That's awesome. Paint looks amazing. Is there any kind of service record posted anywhere? Like what's been done to it?

Diesels are complicated and a lot more intimidating to work on than gas engines, usually slower than gas cars, much smaller selection of cars came with diesel engines, and they are more expensive used, and often hard to buy because you have to move fast to get anything that isn't junk because they sell.so fast. And you have to get well over 300k miles to see the advantages of the longer life if the diesel engine, and by then the car needs thousands of dollars in suspension parts too. I still like diesel engines though, the main advantage here is no emissions testing.

My 300TE with the 4 speed auto never gets over 20 MPG while my 300E with the 5 speed gets 25-27 MPG depending on how much highway driving I'm doing. I don't know how much effect the difference in weight has but the RPM in the 300TE is about 3000 when I'm cruising at 70 and the 300E is at 2200. I swore I would never own a gas Mercedes but I have owned three and I love them.

No emissions testing here on diesels before '96.
So far, the 'complication' of my old W123 diesels hasn't translated into added maintenance & repair headaches.
When comparing 'oranges to oranges', my diesels get at least 50% better fuel mileage than a comparable older gas Mercedes, so even at 20 - 30% higher diesel-fuel cost, I'm still saving somewhat.
OTOH, my 4-cylinder '90s Altima and Camry get as good or better fuel-mileage, not to mention some added power & refinement.
With any vehicle, having a 5-speed/overdrive gear can make a big improvement with highway mileage.

Happy Motoring, Mark

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DrDKW

That's not oranges to oranges to compare a 3.0 diesel to a 3.0 gas motor which is usually twice as powerful. Furthermore, Mercedes Benz gassers of the 70's and 80's are not the gold standard for efficiency.

Something sold in Europe with a 1.6 liter gas engine would probably compare better if you're comparing performance dynamics. A good example is the Peugeot 405 1.6 which will do 30mpg all day and all night.

Diesels have a certain charm but running an old MB diesel as daily transport is not my idea of smart motoring for the following reasons:

1) People wear them out and then expect too much for them. They're still asking $5K-7k for a 99 300TD with 280k. For the same money, you can find an E320 with under 100k miles and I'd wager that the engine is less likely to expire in 200k when compared to a 280k mile OM606. The rest of the car will also hold up better.

2) Diesel is considerably more expensive in the US then gas which negates the fuel economy argument.

3) The economy argument is further negated as 1.6 liter gas motor produce the same kind of HP as you can get from a 3.0 diesel and with direct injection, you're going to get better fuel mileage also.

4) Anything diesel related is more expensive then the gas equivalent.

I tried this for a while when I bought a 76 300D, it was a nice car and I enjoyed driving it because I enjoy the W114/W115 platform. There was also something comical with having my foot buried in the accelerator pedal all the time because the thing was so slow. But with that being said, I usually got 21-24mpg out of the the with the way I drove it. I would get the same fuel mileage out of my 1997 V8 powered E420 which made 275hp. It's a lot more fun to drive.

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With best regards

Al

Yes, those 70s gassers aren't very efficient and by 'oranges to oranges' I was comparing mileage of my 87 hp 5-speed '84 Euro 300TD to a 90hp '72 automatic W115 220 I used to own. - pretty close in performance, if not fuel mileage.
My diesels aren't my daily drivers, but their acceptable economy makes them excellent second cars that can still be pressed into temporary daily status if needed.
Actually, with it's solid body & factory replacement engine, my 4-speed 240D is actually quieter, more agile and fun to drive than my TD.
Not as much fun as an E420, but I still enjoy my old cars simple.

Happy Motoring, Mark

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DrDKW

this is the main thing that although I like diesels a lot, makes gas a better choice most of the time. Anything other than an om61x (om60x mercedes, diesel VW, etc) you will be paying far more for a beater with 300k miles than a nice gas version with half that.

I was nervous to say this before, don't want to trash on diesels.

But I'm heavily involved with farmers market. Lots of miles on light weight vehicles.

My buddy bought two chevy vans, the kind with the back cut off and a small box on. One diesel, one gas, brand new, and tracked cost over 5 years. The initial price plus repairs made the gas motor the economical choice.

My dad did the same thing, only with ram trucks. I now have the gas one. Getting 16mpg unloaded on the freeway with a V8. He's down to about 18 with needing an IP. I'm getting some ticking from the valves, idk much about them, maybe an easy fix. But I can get a long block rebuild with a warranty for $900. His IP will cost $1200.

I was going to get a cummins diesel, but this truck was $3k. 3/4 ton long bed 5 speed. Same setup would cost me $10k with similar mileage in a diesel.

