Is this '84 300D (Non-Turbo?) worth the money?
 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=601050540
it's the same car..more pics here though
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=598433605

I drove over there to check it out because it didn't look that bad in the pictures.

My question is, do you guys think it's worth the money?
They also told me that it's a NonTurbo 300D.. but I thought all 300D's after a certain year were all turbocharged?

All four power windows work

What's wrong with the car?
1. Power Antenna is dead, dont know what it is. But, I dont think it's an expensive fix..
2. Central locking does not work, maybe vacuum leak?
3. Missing and loose wood trim (no big deal I think..)
4. The only minor rust spot that I could find was behind the Left rear fender, but it had been repaired.. (though still visible)
5. The engine takes a while to shut off - Again vacuum i guess.
6. Paint is not very good... could use a repaint.
8. The side mirror's motor is weak that it barely moves..
9. The engine must leak oil too cuz it was covered in oil..

I didn't get to drive it though, so I don't know about its transmission... The engine starts fine, and yes it was a cold start.. though it's been pretty mild today (about 50)

The body seems straight, how much do you guys think it's worth? Should I give this a shot or should I pass on it?
The interior is also considerably nice.. (considering its age)

Thanks
-Holson-

I don't understand this time frame... are these simply pics of the car back in Dec.. and you are looking at buying it from the winner of the auction? or am I getting the wrong url when I try to look at the pictures ?.. Whichever , I can not imagine a non turbo being fast enough to be safe integrating with traffic on an interstate... my turbo is marginal in the get up and go area between 20 and 40 .... other speeds it is great... but it has 120 hp to a non turbo's 80... just my opinion.... Greg

I dont understand either.. apparently both sellers are the same.. I just wonder why they have to use a different e-bay user to sell it again if they were the same...

apparently the winner last time did not take the car (they agreed - if u read the seller ratings) but, i was told that they winner ran away???

whatever...maybe I should run a carfax through..?

BTW, im fine w/ slow cars.. I drove a Hyundai 1.3 to Holbrook today.. and it was quite a pain (since the last car I drove was a Ford Taurus 3.0...)

LOL, hate to sound like a smart alec.... but maybe the winner assumed it was a turbo, and ran away fast (understandable in my opinion) when he determined it was not a turbo...LOL... greg

you could be right...

If it really is a non-turbo, I personally would pass and wait for something better. The car actually looks pretty good though in the pictures and it was my understanding that all 300D's after 1982 were turbo. I could be wrong of course. I for just a little more you could find a better example 300D with a turbo. Also, the turbo is what makes the car "fun" and it's what gives the car personality. Good luck. Get something you like and don't settle, even if it means waiting a bit.

Alex

Thanks Alex, and AMEN.

ditto...
when the right car shows itself you will definitely know it.

BTW, my buddy saw a 1985 300TD wagon in Boston last week. It had 42K original miles and was being driven by the original owner. My buddy followed him into a gas station and tried to buy it from him. He saw the right car and tried to buy it on the spot. The old fellow sent him on his way. He's still going on and on about it...

Your friend has the right idea...not "carpe diem" but "carpe automobilia"... that happens to be the model I am looking for also.... Greg

All US bound 300D's 1982+ were Turbo's. For the 300TD it was in 1981 they started getting Turbo's.

If that really is a 84 300D then it's a Euro rebadged or something to that effect. If it showed a picture of the other side of the Engine then I could tell you if it has a Turbo or not.

There are some inconsistencies.

According to the two ads, the mileage is going down instead of up.

The foglights in the front are the wrong color for 1984. (Maybe its just the lighting - they look yellower in the first ad.)

Trunklid obviously says "T-U-R-B-O-diesel". I would have walked them around to the back and asked them what that meant. :)

I can't make out an EGR valve on the engine in the first ad.

--------

It might be possibly a Euro engine dropped into a USA chassis.

Did you at least go for a ride in it with the seller?

I don't think its an unreasonable price. If you end up with it, before you hand over the check, make sure the VIN on the car plate behind the windshield and also the plate inside the driver's door actually match the TITLE. :)

The pictures in the two ads appear to be taken in the same spot, due to the green-colored chain-link fence. Same seller, new ID. Check out the feedback on the old ID, you may see why they re-registered.

Ken300D

They told me that it was a non-turbo while pointing at the Turbodiesel sign...
I was just like.. "?!@#". I don't think they knew much about the W123...

i just don't understand why they have to sell it using a different username..
I wonder what they'd say if I ask..the original winner left the feedback "both parties agreed to let go..." . But I was told that the guy just disappeared.

