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  #1  
Old 08-03-2012, 01:58 AM
Oldschoolbenz
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 23
86' 300SDL - 4 yr nap recovery!

HI,

First benz for us just inherited from my Dad as my son's first car - and we need to rececitate it after a 4 yr nap!

Quick history:
1. Parked last 4 yrs, didn't move an inch - no prep for storage at all (i.e. 4yr deisel).
2. Still running 4 yrs ago - but a little on the rough side - PO suspected bad diesel but no data exists to suppport this.
2. Tank registers just under half full - bummer thats a lot to drain.
4. Car has 225k on it but enine was replaced by PO with a wrecker engine - no data on miles pedigree, etc.


Recover efforts so far:
1. Cleaned engine so we can see it
2. Replaced injector return lines (were leaking like drip drip drip).
3. Drained engine oil as plug was leaking (drip, drip, drip) - seal surface on pan may be damaged (how does one do that!!!!!!) will inspect further.
4. Purchased new battery - no power to car yet.
5. Purchased 4 each new primary/secondary fuel filters (anticipation).

So the question is how to best deal with the fuel situation or anything else on recovery i should be doing?

A. Should i try to start and see what happens, or will doing so potentially plug injectors?
B. Run until filters clog and change.
C. Draining tank and lines first is imperative, do this w/o question?

Thanks is andvance for any advice/reccomendations. I have read some of the threads on tank removale / tank screen cleaning.
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  #2  
Old 08-03-2012, 02:19 AM
dude99's Avatar
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 1,354
I personally wouldn't worry about the old diesel. Diesel, unlike gas, tends not to gum up and deteriorate as badly.
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2003 Volvo V70 5 Speed
1997 E290 Turbo Diesel Wagon -traded for above, an amazingly comfortable car to drive, great drivetrain, but the rust, oh my god the rust
1992 BMW 525i -traded in
1990 Silver 300TE -Sold Loved the wagon, hated the M103
1985 Grey 380SE Diesel Conversion, 2.47 rear end, ABS -Sold, really should have kept this one
1979 Silver 300D "The Silver Slug" -Sold
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  #3  
Old 08-03-2012, 03:38 AM
Hit Man X's Avatar
I LOVE BRUNETTES
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: FUNKYTOWN
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Thumbs up

I would crank it over with a hand held starter to build oil pressure, before letting it try to run on its own. Also, check all of the glow plugs to make sure they work. A simple ohm test works well enough.

If you do need some/all... remove the cruise servo. This makes doing five of the six a breeze.



Aside from that, make sure it has coolant and ATF in the trans. Check to see the air inlet to the turbocharger is clear (no rodent houses).
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I'm not a doctor, but I'll have a look.

'85 300SD 244k
'87 300SDL 251k
'90 300SEL 325k
'91 560SEL 189k

Eight others from IH, BMW, GM, Ford, and Volvo.

Liberty will not descend to a people; a people must raise themselves to liberty.
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  #4  
Old 08-03-2012, 07:06 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 33,045
If you suspect there is water and bacteria in the fuel treat it with biocide the day before you want to start it. Otherwise I agree with the fellows above....nothing to fear except bacteria.

Once the bacteria is killed it should run through the filters, but if you suspected fuel issues four years ago probably would be good to start by changing the fuel and air filters.

Good luck!
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual. It still needs upholstery redone...I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #5  
Old 08-03-2012, 07:15 AM
Hit Man X's Avatar
I LOVE BRUNETTES
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: FUNKYTOWN
Posts: 9,030
Thumbs up

Hell, that brings up a good idea... just start it on a separate tank of fuel if there are concerns about the tank.
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I'm not a doctor, but I'll have a look.

'85 300SD 244k
'87 300SDL 251k
'90 300SEL 325k
'91 560SEL 189k

Eight others from IH, BMW, GM, Ford, and Volvo.

