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  #16  
Old 08-13-2002, 07:12 AM
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Sea level is good for me

Folks,

Been busy and didn't get back to this thread. Actually thought no one replied because I didn't get the usual email notification. Anyway...

The car is back to it's usual self off the line here at sea level in NYC. In fact as soon as we got below 4k in Nebraska everything was running fine.

The AC was satisfactory at cruising speed which was a relief considering the heat we drove through in July.

Dave, you may be quite right about the fuel injection. I'm sure my car has never had anything done to IP or injectors. I expect that it was re-calibrated when the new head was installed, but I've never had the injectors checked. What's involved in that?

You were also curious about the the ADLA pressure line. That's the third time I've cleaned in two years. I remember the inside of my old head was a complete soot stash with soot coating everything from 1/4 to 1/2 inch. I've always had a BB in the egr right before the control on the exhaust manifold, but while in CO, I went and stopped off all three lines that go to the equipment in front under the air filter. We'll see if that reduces the problem.

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  #17  
Old 08-14-2002, 10:59 PM
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Hi Mike,

Good idea to plug off all the emissions crap (EGR and air recirc on turbo). About the injectors, to properly test them you remove all 6 and take them to a Bosch shop (well, any diesel shop can do the test actually.) They put them on a "pop" tester and check the spray pattern. On my car, I had two with not quite perfect spray patterns, and that's with lots of fuel additives and Italian tuneups. They disassembled & cleaned them in a sonic cleaner, and set them to with 1 bar pressure for all 6. Since then the intermittent "miss" at hot idle is gone.

If your car idles OK and has good power & MPG, they're probably OK. I'd only pull them if you have a problem that you can't diagnose. But it sounds like you just experienced the normal (drastic!) power loss at high elevations. I now live at 2500-3000ft, and the power loss is slight but noticeable. Above 4000 or so, it's really sluggish off the line until the boost rises. That's about the only thing I miss about Sac, where I lived at 100ft! Lots of power there!

Only mess with the IP if NOTHING else cures low power/MPG symptoms, if any. But it appears your car is fine, so happy motoring!


Best regards,
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  #18  
Old 08-30-2002, 12:36 PM
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I live in Denver (5280'). Have owned a 77 300d non-turbo for a while. Just bought an 85 300tdt. What a difference.! There is no question in my mind that at this altitude the turbo model is a far superior vehicle. Talked to the mechanic where I had it emission tested. He also drives Mercedes. He says he is frequently asked the question about performance at altitude and explains that turbos make a HUGE difference at altitude.
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  #19  
Old 09-01-2002, 05:32 PM
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This last spring we went to Breckenridge and my S-350 overfueled badly. Smoked something terible, thought something was major wrong. When we came back down to below 5000' the car ran great. I don't know what the problem was. Have been told maybe the injector tips or the controller that controls fuel was not cutting back the fuel at high altitudes. I live in Louisiana and it is hard to find a fix for something that does not mess up at low altitudes.
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  #20  
Old 09-01-2002, 11:24 PM
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The ALDA compensator is the beauty of the turbo. Inside are two little cells that are compressed by the dense air at low altitudes which moves a rod upwards toprovide more fuel to go with the boost. at higher altitudes the cells expand and reduce the fuel to match the thinner air. If the lines are clear,the overboost protection circuit is functioning, and everything else is working, the car should function the same at sea level or 10,000 ft. Naturally aspirated diesels unfortunately don't have this feature and go rich at high altitudes. Early 240 and 300 models have a knob on the top of the IP that you can turn and set for altitude if you can remember to set and reset it.

Peter
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  #21  
Old 07-26-2004, 01:34 AM
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I am resurrecting this old thread because I am at 6000 feet (Cheyenne, WY) with my normally aspirated 300D and although it runs great and is actually peppier than I expected, it is smoking. It takes a few extra revolutions with the starter to get it to fire and then it blows a large puff of smoke when it starts.

I think it is grey smoke, but it is hard to tell because of the light and the window tint and the lack of sleep.

