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  #46  
Old 07-05-2011, 03:21 PM
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Personally, I'd check the compression before adjusting the valves to get a sense of what you are working with. But then again, I'd just pump more WD-40 in there and keep trying. Part of the reason WD-40 works is that it uses propane as a propellant. I'd be half inclined to take a propane bottle and give it a shot of propane when attempting to start it.
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  #47  
Old 07-05-2011, 03:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry View Post
Personally, I'd check the compression before adjusting the valves to get a sense of what you are working with. But then again, I'd just pump more WD-40 in there and keep trying.
Not in the cards at this time, can't find someone with a compression checker and can't afford one
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  #48  
Old 07-05-2011, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CommieGIR View Post
Not in the cards at this time, can't find someone with a compression checker and can't afford one
When you get around to it, HF has an inexpensive one.
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1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
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  #49  
Old 07-05-2011, 04:11 PM
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I had the same problem with a car that sat up. Tried all the complicated stuff first, then I read about pumping a little lacquer thinner through the ip. It worked like a charm. Basically I pulled the injection lines off the pump,put the hose coming from the tank into a cup of thinner, cranked for about fifteen seconds and then let it sit for about two hours. Reconnected the fuel line and bled, and turned over for another 10 seconds. Fuel popped from each port as it should and after reconnecting everything the car started just fine.
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  #50  
Old 07-05-2011, 04:56 PM
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Well the best idea posted so far is to see if the engine will run on wd40 as Kerry suggested. This is about the only way you will find out if you have adaquate compression to start.

If it will not fire then take the valve cover off and check for some valve clearance on each valve. Some people drive these cars without ever doing the valve clearances or checking them. Eventually the car will not start. The valve clearances characteristically decrease or close up with use remember.

Now if the valve clearances are reasonable. They do not need adjusted immediatly as long as there is some clearance remember.

If you find the clearances are reasonable soak the rings down with miracle mystery oil for a week as this sometimes frees up rings stuck with wvo residue. Blow out the cylinders of any remaining oil before installing the injectors or glow plugs and try the wd40 again.

Many wvo burners have been saved this way. It is nice to see at least one other person on your thread is a believer in using laquer thinner for older injection pumps as well. I use the stuff so much for so many purposes I buy it by the five gallon can.

It is reasonable to say it has saved me having to remove and kit at least five thousand dollars worth of carbs alone. The snake oil types of cleaners that are sold are just not concentrated enough to equal the laquer thinner in my opinion. Even if they were for the volume of fluid required they would be too expensive even if they worked. Laquer thinner seems to dissolve dried gas residue and many other deposits from carbs and older injection pumps quite fast. Cheap chemical as well.

I especially like it for removing oil residues as well. It dries so fast it does not hold up whatever job you are doing and you know the surface is clean and dry with no remaining oil residue for silicone gasketing or whatever. I feel all too many jobs are not really cleaned or dry enough before a product like that is used.
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  #51  
Old 07-07-2011, 11:07 AM
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Any updates??
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  #52  
Old 07-07-2011, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psaboic View Post
Any updates??
Nothing yet, working on the valve adjustment but am waiting on someone to bend a wrench for me so I can hold the top valve bolt while I re-tighten the valve adjusters.
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  #53  
Old 07-07-2011, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by CommieGIR View Post
Nothing yet, working on the valve adjustment but am waiting on someone to bend a wrench for me so I can hold the top valve bolt while I re-tighten the valve adjusters.
If you remove the injection lines, it is easy with two straight wrenches. However, you will need to bleed them again (for the ?th time?).
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  #54  
Old 07-07-2011, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by ROLLGUY View Post
If you remove the injection lines, it is easy with two straight wrenches. However, you will need to bleed them again (for the ?th time?).
They are already removed
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  #55  
Old 07-10-2011, 11:18 PM
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Weekend Progress: Pulled valved cover, adjusted all valves back to spec.

Nothing changed, still not much pressure from the IP. So I decided to finally just pull the IP and replace it. It DID change something, now the engine is coughing strongly, but acts as if it is not properly timed.

Is there any way to set the IP timing, or to know what timing it is set to? I've seen the drip test but that is only useful if I am already near the timing mark.

How can I tell where to set the IP timing to?
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  #56  
Old 07-11-2011, 12:13 AM
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Set engine to 15 degrees after TDC.

With the pump removed, rotate the pump shaft until the 4th tooth on the driver after the tooth gap is in alignment with the mark on the pump body. So, the gap on the drive gear will be 4 teeth clockwise from the alignment mark.

You then lock the pump in place, with a tool that you don't have (601 589 05 21 00), through the access port toward the lower, rear, driver's side of the pump. Then install the pump.

I have not done this task on a 617.

When I did this on a 603, I could see the point on the IP cam through the access port with a mirror and know it was set correctly. I do not know if that is possible on a 617.
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  #57  
Old 07-11-2011, 01:08 AM
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Nineteen eighty 617 injection pumps before 84-85 do not have the timing tang to lock the pump before installing. You check it with the drip method to acertain if it is installed correctly.
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  #58  
Old 07-11-2011, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by barry123400 View Post
Nineteen eighty 617 injection pumps before 84-85 do not have the timing tang to lock the pump before installing. You check it with the drip method to acertain if it is installed correctly.
On a 617, the crank should be at TDC. The pump has a wide part in the splines, and that needs to be lined up with the mark on pump body (11:00 O-clock I think?). The haynes manual (available at most auto stores) has a good procedure for installing the pump. The drip test should be done after the pump is installed. You can make a drip test tube from an old injection line (as shown in the haynes manual).
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  #59  
Old 07-11-2011, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROLLGUY View Post
On a 617, the crank should be at TDC. The pump has a wide part in the splines, and that needs to be lined up with the mark on pump body (11:00 O-clock I think?). The haynes manual (available at most auto stores) has a good procedure for installing the pump. The drip test should be done after the pump is installed. You can make a drip test tube from an old injection line (as shown in the haynes manual).
Okay, that helps a lot. I'll do that this afternoon.

I have the crappy Chilton, which provides almost no information on timing the pump from scratch.

The top timing mark is the little notch on the top of the pump side like pictured in the attatched image?
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1980 300D sat for a year, won't start-images.jpg  
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  #60  
Old 07-11-2011, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CommieGIR View Post
Okay, that helps a lot. I'll do that this afternoon.

I have the crappy Chilton, which provides almost no information on timing the pump from scratch.

The top timing mark is the little notch on the top of the pump side like pictured in the attatched image?
Yes that is correct.
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