How to quit smoking
 

Ok I've been at this for a while 1992 124 602.962 I had a nailing and smoking problem at any rpm under load and no load. Checked everything in the fuel delivery system tried a different fuel source, pressure tested the fuel system. Replaced the head gasket nailing went away had a water and oil leak under the old gasket. Now it smokes under 1800 rpm no load and I mean smoke a lot not as bad a before the head gasket change. Ran moly purge no smoke at all. It idles ok could be a bit smoother as it once was. The nailing is completely gone. I change and balance the injectors before the head gasket no real change.

I'm now thinking maybe it's the fuel rail in the injector body. Could this be stuck to full fuel and how can I check that. Most of the codes are in error when I read the odb1 flashes.

Thanks

I forgot to mention a few things 130k miles. Thick white smoke with a strong diesel smell now. The tank screen cleaned, all new crush washers and O rings now air in fuel system. Timing chain stretch less than 1 degree I'll need to get a IP locking pin to verify timing but the IP has never been touched.

You do not need a locking pin to check the timing. (You only need to lock the timing on the IP if you are going to install it.)
Set your crank to the timing spec. for your engine (I think it will be 15 degrees after TDC)
Remove the timing port plug on the IP and, using a mirror and light, see if the timing ridge is centered in the port.

If the IP is over fueling, the rpm's would rise to burn it. (A diesel will not be over fueled at no load, until it reaches terminal rpms.)

Did you check the compression? Do a dry test, then a wet test.
If you find a low cylinder, then proceed to a leak down test to identify if the leak is valves or rings.

If you have a cylinder that is not burning it's fuel, that will cause smoke.

I did a leak down prior to head gasket replacement which identified the water issues and oil entering cyl. 1. Good point to repeat this now. I did check to make sure the valves all sealed correctly and heald a seal with the head removed and all looked good. I may have to invest in a compression tester but was hoping to borrow one from a parts place but it seems they mostly cater to gas engines. Off to check the timing after Mother's Day lunch.

I found the timing to be 17 degrees ATDC and I corrected it to 14.5 degrees. It starts and runs especially during the after glow cycle but right after it smokes strongly. I'm still thinking somehow some where air is entering the system just exhausted everything I know. Maybe I should go down the path and replace all the supply lines even though I had pressure tested everything?

With the engine idling, open the fuel line nut at each injector, one at a time.
See if you find a dead cylinder.
If you find a dead cylinder, swap the injector with another cylinder and see if the "dead" stays with the cylinder, or follows the injector.

Really sounds like you have a bad injector to me.

You say that during the after-glow cycle, there is no smoke.

Idea: energize the glow plugs one at a time to see if the smoke clears. When the smoke clears, then you know which injector to replace. If you have a stout piece of wire, and you pull the appropriate connector from the glow plug relay, that connector has a pin for each glow plug, conveniently numbered to match the appropriate cylinder. Put your stout piece of wire into a pin position, touch to the 80 amp fuse (or the hot connection under the glow plug relay cover). Hold for 30 seconds or so to see if the smoke clears. Move to next pin and try again.

I believe I have identified the cause of smoking and thank you for your inputs I was going to try them all. First of I dedied to run an other source of fuel once again. Hooked up 1/2 gallon fresh diesel 3 feet above the primary fuel filter, placed a large jar onto the return line. Once I opened the new fuel I noticed free flow of fuel through primary, lift pump and secondary. I thinking there should be some resistance that still puzzles me. Well started car and it ran beautifully until what I assumed was the afterglow maybe 45 seconds its is still around 40 degrees outside so that's about right. At that moment I saw lots of large air bubbles from the return line. So air out means air in. I went to the dealership and ordered a new filter the brand new mal? Which was installed is now suspect. Came back and thought to pull the bango bolt and found the upper o ring damaged. Put in a new o ring and thought to pull it to see what's up. The second then third o ring I tried all came out damaged. Must be some sort of defect in the filter or I have no clue how to install a bolt. My new theory is when the car sits the air some how escapes, when it starts someplace the air is entering the system around about the same time the afterglow also quits. This is also coincident with the air in the return line and the bumbling engine along with thick white smoke. This sure had me stumped and i'll be revisiting the down stream of the lift pump.