Still love my mercedes though. Reminds me of driving a tractor. I figure it would cost me about $10k to fully redo the whole car, but I'm doing it the easy way for $5k.

When it comes down to it, the economical choice is not the one I would normally make. I'm looking at sprinters next year, and discovered leasing makes more sense for me. I hate the concept, but it saves about $15k in the end. Only reason to buy is to lower my tax bracket at the end of the year.

Reality is, we would all save the most money by buying a 3 cyl geo metro. But who wants to get caught in that?

I got sick of always trying to eek "newish" gassers through inspection. It's always the blasted check engine light usually for some emissions device. Clear the code drive 50 miles and hope you can make it to the shop before it comes back on. Repeat as needed.

Old diesels are easy to work on which is nice considering the high cost of labor. I was feeling lazy once and went to quick oil change place, even though I handed them the filter and oil it was $45. Come on now what's that like $12 per bolt turned?

I don't trust many auto shops anyway. Case in point trying to get my wifes buick to pass inspection. It's very rusty but only has 80k miles, check engine light is not on. Two different shops failed it for completely different things lol what a scam. You know be a $1,000 to get it to pass uh-huh

Sorry if I'm being whinny, I'll stop now.

I'm personally a big fan of obd2 systems. Everyone hates the CEL but it takes so much time out of troubleshooting. For example when my 300e was running less than perfect, it took quite a bit of "unplug this and measure with multimeter" before finding a vacuum leak. Having it all electronic and tracked via sensors makes a lot of people cringe, but I have found it much more helpful. There was kind of a nice period of time before everything became heavily integrated into networked modules...for example when the idrive unit quit in my bmw (ugh) they needed to reflash the ecu and trans CU along with the climate control and sat nav system after replacement.

OLD diesels are nice and easy but new ones are not. Old gassers are nice and easy to work on too.

On the other hand, I can basically troubleshoot and data log my car with just a laptop and a cable, which is pretty neat.


Sent from an abacus

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TC
Current stable:
- 2004 Mazda RALLYWANKEL
- 2007 Saturn sky redline
- 2004 Explorer...under surgery.

Past: 135i, GTI, 300E, 300SD, 300SD, Stealth

Running with in open loop (light on) can really hurt your system and decrease fuel mileage. Once the light is on it runs off preset numbers and runs rich.

I'm challenged right now as the dang thing turns off before I can get a code. I put the scanner in the truck so I can catch it.

I think the difference comes in at can-bus. Really cleans up the wiring, but becomes a bear to diagnose when one thing is wrong. IE, stuff is wired in series.

But that's probably due to my tech ability.

With motorcycles they make a scanner that taps in every where and reads separate from the ECU. Run it while driving and gives performance diagnostics as well, use it to set your mapping.

I would like to get something like this for a car. Maybe even wireless for ease of installation.

Without sounding too harsh (and I mean this sincerely), this is the kind of attitude that makes me really leary of old diesels. Many owners that drive them own them because they would prefer to drive a worn out POS and get away with it instead of addressing problems that are easily identified by a CEL light and easily diagnosed with an OBD2 scanner.

I considered buying a 3/4 ton diesel pickup for a while but am now rethinking this also as they're usually twice as expensive as the equivalent gas engined version with 1/2 the miles and if the gas motor wears out, you can probably stick a rebuilt vortec for a 3/4 ton chevy for about 1/10th of the price of a rebuilt Cummins / Duramax or Power stroke.

If I was hauling every day then it would certainly be a great option but for the occasional use, there is little value.

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With best regards

Al

I just paid $1.88 Gal. for gasoline.

Diesel at the same station is $3.15.

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"Our Lady of Blessed Acceleration...
don't Fail Us Now"

When Mercedes introduced the W123 line, the 240D was priced withing a few hundred dollars of the W123 230 - the equivalent gasser. Unfortunately, most manufacturers have priced their diesel option several thousand higher than their gas version. I test drove a new Chevy Cruze diesel last summer. Except for a few minor gripes, it was a very nice car. But to get the diesel option, you had to buy the the fully loaded, high-line model. Adding the cost of the diesel option, it was about 5K higher than the base Cruze, making it a pretty poor value. This in a model-line whose gassers haven't had a great reputation for reliability.
I still believe driving a diesel can be a viable way to save fuel, if not always money.
If I really wanted to save money, as someone suggested, I could get rid of my batch of aging mid-size cars and get a couple old Geo Metros. But who wants to live with that experience?

Happy Motoring, Mark

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DrDKW

See but that is just politics. Diesel is cheeper in production than gas.

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General George - 1967 Land Rover 2a SWB 1983 OM617 Turbo