ABS Delete ?'s on a W126 - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

jay_bob · #46 07-04-2015, 11:10 AM

Ok I will add my 2 cents.

I strongly disagree with removing or changing the original braking system due to potential for unintended consequences and the insurance reasons mentioned above.

That said, if you wish to proceed, the following may be helpful for interpreting the labels on the lines at the ABS pump.

V = vor = front
H = heck = rear
L = links = left
R = rechts = right

I would encourage you to obtain a copy of the FSM and confirm the system is functioning properly. If it is not then I would look at repairing it to restore the original function, instead of removing it.

TheRealYoungStone · #47 07-04-2015, 02:06 PM

Pretty sure i have the lines figured out.

My concern at this point is what i will find once i get into the fuse box.

Yes i know that the diagrams show it passing the fuse box so before any one rips at me for that don't.

On my car the ABS wire harness goes into the fuse box then comes back out to the control module in the center of the firewall.

Its also on this part of the harness the sensors are spliced in.

I'm unable to find a wire diagram that shows this. I can assume it only goes in the fuse to pick up power as it would normally do from the OVP Relay. But I'm not going to assume and in till i get into the fuse box won't know.

If any one knows were i may be able to find a wire diagram that shows the ABS harness passing thought the Fuse box i would be appreciative. That way i may be able to get an idea what I'm up against before opening up the fuse box.

-TheRealYoungStone

Mark DiSilvestro · #48 07-05-2015, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealYoungStone

Pretty sure i have the lines figured out.

My concern at this point is what i will find once i get into the fuse box.

Yes i know that the diagrams show it passing the fuse box so before any one rips at me for that don't.

On my car the ABS wire harness goes into the fuse box then comes back out to the control module in the center of the firewall.

Its also on this part of the harness the sensors are spliced in.

I'm unable to find a wire diagram that shows this. I can assume it only goes in the fuse to pick up power as it would normally do from the OVP Relay. But I'm not going to assume and in till i get into the fuse box won't know.

If any one knows were i may be able to find a wire diagram that shows the ABS harness passing thought the Fuse box i would be appreciative. That way i may be able to get an idea what I'm up against before opening up the fuse box.

-TheRealYoungStone

If your ABS has been disabled by pulling the relay, and your brakes are now working OK, I'm just wondering why you want to go to all that trouble to remove the rest of the system?

Happy Motoring, Mark

TheRealYoungStone · #49 07-06-2015, 11:22 PM

I'm one of those people that have to get rid of things that are not being used.

I am a big believer in:

"The Less there is to go wrong, the less that will go Wrong"

Removing will free up space and make less to work around on other repairs. I do not have any plans at this particular moment, but the room may also prove useful in the future.

Also I am not restoring the car to original it will be fully custom to my liking when i complete the car.

-TheRealYoungStone

t walgamuth · #50 07-07-2015, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vstech

The 86 w126 wasn't built without abs, so finding factory lines from non abs isn't going to happen. You could find a pre85 vehicle and remove the lines from it, and alter them to fit...

I think if you need to make lines manually, the ends are bubble flared, not double...

If you have difficulty with which lines to put where, the abs unit is labeled... In German.

I think everyone has expanded on why it's not a good idea... I am very sure the two accidents you had with functioning ABS would have either been exactly the same, or much worse without it...

The brake lines are standard metric, available at any parts store in various lengths along with fittings, t's etc. Select carefully as the threads and tapered ends vary and if you get the wrong one it will be a problem and you'll have to go back and get the right ones. Its helpful to have a non abs car to look at too.

Bending brake lines is a little tricky as they can kink if you are not careful. Support the inside of the curve with your thumbs whilst bending and you'll be fine.

Mark DiSilvestro · #51 07-07-2015, 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRealYoungStone

I'm one of those people that have to get rid of things that are not being used.

I am a big believer in:

"The Less there is to go wrong, the less that will go Wrong"

Removing will free up space and make less to work around on other repairs. I do not have any plans at this particular moment, but the room may also prove useful in the future.

Also I am not restoring the car to original it will be fully custom to my liking when i complete the car.

-TheRealYoungStone

I still think you'll be opening a big can-o-worms by trying to remove the entire system.
But OK.

I too prefer to keep my old cars simple. So far I've been able to do that by buying them that way.
A major example is my 1984 300TD. It's a non-turbo Euro version with manual windows, manual antenna, manual heat-AC, and a 5-speed manual-shift. Believe me I've had my share of repairs with this car. But at least it doesn't suffer with all the problems I read about on these forums concerning the automatic tranny, power windows, ACC, and turbo system, found that year on ALL US versions.
Ironically, ABS and a driver airbag WAS availible on the Euro W123 300D that year, as an option. But mine has neither.

Happy Motoring, Mark

Mölyapina · #52 07-07-2015, 07:28 AM

TheYoungStone, I, like other posters, find this to be a bad idea and would strongly encourage you not to pursue it...

...but if you really are going to do it, I'd be interested in your old ABS parts.

Mark DiSilvestro · #53 07-07-2015, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JB3

It being broken is a heck of a good reason to remove it!