I'll update one I determine where the failure is provided I can figure out how to install a banjo bolt.

Just make sure you have a crush washer on each side of the banjo.

The banjos I hope not to touch its the top nut on the filter with the o rings. I had difficulties obtaining the banjo when I had the filter assembly removed for the head job. I'm hoping one of those is not problematic but will know more tomorrow.

Thank you so kindly for your help and I won't forget your trick about the glow plugs.

It still smokes I replaced the fuel filter pressure tested from the pre filter with 30 psi and clamped off the return. It held for 20 minutes. Put the return line in a jar still bubbles I am at a loss where the air is coming from. Is it possible its from Its from the IP?

Do you have air bubbles going into the IP ?

I can not see any through the brown clear line with a flash light behind it. Odd that when the car sits for a couple hours it start perfect runs for maybe 45 seconds great then smokes and baubles observed in the return. I'm thinking some how maybe in the filter the air escapes runs ok then air is sucked in but puzzling as that's a low pressure system. My newest thought just now will be to chase the suction side back to the tank. But I have not seen any leaks anywhere this has me stumped for sure.

You may have a rusted fuel supply line, which is allowing air to be sucked into the fuel system.

Test for a single dead cylinder. Air in the fuel would be across all cylinders.
If you don't find a single dead cylinder, then proceed with the air leak search.

If your engine has a separate mechanical lift pump like I think you have, then the pre-filter is before the lift pump. You cannot pressure test the secondary fuel filter from the pre-filter. You must pressure test it after the lift pump.

If you cannot see bubbles through the aged brown line, replace it with new or splice in a clear section so you CAN see.

Indeed I did pressure test before the perefilter my reasoning as when I had a separate fuel supply suspended from the ceiling 3 feet above fuel freely flowed through the return line into my catch jar. I simply pinched the return line and applied 20 lbs for 20 minutes then had the bright idea to test 30 lbs and that blew off the injector return line from the recirculating line back to the filter.

Today I'm cutting the clear lines and splicing in a independent pressurized fuel system, garden sprayer with a small 5 micron filter. I'll try befor the main filter first then directly into the ip.

Wish me luck p.ease.

Ok I believe I found the cause by accident of course. I carefully began bypassing one item at a time and I installed new rubber hoses as I went along first fuel heater, then lift pump with a pressured independent fuel source complete with filter, then finally once I bypassed the filter and feed directly into the ip it ran like it should. I had new clear lines so I thought best to reinstall them actually a very easy process using clear motor cycle fuel hose and a heat gun. While I was installing the bango directly above where the return line connects to the filter I noticed it was loose. This explains a lot when it sat for a few hours the filter bled itself of air hence the good running for 45 seconds. I'm guessing the shake and vibration of a running engine changed this into a source of air which is why air was in the fuel? I have no explanation why a pressure test would not detect this unless like someone else said you can't pressure test through the lift pump which I have other thoughts. I suppose my lesson has been that return is just as important as the source. After I get new crush washers I am hoping this will be the end of this adventure. Stay tuned I'll update one way or another.

If you have a torch, you can recycle the copper washers. Hang them on a small piece of wire, and heat them to glowing orange with the torch (be careful not to melt them). Allow to cool, clean off the oxidation, and they are now soft / malleable again and can be re-used.

The only change now is that after it starts it runs rough right from the beginning not after the 45 seconds. Once the engine temp gets to Round 60 no smoke and smooth idle no smoke. Or when i manage to get the revs to around 1500 and above no smoke cold engine. After the engine has warmed upto 80 its and shut off the restart stupid smoke rough idle for a few minutes then ok. I see no air bubbles in the supply line now but have not checked the return line. I have not checked the pressure down stream of the filter going into the pump.

It runs real rough so I don't believe it is only one dead injector. I'm open to any ideas now!

You can find out for sure with a 14mm wrench in less then 10 minutes.

I hear you Greg last time I tried that diesel everywhere what's the trick a rag so you can't see the fitting?

[QUOTE=dieselbenz1;3329322................I see no air bubbles in the supply line now but have not checked the return line. I have not checked the pressure down stream of the injector. I'm open to any ideas now![/QUOTE]

This is what you need, a 2" length of clear nylon tubing reinforced with nickel plated brass. I have one spliced into the cigar hose (return to tank) permanently in my 85 300D. Does your engine have a cigar hose?