Liberty will not descend to a people; a people must raise themselves to liberty.
[/IMG]
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  #6  
Old 08-03-2012, 08:42 AM
Posting since Jan 2000
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 5,257
Absolutely try to start it. Old diesel, unlike gas will burn fine. It is only light oil to start with.

If it were me, I would have started it on the old oil & then brought it to temperature before draining it. That gets a LOT more junk out of the crankcase. I hope you used a diesel specific oil like Delo, Delvac or Rotella T. Run the engine a few hundred miles on this oil and then do a hot, extended oil drain. Letting it drain overnight wouldn't hurt.

After you've sorted it out a little, change the anti freeze.

Good luck with it. My son & my daughter's first car was a high mileage Benz diesel. Makes a good first car.

Keep us posted.
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  #7  
Old 08-03-2012, 11:54 AM
daw_two's Avatar
diesel enthusiast
 
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Location: Germantown, TN
Posts: 5,434
8 easy steps.....

I've been on this forum for about 5.5 years and have brought a few cars back to life. Here's what I would do:
  1. I would manually turn the engine over several times to be sure it was not locked up. If not locked up, then proceed to next step.
  2. Inspect the air passages for foreign objects.
  3. Change the oil and oil filter --- I would drain the old oil out of it. Then refill with "used oil" with 4-5K miles from one of my running vehicles. If the vehicle starts....I'd run it up to temperature on the used oil; then change it to new oil if the engine is sound. I just don't like to even start an engine on old oil that's been setting for years absorbing moisture. Granted, if I lived in a desert, I'd have a different opion on this.
  4. I would check all the linkages on the injection pump/accelerator to be sure they were "free" --- not binding on anything.
  5. Inspect the primary fuel filter --- if really dirty; then I would hook up a jug of clean diesel; if reasonablely clean, then I wouldn't bother.
  6. Then while leaving the air filter cleaner off....I'd have a way to SMOTHER the engine; board, big phone book, metal plate, etc. "Runaway" does happen sometimes on initial startups!! I KNOW.
  7. Then I would crank the engine over a few times without letting it start.....I think holding down the STOP button will accomplish this if the vacuum components are working. After getting some oil pressure ....
  8. Start the engine.
Good Luck and be sure to post some pics. We like to see pics of cars that have come back to life.
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daw_two
Germantown, TN

Links:
Current Car --- 05/2012 1984 300D Light Ivory, Red interior
Cluster Needles Paint
New Old Stock (NOS) parts

Past:
3/2008 1986 300SDL "Coda"
04/2010 1965 190D(c) "Ben"
& many more
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  #8  
Old 08-04-2012, 02:45 AM
Oldschoolbenz
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 23
Thanks great info.

The drain plug surface has a defect, a tunnel about 5mm in depth into the surface - hence the leak. I've never seen this before. I think filling it is the only option - though i can't imagine an epoxy resting the copper washer squeeze. Any ideas?

Is there a way to inspect for a fungi presnence. Like stick a coathanger in the tank and see what comes out?

If present what biocide is reccomended?

Thanks again.

Paul
Attached Thumbnails
86' 300SDL - 4 yr nap recovery!-img-20120803-01485.jpg   86' 300SDL - 4 yr nap recovery!-img-20120803-01482.jpg  

Last edited by Oldschoolgwin; 08-04-2012 at 02:57 AM. Reason: add pic
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  #9  
Old 08-04-2012, 07:06 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 33,045
There are kits available for repairing such a defect by inserting in the hold a new threaded insert and using a new drain plug probably.

I would get a good used lower pan and replace it.
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual. It still needs upholstery redone...I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #10  
Old 08-04-2012, 02:08 PM
Registered User
 
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Posts: 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
I would get a good used lower pan and replace it.
Ha! If only. No "lower pan" on a 603A. It's $500, and on a 124 or 126 requires pulling the engine to change.

