Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-30-2013, 06:56 PM
macdoe
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 759
Trans. swap..auto to manual, 1983 Euro 4 speed donor car

Hello, I have found a 1983 300d European 4 speed manual car from Germany nearby that we are hoping to use as a donor vehicle to swap the manual transmission and related parts into our 1980 300TD. Will the driveshaft swap over to the wagon? or is the wagon driveshaft different than the sedan? The p.o of my wagon swapped in a turbo 617 but the auto is toast and this is a good time to find one of these manual trans cars. Is this just a bolt in swap from a 1983 300d to a 1980 300TD with 617 turbo motor? Near as I can tell the only thing to worry about is the pilot bearing size.

Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-30-2013, 06:59 PM
Mölyapina's Avatar
User title not in use
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chelmsford, Massachusetts
Posts: 4,373
Dude... I'm drooling... a 38-pounder... oh boy.
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-30-2013, 07:03 PM
macdoe
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 759
Yes, I was happy to find this, since it SHOULD have the proper flywheel? Also wondering how this trans will hold up behind the turbo motor?

Last edited by macdoe; 05-01-2013 at 12:29 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-30-2013, 07:09 PM
Mölyapina's Avatar
User title not in use
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chelmsford, Massachusetts
Posts: 4,373
The transmission should hold up fine -- these are stronger than need be for their original purpose. There are many members here who have put many, many miles on their conversions.
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-30-2013, 07:27 PM
macdoe
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 759
Do you know if the driveshaft fits...Id searched but not much comes up for some reason, which is odd cause I think it is a popular topic
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-30-2013, 07:29 PM
macdoe
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 759
It has euro headlights but they are cracked. Can you get new lenses for these or is a whole assembly needed?
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-30-2013, 07:53 PM
junqueyardjim's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Cicero, Hamilton County, Indiana about 30 miles north of downtown Indianapolis
Posts: 2,623
Well it takes a little time sometimes to get our thinking correct. You mention a "probable" problem with the pilot bearing and forget that the engine with the four speed already has a pilot bearing. If you use the other engine, the one with the autmatic, that is an 81 I believe and the 81 617 will present no problem. Only the 85 built 617's have a slight problem, easily resolved by putting the pilot in the freezer overnight and tapping it in. A "cursory" look at the Russian EPC shows the same driveline between the W123 sedans and wagons. http://mb.ilcats.ru/part/class/1/ccode/F/cat/68M/type/123/subtype/190/group/41 If you wish to look at all components on your cars, look and pick them from this page. Index to Mercedes EPC Parts Info and Diagrams | Everything Benz
__________________
Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-30-2013, 07:56 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 36,639
Quote:
Originally Posted by macdoe View Post
It has euro headlights but they are cracked. Can you get new lenses for these or is a whole assembly needed?
I have an extra set of rectangular lenses...lightly sanded. I'll sell reasonably.
__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-30-2013, 08:09 PM
junqueyardjim's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Cicero, Hamilton County, Indiana about 30 miles north of downtown Indianapolis
Posts: 2,623
Yes it is a bolt in operation, still gives you plenty to scratch your noggin on. Make sure you use "new bolts" on that flywheel. They are use once strech bolts. Put in a new pilot bearing of course, and make sure the clutch has enough life to re install, or go new on that and the pressure plate. A new slave cylinder is pretty cheap and an awful lot easier then changing when the transmission is in. Go new on motor mounts and engine shock, if you want a long and happy car life, go new with cooler hoses and all belts. Drive line should be good to go, so you save some dollars there. Make sure though, they must be exactly the same length. That transmission is very robust. I see on the Russian EPC they used it all the way up to the 4.5 litre V/8 on European models. Have fun! It is a bolt in but it took me 27 months to get it done, but I didn't work on it every night.
__________________
Junqueyardjim
Christianity, if false, is of no importance, and if true, of infinite importance. The only thing it cannot be is moderately important. C.S. Lewis



1983 Mercedes W123 240D 4 Speed 285,000 on the road with a 617 turbo, beautiful butter yellow, license plate # 83 240D INDIANA

2003 Jaguar Type X, AWD. beautiful, good mileage,
Mom's car, but I won't let her drive it!
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-30-2013, 08:21 PM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,296
X2 on the clutch slave, they are a bugger on the 617s to do later.

