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  #16  
Old 08-16-2012, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chasinthesun View Post
I 2nd post 4 ,if fuel is being slowed by filters ,and the tank filter is the summertime wonder because of algea ,youll have this same issue.Start simple and work your way up.
It's not algae. It can be fungi, bacterium, some other biological thing, but algae requires light.

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  #17  
Old 08-16-2012, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Carlton View Post
This is rather interesting.

If you measured the boost properly, and hopefully at the ALDA line, the ALDA will be seeing 13 psi boost. Therefore, there is no possiblity of clogged fittings or bad lines or any other issue other than an ALDA that doesn't respond to boost.

That being said, I find it very surprising that the turbo can actually make 13psi without the additional fuel provided by the ALDA. I would suspect that the 13 psi, if accurate, must occur very high in the rpm range............probably above 4000 rpm or more. This would indicate that you definitely are not getting the fuel from the ALDA although it does see the boost pressure from the turbo.

The fastest check you can possibly make is to simply remove the ALDA and take it for a drive. You may find that all issues disappear if the ALDA is the culprit.
Yes Brian C, what you say is correct. see more details below, but boost is accurate as far as I can tell. ALDA line is clean. 12PSI or so, at 3000 RPM. I feel as you say, ALDA is not responding or if it is there is no impact for some reason.
  • My boost gauge is ported into the intake manifold at one of the unused plugs just forward of where the ALDA line takes it's pressure signal (but not the ALDA line itself). I believe my measures are accurate.
  • I am running the gsxr wastegate mod pressure line also from the intake but that line I have T'd into the ALDA supply line (I saw others do this, seems fine all connections are clamped down, good hose etc.
  • Thus as Brian C mentions, the ALDA has to be seeing the same pressure as my boost gauge (not that is matters but so is the wastegate pressure actuator line since it is T'd here).
  • I had previously removed the port fitting on the intake that supplies the ALDA pressure and made sure it was cleaned from the intake gunk. It had the typical intake goo but was not clogged , but I cleaned it out good as well as the tubing going to the ALDA. It seems to me that the ALDA has to be getting 12-13 psi, no question. Whether it is doing anything with that air, that is not answered yet of course. I will remove it to see.
  • Important details just in case anyone wonders if the wastegate mod I did is causing my issue: I did the wastegate mod, because I totally lost all turbo boost in the old vac wastegate/electronic control factory setup. That was my first sign of the problem with the original set up. This is NOT just post wastegate modification. Meaning I don't believe this has anything to do with my wsategate modification. I think that modifications is well done and working as it should. Without that and the OEM set-up on the turbo, the computer was not allowing any boost to happen is my guess.
  • The boost is something above 10-12 psi, sometimes 13. I hvae the pressure wastegate set up so it begins to open the wastegate (dump the exhaust that is) at 14 psi. This boost is at around 2800-3000 RPM. Not sure the car will hit anywhere close to 4K RPM the way it runs. It just doesn't seem to be able to get up to the high RPM's even when not under a heavy load. Hard to describe in writing. Just a dog is the best way I can describe. I can feel the turbo helping a little at the lower speeds but not anything like it should.
  • The car runs great on the flat or downhill with built up momentum and NOT up any hills. Will cruise along at 80+ mph no problem. Takes awhile (maybe 1/2 to 3/4 of a mile just guessing) to get to 80mph is the problem. Any hills, total loss of speed. Boost pressure begins to wain way down, no no throttle response whatsoever, car slows just generally feels like the engine has nothing to offer. No smoke either, not even a light puff of anything.
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  #18  
Old 08-16-2012, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benmack1 View Post
I will remove it to see.
We await with anticipation.
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  #19  
Old 08-16-2012, 10:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Carlton View Post
We await with anticipation.
Yes...we love ALDA transformation stories!
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  #20  
Old 08-17-2012, 11:32 AM
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It forms before it hits your tank ,may need to look who Im buying diesel from..
http://dieselfueldoctor.com/solutions_explained.html
To clear things up a bit.