Given the oily porosity, any adhesive (silicone, epoxy, etc) will be pretty near impossible to successfully utilize. Since the defect is "almost" under the drain plug, try using a larger aluminum or copper sealing washer; you may have to make your own.
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2003 Buick Regal
1983 300D (228k, frau Auto)
1996 Suburban K2500 (192k, 6.5 turbo diesel/4WD towmaster 10,000)
www.engineeringworks.biz
1987 300SDL junker 170k
1982 300SD junker, 265k
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  #11  
Old 08-05-2012, 12:13 AM
Oldschoolbenz
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 23
Update

Update

1. Found an oversize flange oil plug that may have fixed that issue. I did not add oil to the filter canister - maybe that would be a good idea?
2, New battery installed.
2. Changed oil filter and replaced oil 7 quarts for now.
3. Turned engine over by crank bolt to see that it was not siezed or liquid locked - found this to be a great job for my son, must have turned it over 10 to 15 times and then it came to a sudden stop - felt like a liquid lock. Reversed rotation - went forward felt a bit of a toggle but went past it (that was odd) went 2 or 3 revolutions - same thing again.

Any idea what this engine lock is? High risk on a start up? I can't imagine it was a liquid lock - it would seem to not go away. It did cross my mind that we are building diesel in the cylinders as there is not enough velocity to blow the unburned diesel out (assuming diesel is going into injectors<

Thanks.
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  #12  
Old 08-05-2012, 01:30 AM
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Location: San Luis Obispo, CA
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I am not familiar with your car specifically, but in general, it is strongly recommended that you never turn these engines backwards. I was just a bit worried when I read "reversed rotation." Others here can advise you better than myself, but I wanted to notify you as soon as possible to avoid possible damage.

As an aside, I suspect you are just feeling the compression of the engine. Maybe one of your cylinders has better compression than the others, so you are feeling the resistance of only that cylinder on its compression stroke. Again, others can advise you best.
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  #13  
Old 08-05-2012, 02:42 AM
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Posts: 342
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldschoolgwin View Post
I did not add oil to the filter canister - maybe that would be a good idea?
Without the filter in place, the oil will just leak back into the pan, anyway. The pump will fill it quickly--just watch for oil pressure within about 5 seconds of startup. Though probably you'll be cranking it long enough to build good pressure before it starts.
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James Marriott
2003 Buick Regal
1983 300D (228k, frau Auto)
1996 Suburban K2500 (192k, 6.5 turbo diesel/4WD towmaster 10,000)
www.engineeringworks.biz
1987 300SDL junker 170k
1982 300SD junker, 265k
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  #14  
Old 08-05-2012, 06:10 AM
Oldschoolbenz
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: USA
Posts: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shortsguy1 View Post
I am not familiar with your car specifically, but in general, it is strongly recommended that you never turn these engines backwards. I was just a bit worried when I read "reversed rotation." Others here can advise you better than myself, but I wanted to notify you as soon as possible to avoid possible damage.
Thanks for the heads up.

This interference bothers me - felt more like a hard stop rather and definately not regular compression building.

Before attempted start I need to resolve this. Do you recomend pulling the cam cover and checking the cam timing wrt crank and or IJ?

Thanks,

Paul
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  #15  
Old 08-05-2012, 08:44 AM
daw_two's Avatar
diesel enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Germantown, TN
Posts: 5,434
Used oil pan

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoiseBenz View Post
Ha! If only. No "lower pan" on a 603A. It's $500, and on a 124 or 126 requires pulling the engine to change.

Given the oily porosity, any adhesive (silicone, epoxy, etc) will be pretty near impossible to successfully utilize. Since the defect is "almost" under the drain plug, try using a larger aluminum or copper sealing washer; you may have to make your own.
I actually have a used oil pan. Send me a PM if you want it. I thought the engine can be raised for replacement.
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daw_two
Germantown, TN

Links:
Current Car --- 05/2012 1984 300D Light Ivory, Red interior
Cluster Needles Paint
New Old Stock (NOS) parts

Past:
3/2008 1986 300SDL "Coda"
04/2010 1965 190D(c) "Ben"
& many more
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