Exhaust in water - gasket? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Preben · #1 10-31-2013, 06:22 PM

I have a MB E300 TDT 1998 straight 6 that today lost it's power. Got EPC error with yellow text (can drive to repair shop). I thought the issue was related to another error I have had. I drove slowly home. Just 3-4 miles or so.

I saw nothing especially, and neither the water temp or anything else stood out to me.

Came home and started to hear some "bump bump" sounds. I parked, shut off the engine, and found that the sound came from the water expansion tank under the hood. I immediately went back into the car to see what the water temp was. It said about 96 celsius.

Found some cloths, and opened up the tank cap very slowly until water came out.

Surely, after the engine had cooled, I now see exhaust in the water.

So probably the main gasket is bad?

How do I investigate this further?

Take off the inlet and the cylinder head?

Is is most probably only the gasket, or may it be another big issue?

Please advice. Thank you :-)

markg612 · #2 10-31-2013, 06:41 PM

Quick check--Leave the expansion tank cap off, start the engine if you believe you can do so safely without fear of hydraulic lock from coolant in the cylinder.

If it were me I'd disconnect the glow relay crank the engine over first before ensure no lock.

Then, if you feel comfortable you don't have any coolant in a cylinder at that point, start the engine, leave the cover off the expansion tank and watch for bubbles, and not the girl from the pole dancing place either

If you've a head gasket breach exhaust to cooling jacket, it will bubble nicely up through the tank. Pretty much end of discussion at that point, and off with the head!

I drove my 83 Olds Cierra diesel (4.3 V6) for several years like that without any issues. The headgasket breach was such that the exhaust pressure was high enough to push the hot gasses past the gasket, but there wasn't enough pressure in the cooling jacket to allow the coolant back through the same breach into the exhaust. Not uncommon head gasket failure.

Diesel911 · #3 10-31-2013, 06:53 PM

It can be the Head Gasket or cracks in the Cylinder Head.

When the Cylinder Head is removed and pressure tested it is better if the water they are testing it with is also Hot.

markg612 · #4 10-31-2013, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

It can be the Head Gasket or cracks in the Cylinder Head.

When the Cylinder Head is removed and pressure tested it is better if the water they are testing it with is also Hot.

606s don't crack much, -14 603s do.

Preben · #5 11-01-2013, 04:02 AM

So then:

#1 Remove the glow plug contact from the glow reley?
#2 Try to cranc the engine short, to hear that it moves without problems?
#3 If it turns well, then put the glow plug contact back
#4 Take off the water tank cap
#5 Start and look for bubbles

If there are bubbles (most probably), then there is a leak from the exhaust into the water, not the other way around.

Then take off the top and replace the gasket.

I have never done this, but a friend of mine have just done that on a VW 1.9 TDI.

Is there a good DIY guide somewhere for this engine for replacing gasket?

PS: The engine run just as normal when I got the problems yesterday. Normal sounds. Only EPC on display. And water out of the lid, and a "boiling" sound from the water expansion tank. I didn't dare remove the lid completely, as I don't want to be burned :-)

vstech · #6 11-01-2013, 10:04 AM

you may want to pinch the small vent hose from the radiator to the expansion tank closed if your car has one... it'll vent bubbles and not show the cracked head/blown gasket bubbling out through the coolant.

markg612 · #7 11-01-2013, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vstech

you may want to pinch the small vent hose from the radiator to the expansion tank closed if your car has one... it'll vent bubbles and not show the cracked head/blown gasket bubbling out through the coolant.

Make this item #4.5

Good catch 911

jay_bob · #8 11-01-2013, 10:26 AM

Remember too that this car has the "auto crank" system where you touch the key to position III and let it go. I would keep my hand on the key to quickly turn it all the way off to stop it if need be.

They also make a dip test kit for the coolant to determine the presence of exhaust gases.

markg612 · #9 11-01-2013, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Preben

So then:

#1 Remove the glow plug contact from the glow reley?
#2 Try to cranc the engine short, to hear that it moves without problems?
#3 If it turns well, then put the glow plug contact back
#4 Take off the water tank cap
#5 Start and look for bubbles

If there are bubbles (most probably), then there is a leak from the exhaust into the water, not the other way around.

Then take off the top and replace the gasket.

I have never done this, but a friend of mine have just done that on a VW 1.9 TDI.

Is there a good DIY guide somewhere for this engine for replacing gasket?

PS: The engine run just as normal when I got the problems yesterday. Normal sounds. Only EPC on display. And water out of the lid, and a "boiling" sound from the water expansion tank. I didn't dare remove the lid completely, as I don't want to be burned :-)

I've got the PDF of the MB 605/606 manual, send me a private message and send the the DropBox link it to you.

A few big gotcha's:

Marking and maintaining chain and gear location (check your chain guilds too!)
Removing ALL of the chain tensioner properly and reinstalling it correctly
Torquing/tightening pattering and protocol, it's a circular pattern from the middle out, and removal is the same, plus the torque to plus 1/2 turn over process.
There are both size M10 and M12 Triple Square head bolts that require a longer bit to reach down inside the head. (Snap-on)
HAVE THE HEAD FACED AND PRESSURE TESTED! If you had the LUXURY of living in the Twin Cities, Headwerks in Bloomington will "Stuttgart" the head to a near like new appearance after testing and facing.
Boil out the intake.
Plan on buying all sorts of those plastic fittings for the breather system, they'll all be rock hard and break as you disassemble the intake.
If you don't have one, sign up for a FREE EPC access at startekinfo to build a shopping list as you dismantle.
Most of your parts are WorldPac stock, but my professional MB friends tell me go to the dealer for the head gasket kit itself, the rest doesn't matter.

That's my two cents.

Preben · #10 11-01-2013, 12:41 PM

Thank you so much markg612 for the PM :-)

I'm downloading as we speak. I'm glad DropBox has the "Download all files as Zip"-function :-)

I'll check to see if I have a small hose to pinch. :-)

markg612 · #11 11-01-2013, 12:57 PM

No worries, glad to help!

bricktron · #12 11-01-2013, 01:27 PM

i have a head gasket leak chemical test kit which i bought to investigate a similar problem - has ten tests left in it. i would like to sell it if you need one.

Preben · #13 11-04-2013, 04:00 AM

Thank you all.

I live in north of Europe, so I guess it's quite expensive to send it here :-)

I've been away and busy, so I haven't had the time to check the engine again. Will try today. Yesterday it was pouring down, so that was not a time to check the engine outside :-)

Preben · #14 02-03-2014, 07:56 AM

Ok, the car has been sitting in my garage until now. Later in November (since last post) it was no question: The gasket or the head is cracked. I hope the gasket is. Time will show soon.

Now we're opening up the engine and demontage it step by step. My hope that a new gasket will help :-)