Last edited by chasinthesun; 08-17-2012 at 11:44 AM.
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  #21  
Old 08-17-2012, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chasinthesun View Post
It forms before it hits your tank ,may need to look who Im buying diesel from..
Diesel Fuel Doctor, Algae-x diesel fuel solutions, Recovering Diesel Fuel Quality
To clear things up a bit.
and according to the page... it's not even microbes or bacteria... it is just broken down fuel... asphalt...

"Many people think this material is some sort of microbe, thus in the marine industry, it is most commonly called "algae". While bacteria and other microbes contribute to and accelerate this process, sludge is no more bacteria than milk that has turned into cottage cheese - it's still milk, only in a physically different form -- Diesel fuel forms wax and asphalt, not "algae"."
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  #22  
Old 08-17-2012, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by benmack1 View Post
[LIST][*]Thus as Brian C mentions, the ALDA has to be seeing the same pressure as my boost gauge
This is an inference you draw but it isn't actually verified. T'ng the boost gauge into the alda line to verify would confirm the inference.
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  #23  
Old 08-17-2012, 12:49 PM
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Originally Posted by benmack1 View Post
[*]My boost gauge is ported into the intake manifold at one of the unused plugs just forward of where the ALDA line takes it's pressure signal (but not the ALDA line itself). I believe my measures are accurate.
Not valid.

Before you do anything else, connect the boost gauge to the line that goes directly to the ALDA. You'll need to use a "T".
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  #24  
Old 08-17-2012, 08:59 PM
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Not done yet, BUT I removed the ALDA. That did it. Hoooollllllyyyyyy Shhhhhh*******ttttttt. Wow, now I have power. I could actually tell just from the low speed pep coming out of my driveway. Just felt solid, never as before. Touch the throttle and BAM - power. Not sure I am at the 12 sec 0-60 but totally different car. Even more boost on the gauge (probably 14 psi without trying hitting the boost wastegate dump pressure easily).

So now I have to figure out what's exactly the issue with the ALDA or the line to the ALDA. I have a few specific questions.

1) First the obvious question. I know some do this, but with my specific car (93, 2.5 with the turbo wastegate modification) can I just leave the ALDA off? Man, I don't want to put it back, this car is awesome now. What do I need to be careful of? Do I risk doing motor damage or grenading the thing with this ALDA off set up???


2) My set up on the 1993 has a line directly from the intake to a T that goes to the ALDA and a black plastic line that I think goes to a pressure sensor for the computer just in front of the battery on the passenger side of the car. Since I have the wastegate changeover, I assume that pressure sensor no longer has a function for anything??? Is that a true statement? Can I eliminate that line from the ALDA T and just simply run a clean new single hose from the intake to the ALDA to try and simplify this whole plumbing for the ALDA (the 93 doesn't seem to have the switchover/overboost protection in the ALDA line. I know other W124's have different vac/pressure diagrams from my reading, this one is simpler I think as of the late 92's if I am not mistaken). I assume that pressure sensor was to kill the boost via the turbo in overpressure situations but that is just my thinking, I haven't read that anywhere.

3) I will try to get a boost read on the ALDA line itself when I reinstall (if I have to reinstall ). I take folks comments that that line could have been a problem I guess since my boost read was from a different place off the intake. I will look closer at that the next chance I get. Since there is a T and that pressure sensor line, something could have been leaking my pressure there I totally see your points on that.

4) It was just about dusk when I test drove so I couldn't tell if I had smoke or not, but I don't think it was smoking at all. I had a ton of boost air so maybe it's burning all the fuel.

5) I was reading that shifting could be a problem once the ALDA is removed. It seemed to shift OK, but I need to drive under more normal conditions I guess. I was standing on it tonight. Anyone have problems with shifting after playing with the ALDA?

