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  #1  
Old 11-19-2012, 03:50 PM
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603 injection pump failure ?

I pretty much give up on this one...I'm not getting any fuel out of the injector lines. the car ran great and suddenly one day would not start. Not even a sputter. Not a gradual starting problem but it went from perfect starting to nothing in an instant.

I think the injection pump has completely failed internally or something has sheared or broken.

The lift pump appearsto work and fuel comes out the fuel lines going to the IP. But no fuel seems to return from the IP or come out the injector lines.

The vacuum controlled fuel shut off mechanisim has been disconnected and then removed..not any help...it tests good anyway.

I removed the ALDA thing on top at someone's suggestion but not sure what I'm looking for.

How much fuel should the lift pump move? I guess maybe it's possible its not moving enought to supply the IP???

might be selling a "project wagon" soon if I can't get it running.

I need a schematic of the IP to see how it works.

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1987 300TDT
1981 VW MKI Caddy 1.6 diesel, waiting on engine swap
1983 D-50 Power Ram 4x4 "Mitsubishi" 2.3 turbo diesel
assorted gas powered crap and motorcycles

RIP: 1984 300TDT, 1982 300TDT, 1984 190D 2.2, 1992 300D 2.5, 1987 300TDT, 1982 Maxima LD28, 1983 Maxima LD28, Isuzu C223 P'ups X3, 1983 Holiday Rambler 6.2 Banks turbo diesel, 1984 Winnebago LeSharo 2.1 TD, 1985 Allegro 6.5
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  #2  
Old 11-19-2012, 04:29 PM
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Does fuel come out of the relief valve on the injection pump? If It is coming out there and the relief valve is not totally open it may indeed be a injection pump issue. You can test the relief valve with low air pressure. Or clamp the line. Actually that is perhaps the first thing you should do. If the relief valve holds ten pounds of pressure I would think the injection pump may be bad as well.

Of course you mention there is no return fuel from the injection pumps return. So until you find out why it can also be assumed the injection pump is probably still good. The imput to output path inside the injection pump for the base fuel supply is not controlled. Other than for the relief valve I believe on the 603 injection pump. It is a simple cavity to make fuel available to the injection pump elements.

Last edited by barry12345; 11-19-2012 at 04:40 PM.
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  #3  
Old 11-19-2012, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odie View Post
I pretty much give up on this one...I'm not getting any fuel out of the injector lines. the car ran great and suddenly one day would not start. Not even a sputter. Not a gradual starting problem but it went from perfect starting to nothing in an instant.

I think the injection pump has completely failed internally or something has sheared or broken.

The lift pump appearsto work and fuel comes out the fuel lines going to the IP. But no fuel seems to return from the IP or come out the injector lines.

The vacuum controlled fuel shut off mechanisim has been disconnected and then removed..not any help...it tests good anyway.

I removed the ALDA thing on top at someone's suggestion but not sure what I'm looking for.

How much fuel should the lift pump move? I guess maybe it's possible its not moving enought to supply the IP???

might be selling a "project wagon" soon if I can't get it running.

I need a schematic of the IP to see how it works.
If no Fuel is coming out of the IP at the Pressure Relief/Overflow Valve the Fuel Supply/Lift Pump is unable to produce enough pressure to push Fuel through the Fuel Injection Pump Housing.

If you remove the Fuel Injection Pump Cover you can see the Fuel Rack; the Square Rod. That should be albe to move back and forth but is under Sprint tension in one direction.
All of the little Blocks that are on the Rack should stay tight on the Rack; don't loosen them.
As the Engine Rotates the parts in side with the springs should go up and down. Those are the Element Retun Springs.
If those parts are going up and down and not stuck upwards and you move the Fuel Rack in different positions while cranking the Engine Fuel should come out of them. (loosen the Fuel Injection Lines at the Fuel Injection Pump to see if Fuel is coming out. Keep you Face and Fingers away from that area while cranking.)

No Fuel to Front Injector - Is IP shot?



See the Pic. If you remove the Sid Cover you can access
Attached Thumbnails
603 injection pump failure ?-fuel-i-jection-pump-cover-off-nov-12.jpg  
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  #4  
Old 11-20-2012, 11:07 AM
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Lift pump failure would be very good.....easy to access and not too much coin...

I assumed the lift pump was fine since I was getting fuel but maybe just not enough pressure/flow???

How do I test the lift pump? I think I saw on some other threads that output should be something like 150cc/30 sec? Should I disconnet the filter hose and stick it in a jar and crank the starter for 30 sec and measure the output?

I would assume that is a MINIMUM output standard. What should a normal/new lift pump put out on the 603 engine?

I would assume my lift pump is original with 522,000 miles...probably worn out by now...if this a common failure considering the age and miles?
__________________
1987 300TDT
1981 VW MKI Caddy 1.6 diesel, waiting on engine swap
1983 D-50 Power Ram 4x4 "Mitsubishi" 2.3 turbo diesel
assorted gas powered crap and motorcycles

RIP: 1984 300TDT, 1982 300TDT, 1984 190D 2.2, 1992 300D 2.5, 1987 300TDT, 1982 Maxima LD28, 1983 Maxima LD28, Isuzu C223 P'ups X3, 1983 Holiday Rambler 6.2 Banks turbo diesel, 1984 Winnebago LeSharo 2.1 TD, 1985 Allegro 6.5
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  #5  
Old 11-20-2012, 02:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odie View Post
How do I test the lift pump? I think I saw on some other threads that output should be something like 150cc/30 sec? Should I disconnet the filter hose and stick it in a jar and crank the starter for 30 sec and measure the output?

