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  #1  
Old 04-26-2002, 05:01 AM
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Question OK, ok....240d or 300d?!?

I have been looking off and on at diesels for some time. I have finally decided to start looking for one seriously. I am selling my truck, and after other bills, will have about 1500 clams to find a car. This isn't too much I know. I think the 123 are the best car made ever, and if I get one, I'd want to keep it forever. I see some 300's around 1500-1800 bucks, but I see much more 240D's in the 1000 to 1500 range.

Besides being slower off the line (which I don't mind-I need to be taught the art of patience) is there any big difference between the two models as far as longevity is concerned? Are the 240's easier to work on? Could I find a decent 300d in that price range realistically? Or is the 240 a better bet for the money? I also keep reading that the 240D manual is a little more zippy? Whadda ya think?

Thanks for your opinions!

Jason

p.s. My wife says I'm crazy. She says that I think too much about cars. Can you guys please tell me I'm "normal"? It sure would make me feel alot better

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  #2  
Old 04-26-2002, 06:19 AM
LarryBible
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You did not state the intended use for the car. Are you in a hilly area?

I have had several of both and I prefer the manual transmission 240D hands down over the 300D. To begin with the US 300D models came ONLY with an automatic transmission. The automatic is expensive and uses up the added torque gained from the extra cylinder you have in the 300D. At the same time this extra cylinder along with the googaws and dodads that come with the 300D make it much more of a hassle to work on. The 240D is the opposite end of the difficulty of repair and maintenance scale.

For me, I will take a 240D with manual everything over the gawdied up 300D. The 300D has automatic climate control, very nice when it works, but a real problem when it breaks. The 300D also has electric windows, electric sunroof, etc. My 240D has manual windows, manual sunroof, manual air conditioning and manual transmission. If I had been trying to keep all the automatic dodads working all those miles, I would probably have given up on it and it would have never seen the half million mile mark.

My $0.02,
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  #3  
Old 04-26-2002, 06:20 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Woolwich, Maine
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Jason,

You are "normal" (whatever that is), so relax. So is your wife, as mine thinks I am nuts, and so must many wives of the other members of this forum. So I guess that makes us normal too, since we all have normal wives. All those normal women wouldn't find deviant husbands, would they?

I have never owned a 300D Turbodiesel of the W123 chasis. In my opinion the manual transmission 240D is about as simple and reliable as a car can get. A Euro 300D (non-turbo) with a manual transmission would be my first choice as the added torque and power lets it run at a little lower rpm, which quiets things down considerably. I imported and sold one of these in the early 1980's, but they are pretty rare over here.

The 240D came with less in the way of luxuries and at this point in time, that is likely to be a benefit as the luxuries like electric windows, automatic AC, and an automatic transmission of the 300D can get expensive to maintain (well, windows are not really expensive, but relative to a $1000-1500 car, a few hundred on window hardware is expensive). I also got very used to the car's operating limitations and, with a manual transmission, could coax the car to keep up with most traffic.

My vote is for the 240D. Good luck though, and be patient. There are some nice examples out there. Jim
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Own:
1986 Euro 190E 2.3-16 (291,000 miles),
1998 E300D TurboDiesel, 231,000 miles -purchased with 45,000,
1988 300E 5-speed 252,000 miles,
1983 240D 4-speed, purchased w/136,000, now with 222,000 miles.
2009 ML320CDI Bluetec, 89,000 miles

Owned:
1971 220D (250,000 miles plus, sold to father-in-law),
1975 240D (245,000 miles - died of body rot),
1991 350SD (176,560 miles, weakest Benz I have owned),
1999 C230 Sport (45,400 miles),
1982 240D (321,000 miles, put to sleep)
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  #4  
Old 04-26-2002, 06:55 AM
engatwork's Avatar
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Location: Soperton, Ga. USA
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The 240D feels like a sports car compared to the 300D in terms of the way it drives/handles and like Larry, I favor the manual stuff - windows, climate controls, etc.. I don't think I could find a better car than the 240D for commuting on 2 lane, 55 mph roads, 18 miles each way. It is a little slower up to speed but I like it better for commuting. I have not gotten around to getting the a/c going on it yet but I am sure it is going to drop the acceleration somewhat. I take the E320 or 300D if I am going to go anywhere that I will be getting on the interstate. The 300D feels more like a luxury car than the 240D. The 240D will run at 70-80 all day long but it is quite loud at those speeds.

Concerning the wife thing - wait till you get a couple of black diesel oil spots on the concrete driveway. Mine was real impressed the other day when I was finishing up the 300D and was cranking it over with the fuel injector lines disconnected at the fuel injectors and found that I had left the oil supply line to the fuel injection pump loose. We have another 2' dia. black spot in the driveway now. I told here the resolution will be to paint the driveway black .
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  #5  
Old 04-26-2002, 07:34 AM
dweller
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I think at $1500 to $1800, the best thing is to look for the car in the best shape, whether it's a 240D or a 300D. You're not buying a primo, perfect car at that price, and the quality will vary a lot.

They're both good cars (I have one of each). Just go for the best one you can find.
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  #6  
Old 04-26-2002, 12:20 PM
Jim B+
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Another 240 vote...

Simpler is better, IMHO. I like 240's wheel covers vs alloys, and the 240's very legible clock (when it runs) in my '83's instrument cluster vs. the 300's.