It should be a direct swap and not to bad with the doner car close at hand.

nice find.
__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-01-2013, 02:05 AM
Diesel
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: NH / MA
Posts: 55
put in a new clutch kit and slave. Would really stink to have to pull the trans do to a failure of one of those.
__________________
________________________________
1980 300CD - 130,000 Daily Driver
1984 300CD - 325,000 Dad's summer cruiser

1977 K10 - The Grinch - lifted, locked, winch, 37's. Beadlocks.. 379 t Detroit Diesel
1956 Willys Wagon - buick 225 oddfire v6
1982 SJ 410
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-01-2013, 11:47 AM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,296
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Grinch View Post
put in a new clutch kit and slave. Would really stink to have to pull the trans do to a failure of one of those.
Thats for sure, All the engine and tranny swapping with the 240Ds was a piece of cake compared to the 300TD, oh, and not forgetting about the starter
__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-01-2013, 01:13 PM
macdoe
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 759
Quote:
Originally Posted by junqueyardjim View Post
Well it takes a little time sometimes to get our thinking correct. You mention a "probable" problem with the pilot bearing and forget that the engine with the four speed already has a pilot bearing. If you use the other engine, the one with the autmatic, that is an 81 I believe and the 81 617 will present no problem. Only the 85 built 617's have a slight problem, easily resolved by putting the pilot in the freezer overnight and tapping it in. A "cursory" look at the Russian EPC shows the same driveline between the W123 sedans and wagons. http://mb.ilcats.ru/part/class/1/ccode/F/cat/68M/type/123/subtype/190/group/41 If you wish to look at all components on your cars, look and pick them from this page. Index to Mercedes EPC Parts Info and Diagrams | Everything Benz
Thanks for the help guys, The car receiving the 4 sp.manual will be the 1980 300TD that the previous owner swapped a turbo motor into. This car was originally a non turbo car. I was and am still not 100% sure what year that previous owners donor motor is from, but as you say I have not thought this through entirely. Your comment did make me think to compare at least the motor to the one we have in our other 85 wagon. That has enabled me to discern at least that this motor in the 1980 model is probably not an 85 since it does not have the electrical connector on the injection pump, nor does it have the thing on the turbo like the 85 does....so I should be free and clear of any forseen problems with the pilot bearing. It seems from the info. that the driveshaft will work and I assume the pedals and master/slave will bolt in.

The only thing left to consider is the shifter.....will the manual shifter bolt into the hole that has the auto shifter right now or will that need modification? Also wondering about speedo cable?

When I got the 1980 300td the p.o did not have the turbo motor swap complete so I had to finish it. The donor motor was swapped in with whatever trans came with, so it had the electronic speedo....my 1980 came with a cable speedo. I noticed that the cable was left in place and the end was taped up....will that old auto speedo cable work for the manual trans?
I'll try to take some pics of it when it gets here.
I am excited at this being a bolt in swap.
Is there something tricky with the starter aspect of this swap? Is the starter the same between auto and manual cars? Hard to access?

I would love to get a new clutch kit for this but unfortunately funds are slim and I need to get this car working again so I can go back to school, unless it is trashed entirely.

I was reading somewhere that a mustang clutch disc might work in this application. Anyone else heard that? I just happen to have a Ford Motorsports SVO racing clutch in my crashed 88 5.0 that had only like 1500 kms on it when the car was crashed. I think it is a borg warner t5 5 speed in that.

T Walgamuth...I''ll keep your lenses in mind and when the car gets here I'll show pics of the lights to figure out if they will work, cause there are apparently two different styles of euro lens??? So maybe if the lenses come off the housing, then it does'nt matter as long as I have the main body of it in good shape?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-01-2013, 02:09 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 36,639
yes.
__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-01-2013, 02:57 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Ooltewah, TN
Posts: 707
Quote:
Originally Posted by macdoe View Post
I would love to get a new clutch kit for this but unfortunately funds are slim and I need to get this car working again so I can go back to school, unless it is trashed entirely.
Most decent sized cities have a shop that re-lines brake shoes and the like for big trucks. The one local to me also will replace the friction material on your clutch disc. Did one recently for a 190 for $50. Sand the glaze off of the flywheel and pressure plate and spring for a new throwout bearing if at all possible. If funds are tight (or if your just frugal with your car dollars) lots less than $300 for a new clutch kit.

__________________
You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometime you just might find you get what you need.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:55 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page