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  #16  
Old 02-20-2013, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by barry12345 View Post
The copper fatigue if it becomes an issue should occur in the area of highest vibration. That is closer to the engine in my opinion. Remember that failure of the oil sendors pressure line on the average 616 0r 617 is virtually unheard of.

At this moment I am not sure of the fluid filled tubes composition on the oil pressure gauge. Some have gone 500k or more by now . Supporting the tube in the areas of maximum vibrations also can reduce vibration fatigue problems.

Having the gauges is more important than that extreme possibility in my opinion anyways. I know you have at least one aftermarket gauge in your own system

Plastic feed lines could virtually eliminate any concern if used.. The nice additional bonus of the need for fluid filled mechanical gauges. If an internal gauge leak evolves it will in all probablity be confined to the sealed gauge. Unlike the mechaniucal oil presure gauges.
SUNPRO has both copper and nylon tubing available...their Engineering Dept. recommends the copper for longer life..they also said to form a 3 inch coil in the lines would help reduce vibration? Never heard that one before.
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  #17  
Old 02-21-2013, 01:09 AM
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Originally Posted by buch32 View Post
SUNPRO has both copper and nylon tubing available...their Engineering Dept. recommends the copper for longer life..they also said to form a 3 inch coil in the lines would help reduce vibration? Never heard that one before.
That is a standard operating procedure to keep a metal line from cracking. I have seen it on brake lines also.

I have also seen it with large diameter pipes. there is an area east of Reno, Nv along I-80 where there is some sort of plant that has these large pipe lines running along the Hwy. they have a few "S" turn in the pipes every so often. this is more for expantion I think.

Charlie
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Anyone that thinks a 240D is slow drives too fast.

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  #18  
Old 02-21-2013, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by charmalu View Post
That is a standard operating procedure to keep a metal line from cracking. I have seen it on brake lines also.

I have also seen it with large diameter pipes. there is an area east of Reno, Nv along I-80 where there is some sort of plant that has these large pipe lines running along the Hwy. they have a few "S" turn in the pipes every so often. this is more for expantion I think.

Charlie
Thanks Charlie....
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  #19  
Old 04-22-2013, 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by buch32 View Post
Liquid filed gauges installed in glove box....Barry12345 suggestion
Update...both gauges developed internal leaks mixing diesel with the liquid which put out a strong odor in the car...they were $26. each...Amazon refunded the money...I liked the idea and may try more expensive gauges later...
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  #20  
Old 04-23-2013, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by buch32 View Post
Update...both gauges developed internal leaks mixing diesel with the liquid which put out a strong odor in the car...they were $26. each...Amazon refunded the money...I liked the idea and may try more expensive gauges later...
What brand gauges and approxamatly how many miles on them? There have been no known issues reported with the approximatly ten dollar chinese gauges from harbour freight unless yours are the first. There are at least a few in fairly long term service by now.

I just went back and studied the pictures. They look like the ten dollar chinese gauges. That is the two you show as installed not the earlier ones used for testing. Random defects almost seem out of the question as both failed.

You can get by well with just one gauge remember. That the internal leak overcame the sealed housing for the dampening fluid was also informative. I had suspected if there ever was an internal gauge leak occur it would have been contained. Unlike the mechanical oil pressure gauges on the 123 cars.

My last thought is on some of the installations a trapped air situation remained in the feed line on some perhaps. If this were the case no oil may have been in actual contact with the internal sensing mechanisim. I guess we wil just not know for some time about these gauges.

On the otherhand the same gauges with higher calibrations are meant for hydralic systems. The fluid is different would be the most likely variable. The prime suspect might also be inconsistant chinese quality but I am not certain of anything right now. It is a reasonable proposition that both gauges came from the same production batch as well.

I have also used the chinese gauges from our equivelant of harbour freight up here in Canada for other applications with no issues. That at the same time should not be considered an absolute defense of them. Funola for one runs with one in his cab I believe for quite some time now. Much longer than you have and I think he accumulates substantial miles.

Still sorry to hear of your experience yet thanks for posting it. Glad you liked the application though otherwise. To me it has always made sense. Why not blow the money for one cheap gauge from harbour freight and give it a test? If it develops an issue as well then it may need more investigation. The odds from what I have observed is it will not.

At the same time I am far from certain at the same time. If you still have the gauges in your possession we could compare the script of the backs of them.

This is meant to be funny. You could have gotten more expensive chinese copies of the cheap chinese gauges. Unfortunatly once again I suspect they are the same though.

Last edited by barry12345; 04-23-2013 at 12:45 PM.
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  #21  
Old 04-23-2013, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by barry12345 View Post
What brand gauges and approxamatly how many miles on them? There have been no known issues reported with the approximatly ten dollar chinese gauges from harbour freight unless yours are the first. There are at least a few in fairly long term service by now.

I just went back and studied the pictures. They look like the ten dollar chinese gauges. That is the two you show as installed not the earlier ones used for testing. Random defects almost seem out of the question as both failed.

You can get by well with just one gauge remember. That the internal leak overcame the sealed housing for the dampening fluid was also informative. I had suspected if there ever was an internal gauge leak occur it would have been contained. Unlike the mechanical oil pressure gauges on the 123 cars.

My last thought is on some of the installations a trapped air situation remained in the feed line on some perhaps. If this were the case no oil may have been in actual contact with the internal sensing mechanisim. I guess we wil just not know for some time about these gauges.

On the otherhand the same gauges with higher calibrations are meant for hydralic systems. The fluid is different would be the most likely variable. The prime suspect might also be inconsistant chinese quality but I am not certain of anything right now. It is a reasonable proposition that both gauges came from the same production batch as well.

