Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31  
Old 09-08-2013, 10:11 PM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: #KeepingAmericaGreat!
Posts: 7,071
Quote:
Originally Posted by pawoSD View Post
I don't think I'd be running grease through a 20,000+ psi fuel system where the injectors cost several hundred apiece....
I'm wondering when ForcedInduction may start to rail against these greasers destroying MB diesels!


Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 09-08-2013, 10:23 PM
Mölyapina's Avatar
User title not in use
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chelmsford, Massachusetts
Posts: 4,373
Quote:
Originally Posted by pawoSD View Post
I don't think I'd be running grease through a 20,000+ psi fuel system where the injectors cost several hundred apiece....
Wimp.
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 09-08-2013, 10:30 PM
ROLLGUY's Avatar
ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe View Post
I'm wondering when ForcedInduction may start to rail against these greasers destroying MB diesels!
Come to think of it, that has not happened in a long time. Is he still around?
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 09-08-2013, 10:34 PM
Mölyapina's Avatar
User title not in use
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chelmsford, Massachusetts
Posts: 4,373
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROLLGUY View Post
Come to think of it, that has not happened in a long time. Is he still around?
Banned.
__________________
"Senior Luna, your sense of humor is still loco... but we love it, anyway." -rickymay ____ "Your sense of humor is still loco... " -MBeige ____ "Señor Luna, your sense of humor is quite järjetön" -Delibes

1982 300SD -- 211k, Texas car, tranny issues ____ 1979 240D 4-speed 234k -- turbo and tuned IP, third world taxi hot rod

2 Samuel 12:13: "David said to Nathan, “I have sinned against the Lord.” And Nathan said to David, “The Lord also has put away your sin; you shall not die."
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 09-08-2013, 10:38 PM
ROLLGUY's Avatar
ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jooseppi Luna View Post
Banned.
I wonder why?
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 09-09-2013, 02:09 AM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: #KeepingAmericaGreat!
Posts: 7,071
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcyuhn View Post
My SBC cars also feel as if they are applying the brakes when in neutral. Always assumed it was SBC being clever.
Well, heh....yeah, me too. The 'lock' and unfreeze, is similar to when you've washed your MB, then leave it out for a day or overnight - then the first thing when it goes into gear - pushed through the rusted-up in place disc.....

Quote:
I have read about both a hill hold and a traffic jam function in SBC. The latter is a mode where the throttle pedal provides both acceleration and up to 20% application of the brakes. Basically you can drive with one foot on one pedal. Both modes are disabled in U.S. cars, but can be enabled via STAR.
Well, if I'm understanding your post.....yes, the CDI brake AND foot-feed function at the same time with individual pressures. Kind of like doing the power braking rear squeal of your Mom's new '67 SS 350 AT Camaro - to impress the high school chicks - heh, (I'm that old.....)

Not so on the '99 E300TD - cancelling of the throttle takes place anytime the brake is depressed. Ala Toyota 'lack of braking' lawsuit era....... I thought it interesting that you (me) could apply pressure to both on the '06 E320 CDI and go back to yesteryear - which is why my theory of the previous owner riding the left side of the brake pedal in city traffic was plausibly why the car has eaten through sets of brake pads and rotors?!

Quote:
I think it would be challenging to perform equivalent fuel economy runs in Texas for two reasons. The speed limits down here are so much higher. Our rural 2 lane roads (FM - Farm to Market, or Federated States of Micronesia if you own a Garmin product...) are mostly 70MPH. You'd get run over driving 55 or 60. Second is our heat; we run the ac most of the year down here. The higher temperature and radiant heat from the sun means the ac is removing more BTUs from the cabin, and accordingly is drawing more energy from the engine. I am not sure how to quantify this impact, but suspect that as fuel economy numbers increase it becomes more significant in terms of the number of MPG lost. But wait, Joe doesn't run the ac - never mind!
Heh! I don't like the wind @ Interstate speed, but can tolerate the semi-arid ambience of Texas heat in casual clothing. Although stop 'n go in and near downtowm Dallas / Love Field is murder in direct sun!

The reason I don't run the AC much (except with ladyfriend aboard) is because my modus operendi as a guy that works out of his home office for 22+ years, is that most travelling is done in very casual shorts / T-shirt, or business casual dress (golf shirt/Khakis) and I don't want the engine laboring in this 97*-100* heat every day with the AC on.

Quote:
I think Joe's fuel economy numbers are about right considering his described use of the car. One mile trips are pretty much the worst case scenario. Why not just walk to the gym?
That's correct ~ I turned in a whopping 22 mpg today @ average speed of 10 mph in the CDI (no AC BTW 97*.....), with a 5 miles RT to the healthclub | Kroger | Subway!