I ran the Carfax free check and it does say that it's a Turbodiesel..which also *I guess* ruled out the possibility that it was a Euro car...

"I don't think its an unreasonable price. If you end up with it, before you hand over the check, make sure the VIN on the car plate behind the windshield and also the plate inside the driver's door actually match the TITLE. " - Thanks Ken.. will note that.

BTW, do I really need to call a mechanic to inspect the car?

Just because it says turbo on the back of the car, it doesn't mean it has one. Lid could have been replaced. Otherwise I have an 85' 300D Euro non-turbo that's been imported privately. Runs well and has 206,000mi. Also has manual climate control (which was a minus new, but DEFFINATELY a plus now). Paid $3000 for her 4 years, 50,000 miles ago. Has been a good car.

First of all, it's not 80hp, it's 88. She's not at all slow; infact, at drag (if you could call it that), she easily beet a 84' turbo diesel from 0-60. Unless you have your turbo system working properly, it migh even be considered a hinderence (though I sometimes wish I had one). Remember, any 80's MB diesel is slow compared to a gas car. That's why my other car is a gas BMW turbo (strangely also a euro).

Adam

Let's just say that it actually is a non-turbo..
How much would you pay for it?

*I think the problems are quite typical for a 300D and not major...*

Straight body, engine that starts easily (though shuts off rather slowly), and working A/C and power windows...

Where do you get your 0-60 times?

According to Carfax, this car has roughly 30,000 less miles than it's last registration on 10/19/2001 in Medford, MA. Seems fishy. I looked at this car on ebay over a month ago. Beware! Don't you think the background looks like a junk yard? I does to me. They probably just swapped ODO's. Don't know who bought it, I hope it's not you.

Capt Kirk,
I speak from experience, not from book values. All thing being equal, a 300D turbo would cream a non-turbo; but since all things AREN'T equal, my car is way over-maintained, versus the MB I dragged which was not unlike the description of the car for sale/in question,put frankly, I easily beat him, and by no small margin. This really shut up my friend who always bragged how he had a turbo and I didn't. He gets worse economy too. I don't imagine the 0-60 time is far from 20 sec. in either car though.

Adam
ATLD

wow yellowmerc, thanks for running a Carfax through.. really appreciate it..
I guess I can forget about it and just keep waiting.. maybe I should save up some more and get a really nice one..

BTW, what does the part in the red outline do?
I don't think it was there.. and the mentioned 300D does have a different airbox to every other 300D's that i've seen..

Thanks BTW, I'm glad this forum existed..

The thing circled in red is the egr - exhaust gas recirculation valve. For "experimental" purposes only you can disconnect the vacuum line to it, plug the vacuum line and run it like that.
The 300D with the "different" air intake system is the California model.

What if it wasn't there?
Which part is the turbo?

Holson, how did you get the whole photo out of focus except the egr? that is good manipulation...what did you do?

Holson, the turbo is down behind and slightly to the rear of that egr, you can't see it well without taking the air cleaner off... or looking down a narrow slot there...

I just selected the EGR valve using one of PS6's tools (i dont know what it is) and when i right clicked on the selection (the egr) something called 'Select Inverse' showed up.. and after selecting the correct layer.. I just blurred it..

I'm pretty sure the Euro engines would not have an EGR valve like the one in the picture you posted. It sticks up in plain view on almost any shot of the engine compartment. The EGR valve is a "wonderful" USA invention designed with the intention of reducing harmful emissions.

Also, from what little I can see of the intake manifold and the air intake box (in the EBay ad), it does look like a non-turbo setup.

More and more it looks like a Euro engine dropped into a USA car.

That in itself is not necessarily a bad thing. However, a lot of other things about the car seem suspicious. Plus I would worry about the quality of the mechanical work done in swapping the engine.

It might run a long time - but they should be telling you the straight story behind the car.

$1500 tops.

Ken300D

http://members.aol.com/dsofa/mercedes/engine.jpg

That's a picture that I found on E-Bay on a 3.0L 5-Cyl non-turbo from a Euro car.. the engine sure looked like that.

if only they'd let me test drive it.. it'd be much more convincing..

