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  #1  
Old 05-02-2011, 08:36 PM
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OM616 Projects Help!

Hello,

I finally have a break this summer to work on the 240 my mum gave me when I was a kid. My main concern is the lack of power, which is a given for the car.

The car has a manual 4 speed and recently rebuilt engine. I have made a list of possible projects:

Upgrade to an OM617 turbo (what is needed for this swap?)

Add a turbo to the existing OM616 (what options in the U.S.?)

Upgrade to a 5 speed (options in the U.S.?)


Any comments on these three possible projects would be greatly appreciated!

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  #2  
Old 05-02-2011, 09:04 PM
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WAY TOO MUCH is needed for the swap.
Sell that car because it is very valuable...a great combination which many would really want to have....
and just find what you want in a car...

go to User CP and check your pm's...
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  #3  
Old 05-02-2011, 10:12 PM
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Steiner,
Welcome to the forum.
A 240 is not known for its power or speed.
If you are after a powerful car, best do as leathermang suggests.
If you want a classic, best get used to it!!
All the add ons in the world will not make a 240 into a boy racer.
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1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
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  #4  
Old 05-03-2011, 05:46 PM
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I will never sell my car! I used to push it around the parking lot with my friends before the we could drive, then learned to drive on it and have been driving it ever since. I've grown too close to it.

I'm not after a super car, I just wanted to give it some pep. There used to be a company that made turbos for this car when it came out. If I could get a hold of that, I'd be really happy. Here is the link:
http://superturbodiesel.com/std/attachment.php?aid=2512

The OM 616 engine is also used in India under another car manufacturer and comes with a turbo, but I've heard shipping the engine to the states is very costly. So I know options exist.

Also, what options for a 5 speed do I have if I keep my engine. This car revs pretty high/loud on the freeway and I was hoping the extra gear would quiet it down.
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  #5  
Old 05-03-2011, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steiner View Post
I will never sell my car! I used to push it around the parking lot with my friends before the we could drive, then learned to drive on it and have been driving it ever since. I've grown too close to it.

I'm not after a super car, I just wanted to give it some pep. There used to be a company that made turbos for this car when it came out. If I could get a hold of that, I'd be really happy. Here is the link:
http://superturbodiesel.com/std/attachment.php?aid=2512

The OM 616 engine is also used in India under another car manufacturer and comes with a turbo, but I've heard shipping the engine to the states is very costly. So I know options exist.

Also, what options for a 5 speed do I have if I keep my engine. This car revs pretty high/loud on the freeway and I was hoping the extra gear would quiet it down.
I am glad you would not ever sell your car. It is a classic in more ways than one...

There is no way to ' just give your car some pep '..... notice that I own one...

If you turbo charge your car without changing the pistons and the method they are cooled by ( oil cooled annular ring pistons and oil squirters pointed at the inside ) you will not be able to boost is any reasonable amount... or you will break something.... the turbo models have bigger bearing surfaces and things like that...

That turbo Indian model does exist...and one or our members has one... realistic cost options may not exist.. but you should check on that and report back to us... many dream of that option..

Now you are talking... a 5 speed is a reasonable option for your car... a change in drive shaft length and finding one for sale... is about all you will need to overcome...

First check the condition of your insulation under the hood and inside the car...that may help some on the noise...

Basically you are young wanting what all of us wanted at your age.... you own a classic well built and in great shape car made for middle age driving.

We are hoping you refrain from screwing up the classic features of your car until you age into an appreciation of the fine qualities which your car exhibits....

Sorry to talk to you as if I am 40 years older than you are.... but I am..LOL
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  #6  
Old 05-03-2011, 06:24 PM
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What options do I have for a 5 speed manual transmission? I have read about the change in drive shaft length, but I couldn't figure out what car they took the 5 speed out of.

Also, for anyone jumping in, I'm in the states, and the car it comes out of needs to be made in the states.

Thanks!

P.S.

I appreciate all your help, and I would never do anything to "screw up" my car. I have kept it as original as possible mechanically, and have found ways to work around things to make it 21st century.

For example, I spend hours examining the wiring of the radio to find a method to add an auxiliary cable that plugs into your MP3 player with no damage to the vehicle. If you would like, I am more than happy to help others learn how to do this.

I don't plan on getting a new car, this car had 300k before the rebuild, and has less than 15k after the rebuild. And for the record, I would be keeping all the original parts in storage.
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  #7  
Old 05-03-2011, 06:30 PM
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So many people would like to have a car with your specs with the engine already rebuilt... you are very lucky....and it does appear that you understand how well it is designed and built...

