise.... I know...I have NO insulation under there... great directions in the archive... search for '8090 ' I think. The number for the proper contact cement spray by 3M.
You might consider replacing the three ( I think ) shifter bushings and be sure they are set to specs.... might help that first gear deal...

gastropodus · #26 05-05-2011, 01:45 AM

True story, which I have shared with a few friends, but not yet posted on the forum: after I put the new engine in my 240D I drove it for about a week, and I'm thinking this thing is a DOG. WOOF! I know it is the break-in period, but I can barely get up to 55 on the highway with the pedal on the floor. Serious case of "OK, now why did I swap engines again? The old one was way better than this." I'm racking my brain: is the engine that tight? Did I somehow screw up the timing that bad?

Finally it hit me: check the linkage. Took it over to John's house, and asked him to hold the pedal on the floor. Eureka! The IP lever was almost three quarters of an inch(!) away from the stop. So we got to work, lengthening the mechanical rods (on the 79's it's a bell crank on the firewall with about six rods from there that carry the motion along the passenger side of the engine, up past the air cleaner, over the top of the valve cover, and then back down to the IP). HUGE DIFFERENCE! It was like somebody simultaneously turned up the gain (now small pedal movements translated into larger IP lever movements) and the range (it comes close to the IP stop, but does not quite touch). It went from being a slug (gastropod) to something akin to a filly.

It is now a car that I would not hesitate to offer to my wife, which is actually saying something significant.

Cheers,

Kurt

Steiner · #27 05-05-2011, 02:15 AM

It sounds like the IP linkage would be my first thing to check this weekend.

The correct adjustment would be "almost fully open with the pedal to the floor"?

leathermang · #28 05-05-2011, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steiner

It sounds like the IP linkage would be my first thing to check this weekend.

The correct adjustment would be "almost fully open with the pedal to the floor"?

\

The correct adjustment is read the Haynes manual which you have... so you see any warnings in it.... and search the archives.... where this may have been discussed and fully vetted over time... If you have a way to get to a MB FSM follow their procedures and Warnings... You are attempting to be lazy dealing with stuff which might affect your health.... need to back up and have a firm foundation before addressing some of these things..