ARGH !!!! --- HELP --- Ignition Tumbler URGENT --- 300SDL

[daw_two]

Okay, so this old man is having trouble this morning......well, it started yesterday. Key was getting tough to turn. No problem, right? I already have a replacement ignition tumbler with a new master key. So, driving home, I'm doing the process in my head.....with the key in position 1, insert the perfect BIG paper clip in....line up the holes that you can't see....then turn the key counter clockwise and the tumbler comes out.

So, I get home and as soon as I step out of the car....wife tells me when she tries to start the lawnmower all it does is belch out big puffs of black smoke. Well, now, I have to fix the lawnmower first. So turn the car off and change clothes. After several attempts to start the lawnmower....it belches big puffs of black/blue smoke....I'm thinking she might have put oil in the gasoline tank. Then I remember....she called me this past Saturday looking for gasoline in the storage room. Ding, Ding, Ding. I bet she put diesel in the lawnmower. Open the gas cap, and sure enough. I have her come to the storage room so she can show me which plastic container she poured from --- yep, the small amount of diesel I have at the house. So, I send her to the store to get gasoline since we are out.....while I drain the diesel. She gets back and I put gasoline in it; fires up with a few hiccups and I tell her to go cook dinner and I will mow the front yard. See where this is going? So, naturally I forgot about the key last night.

So, this morning....got to do the key. Well, darn. I can't get the tumbler out. After a bunch of reaches, all I see is the black ring around the tumbler is suppose to come out with the tumbler.

Problem: The black ring is not moving. I've got the pin in there and can spin the tumbler all around ....but the black ring around the outside edge of the tumbler stays put -- does not move.

WHAT am I doing wrong? I really want to replace this BEFORE I start the car and go to work.

EDIT: Well, I've spun the tumbler all around again and out of frustration have taken a pair of pliers to the trim. The Black Collar will not budge. I've got the car started and I'm off to work.

[kerry]

Will the black ring move at all? Typically if the dog is not depressed, the ring will move a little bit in either direction. I'm guessing the paper clip is not depressing the dog. Use a small jeweler's screwdriver instead.

[daw_two]

Originally Posted by kerry

Will the black ring move at all? Typically if the dog is not depressed, the ring will move a little bit in either direction. I'm guessing the paper clip is not depressing the dog. Use a small jeweler's screwdriver instead.

The black ring will just barely jiggle but that's without the dog depressed.

I'm sure I have the dog depressed because when I get the BIG paper clip end inserted, I can move the tumbler all the way around. This morning, I was spinning the tumbler around and the key came out. I even tried needle nose pliers in the tumbler to try to pull it out.....thinking the black collar could be stuck. No luck.

I'm at work now.....with this kind of dash opening

[kerry]

I'm looking at the spare assembly I have. If the paper clip is depressing the dog, the tumbler CANNOT turn because the paper clip would stop it. The dog is in a part of the key/tumbler assembly that cannot turn. It's locked into a notch in the ignition switch assembly. So if the clip is actually in the dog assembly, the clip would be 'attached' to the whole ignition assembly, stopping the key portion from turning. I think your paper clip is not going in far enough. Have you shone a flashlight into the paper clip slot and seen the little tiny hole it must go into? The pin has to go in about a half inch in order to push the dog down. In my experience, the steel in a paper clip is not actually rigid enough to pull down the dog. The steel just bends. Hence my recommendation of a jeweler's hardened screwdriver.

[daw_two]

Hey Kerry.

I could shine a light in there.....but for me to see a tiny hole in that dark pit, I'd need to put my 350 glasses on and get really close to it.

I'm reading where others have used an allen wrench or a drill bit to put in the hole. I'm going to try that approach when I get home this afternoon. Also, my tumbler might be "outward" too far, so it's not catching the collar. One forum member has PM'ed to try pressing my tumbler BACK into the lock mechanism and start the process over. Also, someone has suggested putting a rubber hose over the collar.

So, I've got lots of ideas to pursue later.

[kerry]

The tumbler goes into an assembly which in turn goes into the ignition switch housing. The tumbler can turn within the assembly but the whole assembly CANNOT turn inside the ignition switch housing. The dog is part of the assembly and not part of the tumbler. When the paper clip/screwdriver/drill bit is pushed into the hole in the dog, the tumbler and assembly are locked together. At that point, the tumbler cannot turn because the assembly is locked in place into a notch in the ignition switch housing and the clip is in the notch in the tumbler.
I found it hard to locate that hole in the dog into which the clip must enter. It is only the size of a paper clip. Without looking closely in the notch as you turn the key around, it's easy to push the clip in the wrong location.

[daw_two]

Originally Posted by kerry

The tumbler goes into an assembly which in turn goes into the ignition switch housing. The tumbler can turn within the assembly but the whole assembly CANNOT turn inside the ignition switch housing. The dog is part of the assembly and not part of the tumbler. When the paper clip/screwdriver/drill bit is pushed into the hole in the dog, the tumbler and assembly are locked together. At that point, the tumbler cannot turn because the assembly is locked in place into a notch in the ignition switch housing and the clip is in the notch in the tumbler.
I found it hard to locate that hole in the dog into which the clip must enter. It is only the size of a paper clip. Without looking closely in the notch as you turn the key around, it's easy to push the clip in the wrong location.

Got it!!!! Thanks!!! Small drill bit, allen wrench, or jeweler's screwdriver will be called in to help.

[Brian Carlton]

Originally Posted by daw_two

Got it!!!! Thanks!!! Small drill bit, allen wrench, or jeweler's screwdriver will be called in to help.

The jeweler's screwdriver is strongly preferred as it can provide leverage to the tang that must be depressed. You insert the screwdriver and pull the handle outward and the tip depresses the tang.

This approach doesn't work as well with the small drill bit or the allen wrench as you're depending on the exact size of these items and you're also depending on your external hand force to drive them into the perfect space to depress the tang. None of this is assured without the perfect sized tool.

Remember, you must keep pressure on the tang during the entire removal process of the black collar. If you don't, the collar will stop every 1/2 turn and hit the tang again. Again, the jeweler's screwdriver is your friend for this procedure.

[daw_two]

So, at lunch....drive to the bank for CASH --- you all DON'T want to know; at least, not yet.

Then out to the see the shop guy to see if he has a small allen wrench or drill bit. He does, but they are too big. He wiggles the tumbler around and concludes the BIG paper clip just isn't stiff enough. He starts looking thru toolbox drawers, then goes into his office and get one of those paper clips that looks like a pretzel. Guess what? It's too big. No problem, right? I take the grinder to it and trim it down a bit.

I go out to the car and futzs with the lock. Then, I have the key STUCK. It won't turn either way and I don't have the paper clip in it. Oh, brother. Now what? Get a ride back to the office? Then I just thought to try the black collar. Guess what? It starts unscrewing! OH, so it doesn't pull out; it unscrews. So, I guess my last paper clip attempt got the holes lined up and then it stayed depressed.

I unscrewed the whole black collar; then removed the key. Anyone have an ignition tumbler break apart like this?



Anyway, got the new ignition tumbler inside the black collar and re-installed. All is well. I'm hoping the ignition switch is good for another 25 years.

[vstech]

where's the headsmack smiley?

I'm sure we all thought you were trying to unscrew it... I did.

glad you got it figured out.