I should make a bunch of these and sell them. Every diesel engine should have one.

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c3...515_171528.jpg

So I started the car ran ok for 30 seconds then smoking and real rough idle. Tried to identify which cylinder it was with a 14 mm wrench. C1 and C2 when hard lines loose individually of course noticeable difference in idle. 3, 4 & 5 no difference seems to move around and tons of smoke again. Clear lines to IP no air.

Bosch Injectors were all pop tested from 1960 to 1990 with good chatter and pattern. I had thought at one time it was the monarchs.

Shot exhaust manifold temperatures 1 52 degs ., 2 51. 3 52, 4 49 & 5 44
Shot temps do injector lower bodies 1 32, 2 32, 3 32, 4 43, 5 44

Kinda points to #5 but by the amount of smoke sure sems to be more than one cylinder?

Why the nice idle once warm and no smoke, why the good start and no smoke.....

I made a very similar device but I included a tee with a pressure gauge and down stream of everything else I put an in line needle valve so I could vary the pressure. I know the pressure gauge should be in the supply to the ip but with a new filter there is no pressure drop. With needle valve fully open I was getting 6 psi of course fluctuating to zero. I pinched back until I was getting between 15 and 20 lbs. No difference it shakes and smokes until around 1500 rpm then runs smooth with a small amount of smoke. White heavy diesel smell.

So fuel system now ruled out maybe time for a compression test but I'll have to order that so that will take a week plus. Any ideas a plus.

Greg no the 602 Turdo does not have the cigar hose. How I miss my old 123 never had to get into that engine lots to be said for keeping everything cast iron.

Maybe I'll poke around the ip don't think it's alt related or idle controller related but there is another little box on the side which I have no idea what it does I recall seeing a vacuum line and maybe an elelectrical connection. Ideas are welcome.

Did we rule out bad glow plugs yet?

It is unclear to me from reading your posts where you were looking for bubbles. The cigar hose was just a location (i.e. return to tank) to let you know where the clear hose should go. If you did not have a clear hose returning to tank, you cannot say for certain "air or fuel system ruled out".

Glow plugs all new bench tested and verified working. I have now clear hoses on the supply to the filter, filter to IP and return to tank no air bubbles. While I wait for the adapter for the compression test the only other thing I can think of is to manually keep the glow plugs powered to see if it runs OK or not. It runs perfectly OK on a straight purge, above 60 degs C. and for the first 30 seconds. For certain incomplete combustion.

Well I got lucky in finding a compression terror with the glow plug adapter not my first choice but I really didn't want to wait for delivery from a mail order. This is not the cheap design either. Got set up for performing the hot test first since the intake needs to be removed. Engine started kept the revs around 2500 very little smoke as before reached operating tem then work fast to get at the glow plugs. Zero reading checked gauge ok reseated adapter still zero fired up compressor to check nozzle adapter air valve failure. The store is now closed and they rushed in the adapter for me so now just fighting with equipment.

Pulled an injector to retest it steady stream at 1500 psi, kept pumping spray pattern returned and chattering began but popped open at 1800 psi. I had spent an entire day setting these up and tested numerous times each injector all set around 1980 psi. I did have to add shims but I am confused at the drop in opening pressures now. Just wondering how many times to pump up the pop tester before one has confidence in opening pressures I had tried 30 times to make sure they are repeatable but now questioning if testing should be around 100 or so. I had cleaned everything in an ultrasonic bath, before reassembly cleaned with brake cleaner then blown out with filtered 30 pound air so I'm fairly certain assembly and final checks were done correctly.

With any luck I'll have a cold compression test completed later today if the shop can repair the adapter I tried but can't seem to remove the adapter check valve as I may mave over tightened it trying to get a good seal.

Ok finally obtained another non functional adapter for the compression tester but put in a tire valve and have cold readings now. Since this is thought the glow plugs I'm not in the mood to replace the intake manifold warm up the engine then strip it all down again. I'm hoping to take semi warm readings after plugging in the block heater for 5 hours. Any ways below are my readings but I have no idea if they are any good.

