|
|
|
#1
|
||||
|
||||
Knock, Knock...
Hey Gang,
I have a OM617 that is knocking pretty well. I took it to the local Mercedes guys for a listen, and they think it is in the top end somewhere. They doubt that it would be the block. It sounds to me like it is coming from around #1. I loosened each injector to see if the sound disappeared but to no avail. I have done the diesel purge, and added some Lubro High-Test. It is more noticeable at idle when warm, and when revved with no load, quiets a bit. Revved with load is VERY noticeable. Does this data help, or shall I post a vid? Later, Nater Last edited by Cadin; 08-25-2013 at 02:55 AM. Reason: Typo |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
When did it start? What were u doing? I have loud knock in my mercedes, took it apart found nothing. Turned out to be an injector that just chooses to knock like a rod going bad. Having them pop tested when I complete my pop tester
__________________
84 300sd 2.47 dif 360k 26 mpg needs lots of love given to me in pitty 89 civic hatchback auto 140k 33mpgs soon to be low to mid 40's been in the family since mile 1 85 300d with unknown knock. driven over 30k with knock and still going. sold for $800 |
#3
|
||||
|
||||
crack the line nut and see if the knock stops. if it does, then that's it.
if you move the injector to another cylinder, and the knock moves then it's an injector, if if does not... it's either the pump, or the piston...
__________________
John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread "as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do! My drivers: 1987 190D 2.5Turbo 1987 190D 2.5Turbo 1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!! 1987 300TD 1987 300TD 1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere! |
#4
|
||||
|
||||
I did open each injector to check, and the sound persisted.
Could this be caused by timing chain stretch throwing of IP timing? Pressure is at 1.3-1.5 bar @ 90C @ idle ---> 3.0+ bar at 2000rpm with 5w-40 Mobil 1 Turbo Truck Juice. I understand that poor bearings would cause lower oil pressure than this, is this true? |
#5
|
||||
|
||||
Have you performed a valve lash adjustment to factory spec?
Yes, timing can cause knocking but usually when it is too advanced. Timing chain stretch retards the timing; not advancing it. If your valves were severely out of adjustment, you could get a tapping sound. Oil pressure depends on a lot of things like temp, oil viscosity, filter, and oil pump condition. Low oil could produce a knocking. Just ask anyone who has driven an older Chrysler low on oil. Same with a Diesel. Too low on oil and lubrication does not get to all necessary components.
__________________
1991 F250 super-cab 7.3 IDI. (rebuilt by me) Banks Sidewinder turbo, hydroboost brakes, new IP and injectors. 2003 S430 - 107K 1983 300SD - Tanoshii - mostly restored ~400K+. 1983 300SD - Good interior. Engine finally tamed ~250K. Monark Nozzle Install Video - http://tinyurl.com/ptd2tge |
#6
|
||||
|
||||
I am currently figuring out how to make the 14mm bent wrenches to adjust the valve lash. I am using .014" for the Ex and .004" for the intake. What do you guys use for TDC? 90*(deg) to the rocker pad?
It knocks at all temps, 5w-40 oil, Oil level has at the high (full) mark the entire time, just replaced filter, I don't know the condition of the pump. This 617 has ~170k, and seems to run fine otherwise. |
#7
|
||||
|
||||
Smell your oil. If it smells burnt, you most assuredly have a rod knock. A nailing injector usually causes a miss. If your engine runs smooth, it probably is not an injector nailing. My first CD developed a rod knock, so I replaced the engine. I got the replacement engine running, and it had the EXACT same sound. I found out the replacement engine had a bad injector, so I changed them all. The knocking sound was gone. I thought I had 2 bad engines in a row! The first engine had burnt smelling oil, and the second did not. The first engine ran/idled great, the second did not. Let's hope yours is just a bad injector....Rich
__________________
All Diesel Fleet 1985 R107 300SLD TURBODIESEL 2005 E320 CDI (daily) LOTS of parts for sale! EGR block kit http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/355250-sale-egr-delete-block-off-plate-kit.html 1985 CA emissions 617 owners- You Need This! Sanden style A/C Compressor Mounting Kit for your 616/ 617 For Sale + Install Inst. Sanden Instalation Guide (post 11): http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/367883-sanden-retrofit-installation-guide.html |
#8
|
||||
|
||||
Hey RollGuy,
I have smelled the oil, and it doesn't smell burnt, but would that happen with synthetic? (Which is what I'm running). I've done the loosen injector test more than once, and it doesn't effect the sound. Does that eliminate piston-slap as well, or just the injectors? I have heard from a few folks that piston-slap is not an unusual culprit. What say ye? |
#9
|
|||
|
|||
People with disagree with me....as it happens alot....