This is not a problem that got progessively worse, it seems to have started when I got to altitude.

The previous post mentions an adjustment on the IP that may be possible, can anyone offer any advice for attempting this? Or can anyone advise against attempting this?

Here is a link to an explanation of the ALDA

Last edited by TwitchKitty; 07-26-2004 at 01:46 AM.
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  #22  
Old 07-26-2004, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by TwitchKitty
I am resurrecting this old thread because I am at 6000 feet (Cheyenne, WY) with my normally aspirated 300D and although it runs great and is actually peppier than I expected, it is smoking. It takes a few extra revolutions with the starter to get it to fire and then it blows a large puff of smoke when it starts.

I think it is grey smoke, but it is hard to tell because of the light and the window tint and the lack of sleep.

This is not a problem that got progessively worse, it seems to have started when I got to altitude.

The previous post mentions an adjustment on the IP that may be possible, can anyone offer any advice for attempting this? Or can anyone advise against attempting this?

Here is a link to an explanation of the ALDA
I also wish to find a procedure for adjusting the IP on NA 300Ds.
Can anyone offer advice, as these cars do not have an ALDA fitted, so we cannot "tweak the ALDA)
Tony
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  #23  
Old 07-26-2004, 09:52 AM
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Alda or not to alda...

Actually Tony I believe that they all have an alda as this is the altitude compensating device for the IP.
Do you know if you have an MW or what type of pump you have on the car?
On the top of the IP at the rear is usually a square box that is mounted to the top. This is the alda and although you can tweak it, if you break it you will be looking for a possibly expensive replacement.

My original problem was on an M-Style pump on my 240D and it actually had a fuel delivery adjustment screw on the very back of the pump. By loosening the locknut I could turn the screw in and this solved all my problems, but it also cut my power by as much as 20% more than it was already cut by having a little 4 banger...

i have since sold my N/A 300D or I could go take a look at it and try to help.
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  #24  
Old 07-26-2004, 10:19 AM
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Twitch,

The gray smoke you see when you start the engine is unburned fuel. When the starter cranks the engine and it doesn't fire, vaporised unburned fuel and air is pushed into exhaust system by the exhaust storke. This grey smoke is then pushed out of the exhaust system by the exhaust gasses when the engine starts to run.

Any non-altitude compensated Diesel engine will smoke black in higher altitudes because the same amount of fuel is injected but less air is pushed into the engine by the lower atmospheric pressure. Thus the mixture is richer and there is not enough air to burn all the fuel.

P E H
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  #25  
Old 08-01-2004, 07:53 AM
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I replaced my air filter, aiming for low fruit. Didn't seem to make any difference. I found that by letting the glow plugs heat for an extra 5-10 seconds the car would start much quicker and I could avoid the smoke on startup.

Thanks for the help, I will be returning to lower altitudes soon.
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  #26  
Old 08-01-2004, 10:13 AM
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Here is the ID plate on my IP.
Attached Thumbnails
Diesel performance and altitude...-300d_ip_e.gif  
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  #27  
Old 08-01-2004, 10:13 AM
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Funny you should bring back this thread. I was just looking at this the other day:

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/turbo3.htm

I enjoy the site for finding out about different things and how they work.
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  #28  
Old 08-01-2004, 10:19 AM
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Here is the first view of my IP.
Attached Thumbnails
Diesel performance and altitude...-300d_ip_a1.jpg  
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  #29  
Old 08-01-2004, 10:24 AM
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Second View
Please identify the ALDA for me.
Remember, this is a NON-Turbo engine in Australia, so IP may be totally different.
Australia is the flattest continent too, so MB may have decided it was not necessary.
Attached Thumbnails
Diesel performance and altitude...-300d_ip_b1.jpg  
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  #30  
Old 08-01-2004, 10:45 AM
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Tony,

NA engines don't have an ALDA. ALDA is used to increase fuel delivery when Manifold pressure becomes positive.

P E H

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