Your best option for the 5 speed is to buy a parts car with one in it...
then you have the parts for the change over without messing up a driveshaft.. it makes it a bolt off , bolt on situation.. getting the stuff from a salvage yard is hard due to making sure you get all the little stuff.... but can be done...
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  #8  
Old 05-03-2011, 07:00 PM
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Well, I have never heard of a 5 speed for the W123. Some forum guys say the 4 speed can be modified with additional parts to make it so. I think it might be possible to use a 5 speed out of a W124 or the small Benz, W201 or 190 with diesel or gas. Both exist, but again are kind of hard to find, but much easier to find then a W123 5 speed. I think that if you find a 300D turbo with a good engine and a junker body, the swap to a 300D turbo from a 240D is not too hard. Especially if you have the 300D to get the parts from. The engine fits because it was made for it and essentially you have all the parts. Flywheel balance, less then normal flywheel weight, shorten the front drive shaft a couple of inches, shorten the shift levers by the same amount, install the 300D radiator and oil cooler and change the whole rear axle differential which is a simple unbolt and reinstall, oh and install a coolant recovery which is a must have and the 240D doesn't have one. I installed mine today. I have been on mine since last spring, it was too hot last summer and too cold this winter. Age and health are considerations I have to work around. I have mine all done but the light work up on top and in the front, (radiator and fan belts, cooler lines) and I hope to have it finished by my birthday at the end of June. I think it is going to be a delightful 240D with a 300Turbo and four speed. And I think anyone with common sense and a desire to do it them self and do it right with little more then common garage tools can do it. Big tools like an engine lift can be rented or borrowed from friends. Matter of fact I have multiple friends who want me to use there lift, just to get it out of the garage. There is not much use for that tool if you are not lifting an engine.
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1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!
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  #9  
Old 05-03-2011, 07:18 PM
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The transmission from a W124 won't work. The starter is on the wrong side. They did sell the 240D and 300D with five speed manual transmissions, but not in the United States. A very small number of grey market cars with 5-speeds were imported to the States. These are the potential donors. I read on here not that long ago that you can still buy a new 5-speed from Mercedes, but they run somewhere north of seven thousand dollars.

Swapping a 617 into a 240D is certainly possible, and people on this forum have done it. However, in my opinion it's much easier to simply buy a 300D if you're wanting a 5-cylinder.
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  #10  
Old 05-03-2011, 07:47 PM
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Well Skippy, that is what we are saying. Buy a 300D and then put it in your favorite 240D that he has inherited and it has a 4 speed. Nobody is in love with old GM engineered Slim Jims from the 60's in their Mercedes. They just are getting pretty old.
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Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!
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  #11  
Old 05-03-2011, 07:48 PM
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I also read the 5 speeds were euro market cars only. I guess I'm stuck with a 4 speed, but I'd still like to look into either swapping the 300D turbo engine, or preferably, using a turbo kit that was made for the car.

Anyone know how differently a 240D handles from a 300D with the extra front weight?
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  #12  
Old 05-03-2011, 07:59 PM
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Well the weight difference is not very much. The 240D equipped car does have a lighter rated front coil spring. So a standard 300D spring probably would be a little harsh for a 240D. I am not much into A/C, I could see this system on my 240D needed serious work, so I just eliminated much of it. Removing compressor and condenser will balance the weight issue. I really think that looking into or looking for a turbo for the 240D is not the way to go. The engine simply is not designed for it. If those add on turbo's were good for much, they certainly did not leave a legacy. They are just plain gone and I think there is good reason they done exist. They killed engines!
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Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!
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  #13  
Old 05-03-2011, 08:09 PM
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I have a 240 and a 300. 300 now a parts car. The 240 feels lighter and more responsive in turns. 300 is a great highway cruiser but I never did like it on the back roads, the 240 just handles better. I have adjusted the IP for more fuel, it will take more even without a turbo. Of course with a turbo you can go even more on fueling. Look over in the performance section and check out josha37 posts. He has gone a bit further then most will want to, but it gives an idea how far you can push these engines. By the way bearing size is the same on the turbo and non turbo engines. If you do any performance mods you will need an egt gauge, or risk melted pistons.
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  #14  
Old 05-03-2011, 08:13 PM
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Also, the added weight of the 5th cylinder is behind the front "axle" centerline. The engine extends four inches to the rear and the front remains the same. And I suspect the automatic transmission adds more weight over the four speed then the 300D turbo does over the 240D
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Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!
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  #15  
Old 05-03-2011, 08:31 PM
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I'm sure the auto does add more. Even though the added weight is slightly behind the front axle, most will still be on the front. I was really surprised how differant the two cars handle. I did move the tires/rims from the 300 to the 240 so handling comparasion is with the same tires.

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