However, if i had a nickle for every person ive come across who thought ABS was a bogeyman that took their brake pedal and gave it to a demon, id have at Least a dollar by now

If you had a nickel for every time that bogeyman grabs my friend's '95 Camry, you could someday be a millionaire!
On most stops, when the speed drops below 5 mph, the ABS triggers. It feels like you've just hit an ice-patch, accompanied by the click of a relay and the typical ABS shudder. On those occasions when it doesn't happen, there's no relay-click. The ABS light has never come on except for when it's supposed to - right at startup.
A shop diagnosed the ABS computer. But Toyota used two manufacturers that year - Nippondenso and Bosch - and the one used in his car is NLA!
It's his daily driver and he's gotten used to the quirk. But it IS very annoying!

Happy Motoring, Mark

Skippy · #54 07-07-2015, 06:00 PM

I think I'd pull the ABS fuse if I had that problem.

dude99 · #55 07-07-2015, 06:00 PM

Quote:

On most stops, when the speed drops below 5 mph, the ABS triggers. It feels like you've just hit an ice-patch, accompanied by the click of a relay and the typical ABS shudder. On those occasions when it doesn't happen, there's no relay-click. The ABS light has never come on except for when it's supposed to - right at startup.
A shop diagnosed the ABS computer. But Toyota used two manufacturers that year - Nippondenso and Bosch - and the one used in his car is NLA!
It's his daily driver and he's gotten used to the quirk. But it IS very annoying!

That sounds a lot like a bad wheel speed sensor... Has he had it checked somewhere else? Dealers often go for the expensive fix first... If it is his ABS computer I'm sure he could find one in a wreckers or ebay.

Mark DiSilvestro · #56 07-07-2015, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skippy

I think I'd pull the ABS fuse if I had that problem.

The fuse linked to the ABS on that car also powers other essential equipment.

Happy Motoring, Mark

Mark DiSilvestro · #57 07-07-2015, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dude99

That sounds a lot like a bad wheel speed sensor... Has he had it checked somewhere else? Dealers often go for the expensive fix first... If it is his ABS computer I'm sure he could find one in a wreckers or ebay.

I believe the shop tried a used computer.
After poking round the internet last week, I'm also thinking it might actually be a sensor. But which one? Aftermarket, on the net, they're minimum $65 each for that car. Locally much higher. (Some for '90s vintage Toyotas are over $300!)
My Haynes (I have a '96 Camry) gives no information on testing them, or any serious diagnostics for the ABS.

Happy Motoring, Mark

97 SL320 · #58 07-07-2015, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark DiSilvestro

I '95 Camry,

A shop diagnosed the ABS computer. But Toyota used two manufacturers that year - Nippondenso and Bosch - and the one used in his car is NLA!
It's his daily driver and he's gotten used to the quirk. But it IS very annoying!

Happy Motoring, Mark

car-part.com is showing 40 pages of the " 92 to 96 Camey / Lexus ES300 built in Japan under right dash" ranging from $ 434 ( HA ) to $10 and 12 pages 95-96 Camry / Avalon built in N America under hood from $ 325 to $ 20

A dual channel oscilloscope needs to be put on left / right pairs of wheel speed sensors. ( If you have a 4 channel that is even better ) . One of the wheel speed sensors is making a weak signal ( low voltage ) at low wheel speed but the circuit is remaining intact. ( that is why you are not getting an open wheel speed sensor code )

It is pretty common on Fords for the mounting point to rust and raise the wheel sensor off the mounting a bit weakening the signal. Nor sure about Toyota. Wheel speed sensors are a coil wrapped around a magnet, a toothed wheel swings past the sensor generating a AC wave.

A low rent way to determine what wheel is causing trouble is to put a light across the ABS bleed / block coils for each wheel then look to see what one is flashing. The rest of the low rent test is to repin the left / right wheel speed sensors at the ABS computer and see if the problem follows. If follows, that wheel speed sensor is bad, if not following, the ABS computer is bad.

Or unplug the computer.

dude99 · #59 07-08-2015, 12:46 AM

Not sure what the wreckers prices are like by you but I'b be tempted to just buy 4 used sensors and swap them in one by one. Odds of getting another bad one are sim in my mind. Never had a problem with the Toyota ABS sensors in either our 1995 Avalon or our 2001 Corolla...

Mark DiSilvestro · #60 07-08-2015, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97 SL320

car-part.com is showing 40 pages of the " 92 to 96 Camey / Lexus ES300 built in Japan under right dash" ranging from $ 434 ( HA ) to $10 and 12 pages 95-96 Camry / Avalon built in N America under hood from $ 325 to $ 20

A dual channel oscilloscope needs to be put on left / right pairs of wheel speed sensors. ( If you have a 4 channel that is even better ) . One of the wheel speed sensors is making a weak signal ( low voltage ) at low wheel speed but the circuit is remaining intact. ( that is why you are not getting an open wheel speed sensor code )

It is pretty common on Fords for the mounting point to rust and raise the wheel sensor off the mounting a bit weakening the signal. Nor sure about Toyota. Wheel speed sensors are a coil wrapped around a magnet, a toothed wheel swings past the sensor generating a AC wave.

A low rent way to determine what wheel is causing trouble is to put a light across the ABS bleed / block coils for each wheel then look to see what one is flashing. The rest of the low rent test is to repin the left / right wheel speed sensors at the ABS computer and see if the problem follows. If follows, that wheel speed sensor is bad, if not following, the ABS computer is bad.

Or unplug the computer.

Excellent information. Thank you so much.
This is way better than anything I would ever find in a Haynes. The nearby main-branch library used to have a good set of Mitchell manuals. But several years ago, they decided to clear out their auto-repair section to make more shelf-space for computer-crap!

Happy Motoring, Mark