6) I can try this but may as well ask before I screw it up. Since the ALDA is now sitting on my workbench, can I test the ALDA itself with my mityvac (on pressure setting of course). Should I be able to see the ALDA collapse by testing? Will I risk damaging it by trying to make it work by hand?
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  #25  
Old 08-17-2012, 11:04 PM
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That is OUTSTANDING! Fun to have a new car, isn't it? I'll wait for some who are knowledgeable to chime in, but I'm very interested in how it works out for you as I have two of these....a 91 and a 92, both with ALDAs still intact.

Quote:
Originally Posted by benmack1 View Post
Not done yet, BUT I removed the ALDA. That did it. Hoooollllllyyyyyy Shhhhhh*******ttttttt. Wow, now I have power. I could actually tell just from the low speed pep coming out of my driveway. Just felt solid, never as before. Touch the throttle and BAM - power. Not sure I am at the 12 sec 0-60 but totally different car. Even more boost on the gauge (probably 14 psi without trying hitting the boost wastegate dump pressure easily).

So now I have to figure out what's exactly the issue with the ALDA or the line to the ALDA. I have a few specific questions.

1) First the obvious question. I know some do this, but with my specific car (93, 2.5 with the turbo wastegate modification) can I just leave the ALDA off? Man, I don't want to put it back, this car is awesome now. What do I need to be careful of? Do I risk doing motor damage or grenading the thing with this ALDA off set up???


2) My set up on the 1993 has a line directly from the intake to a T that goes to the ALDA and a black plastic line that I think goes to a pressure sensor for the computer just in front of the battery on the passenger side of the car. Since I have the wastegate changeover, I assume that pressure sensor no longer has a function for anything??? Is that a true statement? Can I eliminate that line from the ALDA T and just simply run a clean new single hose from the intake to the ALDA to try and simplify this whole plumbing for the ALDA (the 93 doesn't seem to have the switchover/overboost protection in the ALDA line. I know other W124's have different vac/pressure diagrams from my reading, this one is simpler I think as of the late 92's if I am not mistaken). I assume that pressure sensor was to kill the boost via the turbo in overpressure situations but that is just my thinking, I haven't read that anywhere.

3) I will try to get a boost read on the ALDA line itself when I reinstall (if I have to reinstall ). I take folks comments that that line could have been a problem I guess since my boost read was from a different place off the intake. I will look closer at that the next chance I get. Since there is a T and that pressure sensor line, something could have been leaking my pressure there I totally see your points on that.

4) It was just about dusk when I test drove so I couldn't tell if I had smoke or not, but I don't think it was smoking at all. I had a ton of boost air so maybe it's burning all the fuel.

5) I was reading that shifting could be a problem once the ALDA is removed. It seemed to shift OK, but I need to drive under more normal conditions I guess. I was standing on it tonight. Anyone have problems with shifting after playing with the ALDA?

6) I can try this but may as well ask before I screw it up. Since the ALDA is now sitting on my workbench, can I test the ALDA itself with my mityvac (on pressure setting of course). Should I be able to see the ALDA collapse by testing? Will I risk damaging it by trying to make it work by hand?
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  #26  
Old 08-18-2012, 06:58 AM
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As to risk with the ALDA off, AFAIK the only risk is if the wastegate hose were to fail then you'd have an overboost situation. (Perhaps Brian can give you more details). I assume this is still intact with your mod. With some cars this is a metal line (like on my SDL) so no risk of breaking. Haven't been able to identify it on my 91 or 92. If you can identify it, perhaps you can help me find mine.
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14 E250 Bluetec "Sinclair", Palladium Silver on Black, 153k miles
06 E320 CDI "Rutherford", Black on Tan, 171k mi, Stage 1 tune, tuned TCU
91 300D "Otis", Smoke Silver, 142k mi, wastegate conversion

19 Honda CR-V EX 61k mi
Fourteen other MB's owned and sold
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  #27  
Old 08-18-2012, 08:00 AM
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amazingly powerful vehicles with the alda off aren't they... congratulations! the problem with it off is all the black smoke and the speeding tickets. with fuel prices creeping higher and higher, I'd hook it back up, after the line is confirmed clean... I might open her up a 1/4 turn though.

