Uncommon IP and transmission- 1980 300TD N/A - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

ROLLGUY · #31 08-13-2013, 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeliveryValve

I think the suction line design is correct for the year. MB used the suction line with stilts up to the 1981 model year. They started using the "low" to the block suction line with the 1981 300td and the rest of the diesels in 1982 to make room for the newer cruise control.

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You are correct. The suction line is identical to every other N/A 617 (could be the same for a 616 as well) I have seen.

ROLLGUY · #32 08-13-2013, 01:44 AM

Not that I want this to be a game (like a few of whunter's threads), but you guys are doing some major sleuthing here!

Mölyapina · #33 08-13-2013, 09:08 AM

What's the VIN?!??!??!??!?

C.Doner · #34 08-13-2013, 11:34 AM

I think the EURO 81 NA TD's would come with that setup. The euro's have the m-pump . That was a switchover year for the TD some were NA and some turbo. My M-pump is from my 1980 300d. They definitely began using M-pumps before 1984. All 81TD's have a electronic speedo, I am pretty sure. If its a euro the year typed in on the title could be wrong.
The dealer will tell you what motor came in it. Check the engine numbers and you will be sure.

panZZer · #35 08-13-2013, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C.Doner

I think the EURO 81 NA TD's would come with that setup. The euro's have the m-pump . That was a switchover year for the TD some were NA and some turbo. My M-pump is from my 1980 300d. They definitely began using M-pumps before 1984. All 81TD's have a electronic speedo, I am pretty sure. If its a euro the year typed in on the title could be wrong.
The dealer will tell you what motor came in it. Check the engine numbers and you will be sure.

again my US 300cd has the m pump.
rollguy you could just take the vin up to the local AAA and inquire on an insurance quote-- when they plug in the # its either typical US, or the agent tells you the # dosent work in their system = grey market.

ROLLGUY · #36 08-13-2013, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by panZZer

again my US 300cd has the m pump.
rollguy you could just take the vin up to the local AAA and inquire on an insurance quote-- when they plug in the # its either typical US, or the agent tells you the # dosent work in their system = grey market.

Although I am sure he would not mind, I have to get permission to run the VIN, as it is not my car.

C.Doner · #37 08-13-2013, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by panZZer

again my US 300cd has the m pump.

An M pump stock on a US 617. Thats the first I've ever heard of. Its a turbo 300cd right. Are you sure the pump is original. Is that not a somewhat common upgrade for the 617.95.

Mölyapina · #38 08-13-2013, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C.Doner

An M pump stock on a US 617. Thats the first I've ever heard of. Its a turbo 300cd right. Are you sure the pump is original. Is that not a somewhat common upgrade for the 617.95.

That's my question. How do you know that its original? I assume that you aren't the original owner.

C.Doner · #39 08-13-2013, 08:49 PM

I went through the EPC. The detail.ru parts site. According to that the 617.952 for Japan, some had the M pump. It did not list an M for the USA models. Maybe one slipped in on a us car, or your car or engine/ pump is the Japanese one. Ah yes and the euro TD's have them as well. It could be off of one of those. They are not as uncommon as one would think. I've seen three euro300tdT this summer in my area.
I doubt one slipped in because the US one is EPA certified or has to do with passing the EPA smog program. The M pump is not. Mb would give them all the M pump if they had their way.

ROLLGUY · #40 08-13-2013, 11:37 PM

Can someone tell me the difference between the "M" pump and the other one that is common on U S cars? How does one know what an "M" pump is?

cooljjay · #41 08-14-2013, 12:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROLLGUY

Can someone tell me the difference between the "M" pump and the other one that is common on U S cars? How does one know what an "M" pump is?

They give an extra 10hp, there is no alda or ada on the type m, the vacuum shut off is where the ada or alda would sit....the idle adjustment is done by a screw on the rear.....a few places can modify the pump for more power too....

C.Doner · #42 08-14-2013, 04:14 AM

The m pump has a fine spline delivery tube with tabs to keep them from moving. The delivery tube on the MW style pump has a regular hex , hence no special tool to remove the delivery valve for start of delivery adjustment. The M series resembles the pumps on the 60x engines. Also the m series will have unique steel Injection lines from pump to injector. They bend in a way like no other.
I can get pics. Ive got a lot to do, so we'll see if i remember the camera.

Govert · #43 08-14-2013, 05:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cooljjay

They give an extra 10hp, there is no alda or ada on the type m, the vacuum shut off is where the ada or alda would sit....the idle adjustment is done by a screw on the rear.....a few places can modify the pump for more power too....

I don't think the M/RSF pump delivers more power.

MW pumps were used on early Euro 240Ds and 300Ds and on the USA models. The Euro MW pumps didn't have an ADA, as the mountains aren't that high over here.

The turbo models in Europe and the USA all had MW pumps.

All the W115-240Ds and earlier MB diesels had a M pump with pneumatic governor. The W115-300D/240D 3.0 had a MW pump with mechanical governor.

ROLLGUY · #44 08-14-2013, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by C.Doner

The m pump has a fine spline delivery tube with tabs to keep them from moving. The delivery tube on the MW style pump has a regular hex , hence no special tool to remove the delivery valve for start of delivery adjustment. The M series resembles the pumps on the 60x engines. Also the m series will have unique steel Injection lines from pump to injector. They bend in a way like no other.
I can get pics. Ive got a lot to do, so we'll see if i remember the camera.

This totally answers my question. I have replaced the delivery valve seals in my former 190D 2.2, and thought that the different IP was because of the different engine series (what I now know as M pump on 60X engines, and MW on 61X), but come to find out that is not the case. This is the first iron head engine I have seen with an M pump, and searching with the VIN (I got permission today) will reveal the mystery surrounding this seemingly weird engine/trans combo.

compu_85 · #45 08-15-2013, 09:05 PM

ROLLGUY sent me the VIN of this car:

It is listed as a 300TD (no turbo)
Paint code is 473, Champagne
Does it have a green cloth interior?
It had Uniroyal tires originally.
It has a 617.912 engine, #104379
Oddly it has code 473 " LOW-COMPRESSION ENGINE 7,2:1"

Also oddly the transmission code is not listed on the data card. It simply lists "02 105565".

-J