Jim, the reasons why I don't walk or bicycle to the health club are thusly; tremendous city/suburban vehicular street traffic! - i.e. fumes, (great for my mild-asthma) danger getting hit by cars, cross under 8-lane viaduct of Interstate, with the need to cross access roads paralleling Interstate - each 4-lanes wide....... crosswalk signages that are mostly ignored by drivers in cars......pidgeon droppings covering underpass........you get the picture..... this isn't my ideal cityscape lifeplan, but will do for now because of the necessity to be near Dallas Love Field (Southwest Airlines Hdqtrs.) and Baylor | Texas A & M Dental College - near east Dallas........

Last edited by Skid Row Joe; 09-09-2013 at 02:30 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 09-09-2013, 02:25 AM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: #KeepingAmericaGreat!
Posts: 7,071
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROLLGUY View Post
Come to think of it, that has not happened in a long time. Is he still around?
Not here - but elsewhere on the Net - yes.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 09-09-2013, 03:01 AM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: #KeepingAmericaGreat!
Posts: 7,071
Quote:
Originally Posted by TimFreeh View Post
I've not really tried the above scenario, I'll give it a shot today and see if I can hear anything. If you've got your foot down and the engine is under boost it seems totally reasonable that you'd hear some sort of sound when you abruptly chopped the throttle. The CDI's have a much higher upper boost pressure range than the earlier engines, IIRC its somewhere in the 20-30 psi figure. From what I know of whats going on under the hood what you are experiencing seems totally normal to me. With regard to your 'maybe somethings wrong with the turbo plumbing...' line of thinking I guess that could be possible but I'm sure boost level is a monitored data item and if it wasn't at the level the ECU was expected to see you'd have a CE light on.
Did another test tonight - pulled into a deserted, quiet parking lot, put the car in Park, opened driver's door and did a throttle goose-up and quick release from an RPMs of only 2K, twice, and viola, the hiss and whirring quick whine of the diminishing turbo were quite evident. Ya just can't keep a good turbodiesel this massively powered down! Heh!

Quote:
I have noticed this but not on a regular basis, I just assumed it was the SBC system acting in an I'm-smarter-than-you-are basis when it detected that I'd shifted from R->D and the car was still moving at like 1 mph. I just assumed that the trans computer told the SBC to stop the car before the shift members engaged. Seems like a reasonable course of action but I'm speculating - not sure if its set-up this way.
Well, heh I did watch the MBCorp's YouTube several times on the SBC system and the CDI's Owners Manual on this.......not only is the SBC system smarter than 'us' it's more prepared/POISED for maximum braking taking place - ANYTIME you QUICLKY let up on the foot-feed. The system goes into assumption mode that you are getting ready to slam on the brakes! The discs gear-up, advancing very close to the point of action, i.e. the rotors!

Quote:
One feature of SBC vehicles that I've read about is called a traffic-jam stop feature. You put the car in this mode and the SBC assumes that you're in a stop and go traffic jam and the SBC will hold the car in position with your foot off the brake. When you touch the gas the SBC releases the brakes and the car moves forward until you release the gas and at that point the SBC system will smoothly brake until the car stops and will then hold position until the next time you touch the accelerator. Unfortunately it appears that USA spec cars don't have this feature, I could see this being really for todays road conditions.
This, I did not know.

Quote:
No idea on this one, coasting to a stop my car behaves like all others I've driven. I can feel it downshifting as the speeds drop but feels pretty normal to me. Never noticed the SBC doing anything here unless I put my foot on the brake.
At ALL speeds, the '99 W210 would coast..... The CDI seems to not coast, until under 10 mph, or, over the 42 mph +/- speed the car shifts to 5th...... Then coasting down a long grade, then it feels like it's coasting.

Quote:
Doubtful, I'm sure it was just the dealer trying to sell pads and rotors. I'm constantly amazed at how much garages charge for pad/rotor changes - at dealer retail prices MB should be installing the pads/rotors for free. When I picked up my car from Tyler the pads were about 50% worn - I just replaced them at 201K and while the rotors were still in spec I also replaced them. I got about 32k on a half set of pads - which is about my average over the years. I don't think the SBC system is any harder on pads/rotors than a conventional system. I also don't think its likely that SBC drag is making any difference on your mileage.
IN BOLD..... Well, yeah, but the VMI on this car reflects that the brake works (rear-rotors & ANOTHER set of disc pads ALL around) most recently put on the car were after the previous owner traded it in on something else at the MB dealer. One week before I bought it.

Quote:
You didn't answer my earlier question, have you ever reset the cluster mileage computer and taken the car for a rural 50-100 mile drive at constant speeds of 55-60 MPH? That's where Tyler and I are getting the 45+ MPG figures and I'm wondering if your car could do it in those conditions.
No - as JCYUHN surmised above - what with me driving 4 to 10 miles a day at stop 'n go, 35 mph to 40 mph streets are going to not let this car yield any more than 27-29 mpg at best.

Recall, Tim, that my single DAY RECAP of driving SanAntonio to Dallas (325 miles) on ALL Interstate highway driving @ 65 to 70 mph for THAT day, was 41.1 mpg by the time I reached my exit in East Dallas on I-30..... So, yes, the car does get 40+ mpg HWY!