-1 340, -2 340, -3 290, -4 320, -5 270

I also spent some time while waiting for the adapter to recalibrate the pressure gauge I had used to setup my injectors and found a dead spot around 2000 psi so once I find a better gauge I'll repopulate all of the injectors to verify the condition.

Do a wet test.
Pour a tsp. of oil in each cylinder and do a compression test.

If the compression goes up "wet", then air was leaking around the rings. The oil will momentarily help seal the rings to the cylinder.

If not, it is escaping out the valves.

Well the engine temp block and head were 50 degrees C and I did dry and wet the dry numbers are close to when the engine was cold 20 degrees C.

Dry. Wet
1. 390. 410
2. 360. 420
3. 290. 350
4. 320. 345
5. 270. 380

When I had the head off I did test the valve seal with brake cleaner over night and a rag under and was happy there was no evidence of leak down. I visually inspected the cylinders and only the top 3/4" of each cylinder was a bit different in appearance. There was no evidence of any wear. The pistons were tight no sideway movement at all. I did pull injectors 3 and 5 for inspection a few days ago and had to reuse the old crush washers.

Would only number 5 be the reason that it smokes so badly that all the Mosquitos in the block are gone?

Did you un-crush the crush washers before reusing them? If not, it may be leaking compression. Pack the injector to head interface with shaving cream and crank the engine. If you see bubbles, it is leaking.

Not certain what you mean by I crush are you referring to using the torch? I did do that with number 3 but was not happy installing the injector a bit of resistance before I could establish the torque number 5 I did not want to repeat that experience. I'll know when I remove 3 if I will have difficulties getting the crush out. But dry to wet shows rings I thought on 5. 5 was where I had the coolant evidence with rust under the ss cylinder ring of the gasket.

I'll try the shaving cream trick cool mint gel should be ok hey!

If you lay a new heat shield on a nozzle face, there's a gap between them. A used heat shield has lost the gap. Un-crushing restores the gap and allow it to be re used if done properly. Tools needed: ball bearing a little larger than the hole in heat shield, a socket to support the heat shield, Vise-Grip. Get the idea? It's important to inspect with a magnifier to make sure there are no cracks radiating from the hole afterwards.

Thank you I believe I understand.

Well I'm thinking I now know the reason for smoking. I had lost confidence in my pop tester and went to a instrumentation manufacturer where I purchased a new NACE, (rated for diesel) pressure gauge with 1.5% accuracy then I watched the shop recalibrate this new gauge. I replumbed the pop tester to eliminate entrapment in the gauge and an easy way to bleed the air before starting a test. Compared the new setup with the old and found a 400 plus difference in readings which is attributed to air which compressed in the system which affected repeatability and caused a reading error and the old gauge also was reading low.

I managed to pop 2 injectors late last night and found them to pop just shy of 2600 psi. So what I figure was happening is they injected late in the compression cycle resulting in incomplete combustion resulting in white smoke. The compression numbers I had obtains should be good for complete combustion.

This project sure has been testy with test equipment not working both compression tester and pop tester. I thought I got lucky yesterday afternoon when I saw a parcel at my door step which was to be new crush washers that were forgotten to be included with another order a few weeks ago but when I unpacked them I got some strange looking maybe banjo washers. I'll call the dealer but they generally don't stock many parts for the 124 series yet have many parts for a 123.

I am back in business again the only thing smoking now are the rear wheels well on gravel anyways. I had to wait the weekend before getting new heat shields. Many thanks to all those who supplied input and stuck by me with this repair.

You now know a whole lot more about the condition of your engine than you did before.

If you want to, you could see if the rings on #3 & #5 respond to a little water therapy and seal up better.
Or
You could just leave well enough alone and drive it.

If the injectors pop pressures were set low, it would inject fuel earlier, that means advanced, not late. Since replacing the old with new heat shields, your smoking went away, that would indicate the smoke was from leaking (low) compression, incomplete combustion of fuel that was injected early.

I believe that 2600 psi is HIGH not Low.

Yes I learn't a ton of information and built a ton of confidence also!
The next time I set up injectors I do recommend setting them in the middle of spec. In my case 1950 is the low end 2100 is the high end so 2025 would be my target that would allow for any in inaccuracies in the pop tester setup gauge etc and still be good.

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