I've bought two Mercedes diesels on EBay, and have been lucky to get good cars. In both cases, they were being sold by individuals rather than dealers. Also, in both cases, I paid a visit to see the car before actually closing the deal. I phrased this in the context of "verifying the car was accurately represented in the EBay ad, and to verify the VIN and clean title." An honest seller will have no problem with that.

During that visit in both cases I had the car started up and we went for a ride, with the owner driving. Believe me, a host of problems will be revealed in any test ride.

You do not want to buy a car where they will not at least drive you around a bit. I can see perhaps that they won't let people take the car themselves, but they simply HAVE to demonstrate that the car moves under its own power, has brakes, doesn't wobble, etc.

You are lucky to be close enough to go look at the car. That is a major factor in your advantage. In my two EBay purchases the cars were close by, allowing an inspection first before paying. I feel very sorry for people that buy a car on EBay and have it shipped to them! They must have lots of money to waste!

I'm expecting that you will learn a lot about this car as soon as it hits the road moving. If they don't want to demonstrate it for you on the road - AVOID IT.

Ken300D

yeah.. it's still quite far though.. I rented a car to look at it..
(I also need the car for a couple other things as well.. so I thought it was perfect timing.. but oh well..no perfect car..)

I think I'll just call them up and ask for a test drive or at least ride in it with them tomorrow before the auction closes.. if it's a tight car i might consider bidding ..
I think I'll also bring the carfax report.. see what they got to say about it.. they probably didnt know what actually happened before they bought it. They are an auto dealer and do have a lot of nice MB's and BMW's and even Rolls there.. so the 300D was like the ugliest of the bunch... :p
it's kinda weird that an established dealer is out to con people..

In the picture of the engine on the car in question - what is that brass colored tube running from the top of the filter housing - across the front of the engine and then down the side?


From the looks of it the PCV tube runs into the bottom of the intake.

http://images.autotrader.com/auctionimages/554657/04_WDBAB33AXEA115421_1006735529684.jpg


The brass colored tube running from the top of the air filter housing across the front of the engine, it's definately not an AC hose.

Sorry to sound stupid.. but is that how they shut off diesel engines?

ahh..... That does make sense - kinda. Wonder where that tube would be on my car, if it even has one.

Wow, that second picture looks strangely familiar. The first one has to be a turbo because the air filter of that size was only used for turbos in that year (if I remember correctly), I usually get handed that huge filter from my parts guy before I remind him my car is a Euro. Way before that, there were oil pool filters that looked completely different, but I don't think they were used this year. Also, it looks like there are two ducts from the air filter housing; a Non-T only has one, as it is directly connectted to the intake manifold below it.

Either way, might be worth the trouble.

just my $.02

ATLD

TXBill, What condition is it in? How much is it selling for?

What's the latest? Are you still bidding? Or did you decide to pass. I have the same delima. I'm looking at a 85 300D in Ga. They are asking $4995. That's to much, but after I drive it today, I might make an offer.

TXBILL,
Me, perhaps.
Is it in the Philly area?
Year, mileage, condition, etc.?

Adam
ATLD

ATLD,

You mentioned that your other car is a turbo BMW. Is it a gas engine? I was under the impression that BMW never puts turbos on their gas engines.

If it is the 524TD, than I get it. I've been looking at getting one of those also!

I think this time I'm going to pass on the car.... as I was going to drive down to Holbrook for that test drive.. guess what? the Boston Parking Department or something like that .. locked one of the front wheels of the Hyundai.. apparently whoever rented it b4 me left mad tickets unpaid...

the rental company gave me a replacement car.. which is better in fact.. but I might not have time anymore..

I guess that kinda means that I am not supposed to get it... oh well...

thanks for all the help.. ill just keep saving up... this time I think I'm gonna aim for a 300E instead... or a W124..

Silverfishk8,
I may have misled you, coinsidering this is "diesel discussion," but it is a gas BMW. It is a 85' 745i Executive 1A. It is also a Euro car and BMW's flagship of that year. The car has a KKK turbocharged and fuel injected 3.5L M102 engine with more computers than Apollo 13. The designation 745i refers to the calculated theoretical displacement of a naturally aspired engine, but it's actually 3.5 liters. Other than that it's almost the same as a US 735i, other than a slightly different front end, and much more luxurious interior. It is relatively rare, but they do exist. They were m,anufactured from 82' - 87' and around 1000 or so have been US imported.

The only other turbocharged BMWs are the very rare 2002 turbos (I think).

Here's a good link.
http://members.aol.com/turbo745i/

ATLD
Adam T. L. Delecki