ALSO: Interstate I-35 went at a crawl of 5 to 10 mph clogged freeway driving through several miles of that sleepy town of Austin, Texas on that SA to DAL Tuesday afternoon drive.

Recall that I only used the AC 1/2 the trip that day.

Thusly, I would expect the car to similarly achieve 40 mpg or better on a 50 to 60 mile road trip @ 55-60 mph..

Last edited by Skid Row Joe; 09-09-2013 at 06:27 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 09-09-2013, 03:23 AM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: #KeepingAmericaGreat!
Posts: 7,071
Tyler | Tim | JimY. Got another CDI oddity for ya?

At the shift-point of 1,800 - 2,000 RPM, (NOT under heavy accelleration - just regular run-up) the car has a; WAAA and a possible slight metal vibration/rattling at that RPM when shifting.....not the transmission.

Sounds like air-filter assembly???? OR somethin' loose under the hood, or??????

Naturally, open the driver's window to hear it well.....

Run-up easy through 1,800 RPM.....1st to 2nd, to 3rd. That's where you (if your's are similar) 1,800 to 2,000 IS where you will hear it......

What say the E320 CDI sedan driving gang?

*Tyler - I noticed your CDI is in C or Comfort transmission mode. That's for slick winter surfaces, and or, taking off w/o feeling the transmission shifts - because it starts out in 2nd. I don't see where you would get better mpg using it in stop 'n go driving, FWIW. The little C/S modality selector button is @ 11 o'clock on the flat console near the ashtray.

Last edited by Skid Row Joe; 09-09-2013 at 02:13 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 09-09-2013, 06:15 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 38,613
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROLLGUY View Post
I wonder why?
Forced is a very knowledgable fellow but does not play well with others. He constantly would rail at people if they asked what he thought to be a foolish question or dared to disagree with him.

I always rooted for him to grow some tolerance and courtesy but he never did.
__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 09-09-2013, 10:52 AM
ROLLGUY's Avatar
ROLLGUY
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 7,229
Quote:
Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
Forced is a very knowledgable fellow but does not play well with others. He constantly would rail at people if they asked what he thought to be a foolish question or dared to disagree with him.

I always rooted for him to grow some tolerance and courtesy but he never did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ROLLGUY View Post
I wonder why?
The above was a rhetorical question...Rich
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 09-09-2013, 11:33 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Plano, TX
Posts: 2,574
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe View Post
Jim, the reasons why I don't walk or bicycle to the health club are thusly; tremendous city/suburban vehicular street traffic! - i.e. fumes, (great for my mild-asthma) danger getting hit by cars, cross under 8-lane viaduct of Interstate, with the need to cross access roads paralleling Interstate - each 4-lanes wide....... crosswalk signages that are mostly ignored by drivers in cars......pidgeon droppings covering underpass........you get the picture..... this isn't my ideal cityscape lifeplan, but will do for now because of the necessity to be near Dallas Love Field (Southwest Airlines Hdqtrs.) and Baylor | Texas A & M Dental College - near east Dallas........
No need to justify your decisions to me. I just find in humorous that people drive to the gym to exercise! (I am guilty of driving less than a mile from my office to the gym to go for a run during lunch - it's a time thing.)
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 09-09-2013, 11:34 AM
pawoSD's Avatar
Dieselsüchtiger
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 15,438
I thought MB doesn't allow running over B20 in the newer diesels...has anyone even run commercial B100 for a while? I thought the issue was that high level biodiesel or grease breaks down under the CDI system pressures, causing issues....

I know my VW TDI (cdi) is only rated to B5 or whatever....part of it being the soot product clogging the DPF if its run on Bio.
__________________
-diesel is not just a fuel, its a way of life-
'15 GLK250 Bluetec 118k - mine - (OC-123,800)
'17 Metris(VITO!) - 37k - wifes (OC-41k)
'09 Sprinter 3500 Winnebago View - 62k (OC - 67k)
'13 ML350 Bluetec - 95k - dad's (OC-98k)
'01 SL500 - 103k(km) - dad's (OC-110,000km)
'16 E400 4matic Sedan - 148k - Brothers (OC-155k)
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 09-09-2013, 02:16 PM
Skid Row Joe's Avatar
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: #KeepingAmericaGreat!
Posts: 7,071
Quote:
Originally Posted by jcyuhn View Post
No need to justify your decisions to me. I just find in humorous that people drive to the gym to exercise! (I am guilty of driving less than a mile from my office to the gym to go for a run during lunch - it's a time thing.)
Every time I fire-up the #4K lb. beast for the health club run 1 mile away, I do too! Save avoiding the minefield of vehicular traffic, it makes no sense.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 09-18-2013, 06:19 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Plano, TX
Posts: 2,574
For a little contrast, see attached photo of a typical E55 commute...
Attached Thumbnails
Blowout/non-full size spare prompted Hypermile run in the CDI-img_02281.jpg  

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:55 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page