I think all the turbo diesels have the obp valve... the line that's going to the other place should be going to the flying blue saucer... and it's job is to boost vacuum signal to the transmission for shift stability. I'll check my parts car 93 to be sure...
I would not test the alda, I'd test the pressure line feeding the alda to be CERTAIN it's totally clear of gunk. you have a boost gauge, if you are going to drive without the alda, you shoud invest in a pyrometer.
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John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread
"as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do!

My drivers:
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!!

1987 300TD
1987 300TD
1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere!
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  #28  
Old 08-18-2012, 08:03 AM
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On the black smoke issue, on my ALDA-less SDL I have learned (to the point where it's second nature) how not to emit smoke. As long as I'm easy on the pedal below about 2400 rpm, I really have no problems.
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06 E320 CDI "Rutherford", Black on Tan, 171k mi, Stage 1 tune, tuned TCU
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19 Honda CR-V EX 61k mi
Fourteen other MB's owned and sold
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  #29  
Old 08-18-2012, 08:16 AM
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I do not know if this helps or not but I have a 92 W124 that had great power and then suddenly lost significantly - we did the gsxr mod and I removed the ALDA and the plunger is moving properly in response to pressure applied at the air (boost ) port. Fuel supply is good throughout the system up to the injection pump.... at this point I suspect the injection pump itself unless there is internal timing in the injection pump that can be adjusted or repaired.. I do not know if this experience reflects on your situation but as your description sounds very similar I thought I would add my two cents.

best regards
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  #30  
Old 08-18-2012, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by vstech View Post
amazingly powerful vehicles with the alda off aren't they... congratulations! the problem with it off is all the black smoke and the speeding tickets. with fuel prices creeping higher and higher, I'd hook it back up, after the line is confirmed clean... I might open her up a 1/4 turn though.

I think all the turbo diesels have the obp valve... the line that's going to the other place should be going to the flying blue saucer... and it's job is to boost vacuum signal to the transmission for shift stability. I'll check my parts car 93 to be sure...
I would not test the alda, I'd test the pressure line feeding the alda to be CERTAIN it's totally clear of gunk. you have a boost gauge, if you are going to drive without the alda, you shoud invest in a pyrometer.
VSTech: Thanks. I don't think the 93 has the same plumbing as the 90-91 models do. Not sure about the 92, from me reading things changed around that time. I'll be waiting for you to peek at your 93 and see if you agree or not. I don't have the blue saucer as you mention. I've read about that and my 91 parts car has that but my 93 plumbs the ALDA differently AFAIK anyway (heck maybe it's already been changed, that is possible too I guess). I also have been looking at some FSM vac diagrams that outline the ALDA circuit too and it seems some (late 92 onwards) agree with my statements. disclaimner there is the diagrams aren't the best labeled for my specific model year just the 602.96 motor. Mine should be the 602.962 so read that with caution I guess.

My ALDA was originally plumbed as I tried to describe in an earlier post. From the intake, it is T'd. One arm goes to the ALDA nipple, the other goes to the battery side and that pressure to electronic sensor. That's it for the ALDA pressure lines. I think the older models (90-91) have an additional circuit that goes from the intake, to the switchover/overboost protection (obp??) then back to the ALDA. At least I think that's the case. My assumption was this was controlled via the computer in the 92-93 and that pressure switch with the ultimate control being the turbo/vac wastegate as installed in the factory original set up. That control this is irrelevent now with my set up. As for the blue saucer effects on the transmission vac, I don't understand how that is accounted for in the 93 so worried I don't fully understand things here.

After sleeping on it a night, I am really contemplating whether I can get away (SAFELY for the motor) with leaving the ALDA off. If I have a reliable boost relief line (to the wastegate actuator, that relieves boost at 14 psi as GSXR's design does), I am thinking I should not be in an overboost situation. But again, I am all ears on further advice if I am not fully understanding the system and risks. As for smoke, don't care just want the car to run well and safely.

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