I would assume that is a MINIMUM output standard. What should a normal/new lift pump put out on the 603 engine?

I would assume my lift pump is original with 522,000 miles...probably worn out by now...if this a common failure considering the age and miles?
Don't assume anything.

The stated test procedure is fine. It should produce about six ounces in 30 seconds. If it does that, the pump is ruled out as the issue.

However, and this is important:

If it does not produce the stated quantity, a restriction upstream of the pump (primary filter, tank screen) can produce the same results and you can erroneously conclude that the pump is NG.

If the pump is actually NG, let me know. I probably have the one that I replaced............because of a wrong diagnosis.
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  #6  
Old 12-08-2012, 08:26 PM
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I measured the lift pump out put...I ran the fuel filter output hose into a cup...

the lift pump moved 200cc or about 7oz in 30 seconds of cranking the starter.

Is this good output or not enough? I didn't have a way to test lift pump output pressure though...
__________________
1987 300TDT
1981 VW MKI Caddy 1.6 diesel, waiting on engine swap
1983 D-50 Power Ram 4x4 "Mitsubishi" 2.3 turbo diesel
assorted gas powered crap and motorcycles

RIP: 1984 300TDT, 1982 300TDT, 1984 190D 2.2, 1992 300D 2.5, 1987 300TDT, 1982 Maxima LD28, 1983 Maxima LD28, Isuzu C223 P'ups X3, 1983 Holiday Rambler 6.2 Banks turbo diesel, 1984 Winnebago LeSharo 2.1 TD, 1985 Allegro 6.5
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  #7  
Old 12-08-2012, 08:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odie View Post
I measured the lift pump out put...I ran the fuel filter output hose into a cup...

the lift pump moved 200cc or about 7oz in 30 seconds of cranking the starter.

Is this good output or not enough? I didn't have a way to test lift pump output pressure though...
That output is fine. The lift pump is ruled out as the culprit.
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  #8  
Old 12-08-2012, 08:37 PM
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did I test measure the output at the right location?
__________________
1987 300TDT
1981 VW MKI Caddy 1.6 diesel, waiting on engine swap
1983 D-50 Power Ram 4x4 "Mitsubishi" 2.3 turbo diesel
assorted gas powered crap and motorcycles

RIP: 1984 300TDT, 1982 300TDT, 1984 190D 2.2, 1992 300D 2.5, 1987 300TDT, 1982 Maxima LD28, 1983 Maxima LD28, Isuzu C223 P'ups X3, 1983 Holiday Rambler 6.2 Banks turbo diesel, 1984 Winnebago LeSharo 2.1 TD, 1985 Allegro 6.5
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  #9  
Old 12-08-2012, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odie View Post
did I test measure the output at the right location?
The location is irrelevant provided the output is sufficient.
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  #10  
Old 12-08-2012, 08:58 PM
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Well I'm baffled...

I saw some posts about the relief or bypass valve failure? is this on the return line from the IP back to the fuel tank?
__________________
1987 300TDT
1981 VW MKI Caddy 1.6 diesel, waiting on engine swap
1983 D-50 Power Ram 4x4 "Mitsubishi" 2.3 turbo diesel
assorted gas powered crap and motorcycles

RIP: 1984 300TDT, 1982 300TDT, 1984 190D 2.2, 1992 300D 2.5, 1987 300TDT, 1982 Maxima LD28, 1983 Maxima LD28, Isuzu C223 P'ups X3, 1983 Holiday Rambler 6.2 Banks turbo diesel, 1984 Winnebago LeSharo 2.1 TD, 1985 Allegro 6.5
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  #11  
Old 12-08-2012, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odie View Post
Well I'm baffled...

I saw some posts about the relief or bypass valve failure? is this on the return line from the IP back to the fuel tank?
There are 2 Banjo Bolts that actually Screw into the Fuel injection Pump Housing. One of them is hollow inside and the other one is the Valve.

On My Different Year and Model the one that is on the Engine side of the Fuel Injection pump is the Fuel Pressure Relief/Bypass Valve.
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  #12  
Old 12-08-2012, 10:15 PM
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OK. it's the banjo bolt for the return line between the IP and block? Guess I'll be pulling that off tomorrow for a looksy...

I understand is come apart and the spring is know to fail or wear out?
__________________
1987 300TDT
1981 VW MKI Caddy 1.6 diesel, waiting on engine swap
1983 D-50 Power Ram 4x4 "Mitsubishi" 2.3 turbo diesel
assorted gas powered crap and motorcycles

RIP: 1984 300TDT, 1982 300TDT, 1984 190D 2.2, 1992 300D 2.5, 1987 300TDT, 1982 Maxima LD28, 1983 Maxima LD28, Isuzu C223 P'ups X3, 1983 Holiday Rambler 6.2 Banks turbo diesel, 1984 Winnebago LeSharo 2.1 TD, 1985 Allegro 6.5
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  #13  
Old 12-08-2012, 11:22 PM
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If nothing is coming out the relief overflow line. Or with the relief valve taken off the injector pump. No fuel is spilling out.

Chances are you have a totally restricted fuel filter.

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