Asking this since I have the task of resurrecting a '79 TD, non-turbo and would like to keep the SLS functionality.

I have two potential donor motors. One is from a '80 116, the 300SD. The other is from an '81 300SD.

Is it possible to use the cylinder head (will require a remanufacture to some extent, so here's where I'd use turbo valves and guides)?


Thanks in advance all - 81126

To the best of my knowledge the actual casting is the same on both engines.

I know that the cam shafts on the turbo engine (OM617a) are different from the non turbo. The camshaft towers also have wider holes on the turbo to allow the larger cam lobes to slide through.

I'm pretty sure the rocker arms / cam followers are the same.

I think that the valves in the turbo are sodium filled => way more expensive than the non turbo ones.

__________________
1992 W201 190E 1.8 171,000 km - Daily driver
1981 W123 300D ~ 100,000 miles / 160,000 km - project car stripped to the bone
1965 Land Rover Series 2a Station Wagon CIS recovery therapy!
1961 Volvo PV544 Bare metal rat rod-ish thing

I'm here to chat about cars and to help others - I'm not here "to always be right" like an internet warrior



Don't leave that there - I'll take it to bits!

Probably a turbo head would work on a NA motor. I would not consider a NA head being put on a turbo motor.
BTW Army is right about the valves.

__________________
Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club group

I no longer question authority, I annoy authority. More effect, less effort....

1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
2001 jeep turbo diesel 130k miles
1998 jeep tdi ~ followed me home. Needs a turbo.
1968 Ford F750 truck. 6-354 diesel conversion.
Other toys ~J.D.,Cat & GM ~ mainly earth moving

I still dont understand why no one simply uses an external SLS pump from the W124... Some minor fabrication would be needed.

__________________
http://superturbodiesel.com/images/sig.04.10.jpg
1995 E420 Schwarz
1995 E300 Weiss
#1987 300D Sturmmachine
#1991 300D Nearly Perfect
#1994 E320 Cabriolet
#1995 E320 Touring
#1985 300D Sedan
OBK #42

X2
This is a simple solution !!!!!

__________________
Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club group

I no longer question authority, I annoy authority. More effect, less effort....

1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
2001 jeep turbo diesel 130k miles
1998 jeep tdi ~ followed me home. Needs a turbo.
1968 Ford F750 truck. 6-354 diesel conversion.
Other toys ~J.D.,Cat & GM ~ mainly earth moving

How did (do?) Citroens provide SLS pressure?

__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

There's a fair amount if information here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydropneumatic_suspension

__________________
1992 W201 190E 1.8 171,000 km - Daily driver
1981 W123 300D ~ 100,000 miles / 160,000 km - project car stripped to the bone
1965 Land Rover Series 2a Station Wagon CIS recovery therapy!
1961 Volvo PV544 Bare metal rat rod-ish thing

I'm here to chat about cars and to help others - I'm not here "to always be right" like an internet warrior



Don't leave that there - I'll take it to bits!

BMW's also had the same SLS as MB.

__________________
http://superturbodiesel.com/images/sig.04.10.jpg
1995 E420 Schwarz
1995 E300 Weiss
#1987 300D Sturmmachine
#1991 300D Nearly Perfect
#1994 E320 Cabriolet
#1995 E320 Touring
#1985 300D Sedan
OBK #42

Driven by timing chain, same as MB.

The bare non turbo head itself is the same. You'll have to change the cam, valve guides and exhaust valves.

...I had been looking at the pump on my SEC as a plan B...but good to know about the head - will be pulling it apart shortly, pics to come.

Considering ditching the climate control and doing a manual Klima system. Good source of donors. Not looking forward to getting under the dash I can tell you.

Just to clarify! You have a 79 123 wagon with a 300D non turbo engine.
You want to replace the engine with a 80 or 81 turbo engine and use the non turbo head on the turbo engine. Please correct me if i'am wrong.

The difference between a turbo and a non turbo head is the size of the pre chambers. Turbos have a 2mm larger diameter.
The pockets in the pistons for the pre chambers are different in both engines
and there is a good chance that the pre chamber will hit the piston.
But I'am not sure of that.
If you go ahead with the conversion you have to use the valves from the turbo engine.
If you want to do you self some good, use the cam, cam towers, rocker arms, valve springs, valves and adjustment nuts from the 81 turbo.
However, DO NOT use the turbo on this engine.
The non turbo pre chambers are not designed to take the additional heat.

Very good points 1960mog - I forgot about the post 1980 ish modifications made to the non turbo engines.

__________________
1992 W201 190E 1.8 171,000 km - Daily driver
1981 W123 300D ~ 100,000 miles / 160,000 km - project car stripped to the bone
1965 Land Rover Series 2a Station Wagon CIS recovery therapy!
1961 Volvo PV544 Bare metal rat rod-ish thing

I'm here to chat about cars and to help others - I'm not here "to always be right" like an internet warrior



Don't leave that there - I'll take it to bits!

Hi Army
I forgot about the post 1980 ish modifications too.
81162 can use the pre chambers from a post 80 non turbo.
Then he would not have any clearance issues with the pistons.
P.S.
How is the weather in your part of the woods?
Just asking because i am from Köln, Germany.

This spring was cold but probably one of the driest on record. Since about mid June there has hardly been a day without rain. There has been some serious rain - Asiatic Indian monsoon type stuff. Even the Dutch who are normally good at handling excess water problems have been struggling at bit.

Do you ever get back this way?

Oh and I forgot to ask why on earth did you choose to move to Las Vegas?

__________________
1992 W201 190E 1.8 171,000 km - Daily driver
1981 W123 300D ~ 100,000 miles / 160,000 km - project car stripped to the bone
1965 Land Rover Series 2a Station Wagon CIS recovery therapy!
1961 Volvo PV544 Bare metal rat rod-ish thing

I'm here to chat about cars and to help others - I'm not here "to always be right" like an internet warrior



Don't leave that there - I'll take it to bits!

Hey ARMY, Vegas is warm and dry.

Charlie

__________________
there were three HP ratings on the OM616...

1) Not much power
2) Even less power
3) Not nearly enough power!! 240D w/auto

Anyone that thinks a 240D is slow drives too fast.

80 240D Naturally Exasperated, 4-Spd 388k DD 150mph spedo 3:58 Diff

We are advised to NOT judge ALL Muslims by the actions of a few lunatics, but we are encouraged to judge ALL gun owners by the actions of a few lunatics. Funny how that works