I have also used the chinese gauges from our equivelant of harbour freight up here in Canada for other applications with no issues. That at the same time should not be considered an absolute defense of them. Funola for one runs with one in his cab I believe for quite some time now. Much longer than you have and I think he accumulates substantial miles.

Still sorry to hear of your experience yet thanks for posting it. Glad you liked the application though otherwise. To me it has always made sense. Why not blow the money for one cheap gauge from harbour freight and give it a test? If it develops an issue as well then it may need more investigation. The odds from what I have observed is it will not.

At the same time I am far from certain at the same time. If you still have the gauges in your possession we could compare the script of the backs of them.

This is meant to be funny. You could have gotten more expensive chinese copies of the cheap chinese gauges. Unfortunatly once again I suspect they are the same though.
No brand on them...PheumaticPlus is the supplier sold thru Amazon...You can review them on Amazon site...0--60 PSI; 2-1/2"; ANSE40.1 compliant; suitable for Air; Water; Oil & Gas....$24.35 each. I will take a look at the harbour gauges...

BIG thanks again for your help....car is doing much much better since the fuel pressure increase...

Last edited by buch32; 04-23-2013 at 03:44 PM. Reason: additional information--less than 300 miles
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  #22  
Old 04-23-2013, 07:06 PM
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Well you want the 0-30 pound harbour freight model. Strikes me that it was a little larger but unsure. The closest gauge of that type I own unfortunatley is up the road so I cannot verify it today but will tomorrow. The gauge diameter of the harbour freight ones may also be in their site listing.
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  #23  
Old 04-23-2013, 07:34 PM
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On a very quick search I am not sure if harbour freight still has them. Princess auto in Canada shows eight 0-30 psi remaining in stock and they are about 2 1/2 inches in diameter.

They do mail to the states as well and an instant mailing quote is listed on the item. The gauge is up a little to 15.95 canadian but their mailing is usually reasonable. I brought mine on sale.

They have those cursed monthly flyers where you grab stuff on occasion because the price is right. I never seem to walk out with just the item or items I went for. The last two times it was copies of the binks automotive enamel size spray guns for under 15.00 each. About a number 18 nozzle. The cups alone are about ten dollars each here.
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  #24  
Old 04-23-2013, 08:19 PM
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Great to see a thread finished with a fix.

On the idea of fluid lines into the cabin. Didn't we use capillary feed into cabins for the purpose of instrumentation measurement from early last century till the 1980ís? Such as oil pressure gauge- some 80 years!

In my early years we would run copper lines from the engine rooms of ships to the bridge, runs which were a good 300feet and those things somewhat vibrated. Sometimes we coupled in a short length of annealed copper where there was excessive vibration and wrapped them in asbestos where there was heat.
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  #25  
Old 04-23-2013, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by buch32 View Post
Forgot to mention...installed the FM-100 5 micron fuel fliter
I did this- nothing quite like a visual check when there is doubt. This is where I perform/plumb my annual purge from.
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  #26  
Old 04-24-2013, 10:49 PM
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Went shopping with the wife today. Managed to squeeze a visit to princess auto in. I had not saved the packaging for those gauges so thought I might check.

The packages the gauges came in are labeled valley instrument quality gauges. Other than that there is nothing on the actual gauge casing.. The face is 0-30 pounds full scale and is aso indicated in bars. The face inscription is bar 100xkpa in red and at the bottom psi in black. Bar scale is in red and psi scale in black as well.

The package states that the gauge mechanisim can deal with oil,fuel,gasoline,and water plus any other liquid that is not corrosive to brass or bronze.

Ebay also might be a supply point to consider.

I have to wonder if those pesky hydralic pressure spikes that are present in the fuel system might have taken your gauges out. The fluid dampend needle movement does not reflect those pulses but the internal mechanisim is responding to them perhaps. This is why a normal undampened gauge slams from one end to the other in this circuit. Did you by chance bleed any air out of the lines for your gauges? I suspect not but have to ask.

If other reports simular to yours start to appear it may require an air accumulator or air cushion in the gauge system circuit To reduce the ferocity of the pulses. your cigar hose is present in the system?

I did not go to princess auto with the intention of actually buying anything today. Still the lineup at the cash out counters I found was still substantial as the wife waited .

Last edited by barry12345; 04-24-2013 at 11:09 PM.
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  #27  
Old 04-25-2013, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by barry12345 View Post
Went shopping with the wife today. Managed to squeeze a visit to princess auto in. I had not saved the packaging for those gauges so thought I might check.

The packages the gauges came in are labeled valley instrument quality gauges. Other than that there is nothing on the actual gauge casing.. The face is 0-30 pounds full scale and is aso indicated in bars. The face inscription is bar 100xkpa in red and at the bottom psi in black. Bar scale is in red and psi scale in black as well.

The package states that the gauge mechanisim can deal with oil,fuel,gasoline,and water plus any other liquid that is not corrosive to brass or bronze.

Ebay also might be a supply point to consider.

I have to wonder if those pesky hydralic pressure spikes that are present in the fuel system might have taken your gauges out. The fluid dampend needle movement does not reflect those pulses but the internal mechanisim is responding to them perhaps. This is why a normal undampened gauge slams from one end to the other in this circuit. Did you by chance bleed any air out of the lines for your gauges? I suspect not but have to ask.

If other reports simular to yours start to appear it may require an air accumulator or air cushion in the gauge system circuit To reduce the ferocity of the pulses. your cigar hose is present in the system?

I did not go to princess auto with the intention of actually buying anything today. Still the lineup at the cash out counters I found was still substantial as the wife waited .
THANKS AGAIN BARRY...No I did not try to bleed air out of the lines...Vally makes good quality gauges to my knowledge....Autometer recommends to install a fuel pressure isolator in the engine bay for mechanical gauges inside the car...or a full sweep electric gauge...I am considering their recommendations...
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