I was going to do a quick test of the chain stretch, by lining up the timing marks and then seeing where they lined up on the crank.... but It seems to line up with the counter weight. when I turn the engine to the crank timing marks I see nothing to line up on the top...???

http://www.peachparts.com/Wikka/OM617TimingChainStretch


Go to step #10.

Yes, this is the guide I'm following. When I have the marks lined up on top, im not even close to the indicator on the bottom. I've tried to rotated the engine around a couple times to see if I could get it there but no go. Is it possible for my timing to be that far off?

See, When I have the timing marks here....

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...5&d=1313774609

At the crank I'm here.... (the crank weight before the one on the crank that has the timing marks)

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...8&d=1313776067

If I rotate the engine so I'm at 0 at the crank, my timing mark on the top is here....

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...7&d=1313774672

My next question would be that if it's this far off, how is my engine even running, let alone running as good as it is (less the knock)

You need to take a better photo of the crank...........the second photo is useless at the moment.

Fixed....

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/...8&d=1313776067

Being that I'm old, I cannot read the degree marks on the damper.

Maybe somebody else can read them...............;)

Thats the point... it's no where near the correct damper...let alone the marks... When the timing marks are lined up at the top of the engine, that's what you see on the crank...

If I turn the engine so that I'm on the correct marked damper, at zero, then the timing mark at the top of the engine is whereI show it in the 3rd picture.

The camshaft cannot be out by the amount indicated or the valves would hit the pistons on one of the strokes.

Apparently, some moron was involved with this engine and, therefore, all bets are off as to what was done.

You really don't have much choice but to procure the equipment to measure the chain via the 2mm valve lift method as indicted from the beginning of the procedure.

Hense the pounding noise it's making.....

So could I set the mark 2 zero on the crank, remove and rotate the top till the marks lined up and reassemble?

I'm going to run over to a friend that rebuilds diesels and see if he has a dial indicator I could borrow...

Pounding noise??

Conclusion based on a misalignment of some marks??

The camshaft pulley is keyed to the camshaft. You cannot rotate it.

Did you read and understand what I wrote in post 38?

ok, now I'm just confused... What's the point of the gauge If I can't alter the timing?

What I'm saying is to set to mark to zero on the damper, then remove the bolt from the cam pulley, and remove the chain, from it. then put it back on enough to rotate the pulley AND the cam to to line up the marks and put the chain back on.... Wouldn't that get me at least close?

And in all honesty, with the amount of time I've already spend messing with it, I could have pulled the motor and had another engine swapped in it's place by now...

The point of the gauge is to confirm or deny the data obtained from alignment of the marks. We don't believe the data from the marks is accurate because the engine won't run with the camshaft so far out of time with the crankshaft.

If you proceed with this approach, based solely upon your data from the marks, you're probably going to get into the "epic fail" mode........whereby return is almost impossible.

Hmmm............two hours of discussion and measurement and you could have swapped an entire engine............damn, you're good..........you're very good.

LOL... no, I've been playing with this since Saturday....

My questions then is this... The cam pulley is keyed to the camshaft right? So it can only go on one way. That means if I hold the chain in place, remove the cam pulley from the cam, remove the chain from it, while having the damper on the crank sitting at the zero mark, and rotate both the cam and the cam socket so they are alined with the timing marks, then mark that point and put the timing chain back on I should be relatively close to being at the correct time shouldn't I? I asked 4 different tool places in town while away, none of them had the gauge or even had a clue what I was talking about as far as looking one up... where would I get this gauge?

OP:
I gotta good running 617 I want to get rid of. If you decide that is the answer send me a pm.