All that said, I am trying to find a 300 stablemate for my 240.

It's been noted that there may be fewer really good 240s around than 300s, since the "utility" models often were more heavily used.

Offered two at equal price and condition, I'd go with the 240...but you need to go with what's out there in the market.
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  #7  
Old 04-26-2002, 01:03 PM
Registered Diesel Burner
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 2,911
Just Another Opinion

For my part, I think you will recognize a good value when you see it. It will be a car that is well maintained, looks good and runs well - especially for the transaction price.

To me it would not matter whether it was a 240D or a 300D.

Give me the chance at a really nice maroon 240D with no rust, 80K miles and clean interior for $2500, and I'll take it without any consideration for 240D vs. 300D issues.



Ken300D
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  #8  
Old 04-26-2002, 01:17 PM
Provo Spain?
 
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Posts: 656
Wow, thanks for all of your opinions. The car would be driven a few times a week. Just an around town type car, not my daily. I live in Salt Lake City, but I never have to drive any hills, since I stay mostly in the valley. I'm excited to start looking. Thanks again.

JJ
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  #9  
Old 04-26-2002, 03:37 PM
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Cool

Wow, what can I say about 240Ds that these guys have not already said. My only comment would be to agree whole heartily with the concept that the 240D is allot less complicated to work on and there is less to go wrong. I am new the MB world and not a master mechanic (not even an experienced parts washer) so if your looking to save some $ and have fun working on a car that even a guy like me can work on find your self a 240D 4 spd. BTW my wife and daughter love them.
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1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
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  #10  
Old 04-26-2002, 10:31 PM
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Location: Bellevue, WA USA
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I don't have a 300D to compare, but you couldn't get my 1983 240D 4sp manual away from me with dynamite. With only 150K miles it's just a pup. I turned it into my daily driver when I switched jobs last year and at my present 30K business miles a year I figure I can drive it for 10 more years. And since the company pays me per mile to drive it, it’s a money machine considering how little maintenance it takes with proper upkeep!
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  #11  
Old 04-27-2002, 12:09 PM
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Location: S.F. Bay Area
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240D vs. 300D

Jason,

Go for the 240D with manual tranny. You'll never regret it!! 240Ds handle better on winding roads, have faster steering, are lighter and have a foolproof a/c and heating system.

But best of all you can do what I did and swap in a 300D engine or a 300DT engine anytime you find or rebuild one. That way you have absolutely the best of all possible worlds.

Just look under the hood of a 300D or 300DT and see all that extra water pumps, vacuum lines etc. It's complexiity for the sake of complexity!! Ultimately, the a/c in 300s works when it wants to not when you want it to.

Ben
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  #12  
Old 04-27-2002, 01:41 PM
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Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,373
Jason:

I started with two 300D's and then added a 240D (Manual). I would suggest that you find one of each and test drive them. They both have much to offer. The speed and acceleration in the 300 turbo is amazing to me. The engine is much tighter in terms of work space however, but still wonderful compared to a domestic.
When I got my 240D, I considered moving my bedroom into the engine compartment as there is so much room for working.
My wife would not tolerate the 240D but loves the 300D. Will yours be driving the beast at all?

Don
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DAILY DRIVERS:
'84 300DT 298k (Aubrey's)
'99.5 Jetta TDI IV 251k (Julie's)
'97 Jetta TDI 127k (Amber's)
'97 Jetta TDI 186k (Matt's)
'96 Passat TDI 237k (Don's
'84 300D 211k Mint (Arne- Undergoing Greasecar Conversion)

SOLD:
'82 240D 229k (Matt's - Converted-300DT w/ 4 speed
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  #13  
Old 04-27-2002, 03:37 PM
Provo Spain?
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 656
Don, no just me! Especially if it's a manual, she won't go near it. Considering she wrecked our Camry three times this year (One with an old 300SD-it didn't have a scratch on it), that is fine with me.

JJ
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  #14  
Old 04-27-2002, 05:39 PM
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I have a 240 D, an 83' as you can see in my sig. I bought it last Feb. and I am very happy with it. It is an automatic and it is slower than a turtle off the line, but I get used to it. It has 228,000 miles on it now, probally more since the odometer was probally broke and skipping for a while from the previous owner. But, once I get up to about 35 mph, it accelerates quite normal. It is not a dragster, but I like it. I plan on keeping this for a long time. I have never driven in a 300, but I will say that I have made easy repairs and very excessable engine to work on. Since I have made numerous repairs, the odometer was the tricky one, and atleast now I can accuratly gauge the mileage and log everything in accurately. To me, this car is slow, but very reliable and I currently get 27 miles to the gallon at 55 mph, and 22 miles per gallon at 65 mph, so going slow does save a little. Hope this helps.
-Hans
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  #15  
Old 04-27-2002, 07:33 PM
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I would've loved to have a 240D Manual. However, I agree that just go for the nicest that you can find. Be it 300D/240D/200D...

I find the OM617 Turbo to be fast enough for my needs. If you start in first, the car really moves! I have never driven a 240D Manual before but I would really really love to just drive one for a few hours.... *so, if you're in Boston and feel a lil nice... *

Right now I would love to have a W114 200D with a 4-speed manual. Imagine how FAST it would be! No, I'm serious.. I'd love to have a W114 now...

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