Sometime synthetic oil can cause damage to an engine that only ran dino....plus you went to 5w-40...synthetic is pretty thin already on its own.... What I would do is switch back to 15w-40 diesel! Rated oil...and replace the two o-rings on the pipe that goes into the oil filter... http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w123-e-ce-d-cd-td/1640962-oil-filter-shaft-o-ring.html Synthetic oil, does a very good and sometimes to good of a job cleaning out the engine, your filter may be clogged and the orings hard as a rock....both with effect oil pressure and can lead to oil starvation I would think... I would do the valve adjustment as soon as possible....because they may very well tight as can be....again with synthetic... 5w-40 oil is only recommend for climates that reach below freezing...
__________________
|
#10
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
__________________
All Diesel Fleet 1985 R107 300SLD TURBODIESEL 2005 E320 CDI (daily) LOTS of parts for sale! EGR block kit http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/355250-sale-egr-delete-block-off-plate-kit.html 1985 CA emissions 617 owners- You Need This! Sanden style A/C Compressor Mounting Kit for your 616/ 617 For Sale + Install Inst. Sanden Instalation Guide (post 11): http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/367883-sanden-retrofit-installation-guide.html |
#11
|
||||
|
||||
I want to see a video. Sometimes people mistake knocking for the true nature of an OM617.
Unless you live in a really cold climate, there is no reason not to run only 15W-40 oil. You don't need Synthetic. Running light oil in a Diesel will make them sound like they are knocking more than usual. You can buy valve adjustment wrenches if you want. They are not too expensive. Get the valves right before you do anything else. Also, get some correct oil in there. Some people may disagree but I see no reason to run synthetic oil in an older Diesel engine. I don't run it in any of mine and I do not plan to. The engine was designed and ran on dino for many years. Changing that adds variables I do not wish to explore.
__________________
1991 F250 super-cab 7.3 IDI. (rebuilt by me) Banks Sidewinder turbo, hydroboost brakes, new IP and injectors. 2003 S430 - 107K 1983 300SD - Tanoshii - mostly restored ~400K+. 1983 300SD - Good interior. Engine finally tamed ~250K. Monark Nozzle Install Video - http://tinyurl.com/ptd2tge |
#12
|
|||
|
|||
Oh another thought, post your location.....maybe a follow member close by would be happy to listen and loan you the valve adjustment wrenches....
__________________
|
#13
|
||||
|
||||
Location added! I will add a video ASAP, though it may not be until tomorrow evening.
I have been waiting on most things to do a proper valve job first to get an accurate baseline. I have a pyrometer and boost gauge (exhaust pressure would be interesting). I don't plan on "dialing up" until she is "dialed in". Though I would like to hear settings that work for folks. I hear the not changing variables advice; in my 22re I would never dream of running a synthetic; the dino is now part of the engine! When I looked into the oil, a lot of folks had very good luck running it (5w-40 Mobil 1 Turbo) in these motors and saw very good soot retention, possibly (unknown) better flow to the turbo and of course the engine instantly fires. Since this oil was far from cheap, I would like to run it with perhaps the stabilizer to increase surface retention and a slight increase in viscosity and see how that alters the knock. Would this suffice? (Hey Rich, do you know if the Lucas is compatible with the synthetic?) As far as wrenches go, I grabbed a couple of 14mm from $ears and I found a dimensional sketch on one of the forums, I will likely build a set, but if anyone local has a set, I would love a physical reference! Thank you all for your input, it is appreciated! |
#14
|
||||
|
||||
#15
|
||||
|
||||
Quote:
I just tried playing it and it goes straight to the end, not even 1 second of playback. Maybe it needs a minute to process. |
Bookmarks |
|
|