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-   -   Need help bleeding the brakes on a W123 240D -- tons of air (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/374927-need-help-bleeding-brakes-w123-240d-tons-air.html)

Mölyapina 01-15-2016 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mxfrank (Post 3562228)
Right answer. There is indeed an internal separator in the reservoir. If the fluid runs low while you're pumping out the rear brake, the reservoir will LOOK full, but it isn't. After a few strokes, you'll be pumping air. When I'm bleeding rear brakes I keep the reservoir filled to the brim, then suction out any excess after I'm done.

Ahh rats. So do you think that I need to re-bleed the master?

EDIT: Just re-read this and understood it better. I definitely never went that low in the reservoir -- I think that the most that i ever let the fluid drop was 1/5 of the way from full to empty.

Stretch 01-16-2016 04:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mölyapina (Post 3562261)
Ahh rats. So do you think that I need to re-bleed the master?

EDIT: Just re-read this and understood it better. I definitely never went that low in the reservoir -- I think that the most that i ever let the fluid drop was 1/5 of the way from full to empty.

I'll probably start WW3 by saying that bench bleeding is a waste of time. But it is!

funola 01-16-2016 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mölyapina (Post 3562115)
@Stretch: ................
.........
The reason I was thinking of leaving both bleeders open was in case there was an air bubble at a junction point or something that was messing me up -- is that unlikely/silly?.........

Very silly. Always work with one bleeder at a time.

oldsinner111 01-16-2016 07:56 AM

A guy on this forum taught me a neat way of getting all the air out.These cars can be a pain.After regular bleeding,if pedal is still low,take a stick,and press brake pedal overnight.For some reason it works every time.

ffgb 01-16-2016 09:35 AM

There is an internal dam in the reservoir, the front portion of the reservoir is for the back brakes and the rear portion of the reservoir is for the front brakes. When you are bleeding the front brakes, the level in the rear portion of the reservoir will decrease. But when you look at the reservoir it will still look full because the front portion hasn't decreased in fluid volume. You have to really look at the back portion of the reservoir to make sure the fluid hasn't gone down to low or else you will be pumping air back into the front brake circuit. I would splurge on a pressure brake bleeder. I bought a motive power brake bleeder. It has allowed me to pressure bleed the brakes on my 300d in 10-15min. I didn't have to bother a friend to help me. Also, since my 300d is over 30 years old, I don't know the previous maintenance history. You can damage the internal seals in a master cylinder on an old vehicle when pressing on the brake pedal to far while bleeding the brakes. Then you would have to get a new master cylinder, which is pricey. Also, I was able to totally flush my braking system with new Pentosin brake fluid with the power brake bleeder in 25 min.

MagicBus 01-16-2016 10:41 AM

Well, everyone, Molyapina just stopped by my house ten minutes ago to borrow my pressure bleeder. Hopefully, that'll help him get the job done. I'll find out later today.

JB3 01-16-2016 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagicBus (Post 3562389)
Well, everyone, Molyapina just stopped by my house ten minutes ago to borrow my pressure bleeder. Hopefully, that'll help him get the job done. I'll find out later today.

After watching your power bleeder in action thats next on my toy to buy list

MagicBus 01-16-2016 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JB3 (Post 3562608)
After watching your power bleeder in action thats next on my toy to buy list

Dude, don't BUY one. BUILD one!:
The DIY $20 brake bleeder

Mine's homebuilt. Just as good as the commercially-available one, and MUCH cheaper!

You're MORE than capable of putting one of these together in a lazy afternoon (or much faster).

JB3 01-16-2016 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagicBus (Post 3562610)
Dude, don't BUY one. BUILD one!:
The DIY $20 brake bleeder

Mine's homebuilt. Just as good as the commercially-available one, and MUCH cheaper!

You're MORE than capable of putting one of these together in a lazy afternoon (or much faster).

Thats what you did? That was nicely put together and very usable, i may do this.

Molyapina did get the brakes bled and working with the bleeder.

MagicBus 01-16-2016 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JB3 (Post 3562615)
Thats what you did? That was nicely put together and very usable, i may do this.

Molyapina did get the brakes bled and working with the bleeder.

Indeed I did. Homebuilt with Home Depot parts. Took maybe $20 to put it together. Inflation may have brought that number up a bit now...? I built mine years ago.

Spoiler alert - the car is on the road! Incidentally, I hope Molyapina doesn't mind me posting these, but I snapped a few photos when he stopped by to return the tool:

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1651/...d3ce7493_c.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1703/...e5c88e6d_c.jpg

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1682/...b27ffff4_c.jpg

Clean car. I suspect he'll be very happy with it.

Stretch 01-17-2016 01:44 AM

Right that's it I'm reporting you all - driving a Mercedes with out the star up front is not allowed!

BillGrissom 01-17-2016 04:08 PM

I use the HF vacuum hand-pump bleeder shown above, in conjunction w/ a helper at the pedal. My wife now has down the call-response method: "up-up", "down-down". The show Wheeler Dealers showed them doing exactly the same in real British English. You will suck some air past the bleeder threads w/ the vac pump, which could appear like bubbles from the caliper. If that bothers you, smear silicone grease on the threads to stop it. You should always bleed one caliper at a time, not the two you are trying. The brakes are designed with small passages so that air bubbles are swept thru. I like to use the pedal too because it helps clean the MC bore (if not new) and the fast pulses help sweep debris from the tubes. I put DOT 5 (silicone) in both my 300D's so I may never deal with rusty brake fluid again. Otherwise, DOT 4 or 5.1 (glycol) lasts longer and should be OK if you bleed thru new fluid every 4 years (depending on where you live) and if the rubber test caps on your reservoir aren't split and letting in moisture.

mannys9130 01-17-2016 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stretch (Post 3562696)
Right that's it I'm reporting you all - driving a Mercedes with out the star up front is not allowed!

Right!

:D

MagicBus 01-17-2016 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stretch (Post 3562696)
Right that's it I'm reporting you all - driving a Mercedes with out the star up front is not allowed!

Quote:

Originally Posted by mannys9130 (Post 3562872)
Right!

:D

Hold your horses, gentlemen. The car still has six stars:
  1. The smaller star in the laurel on the top front of the grill.
  2. One star on each of four hubcaps.
  3. The steering wheel center star.

I believe Molyapina intends to replace the other hood star (we searched and failed to find one in my parts stash) and the trunk star.

Stretch 01-18-2016 04:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MagicBus (Post 3562878)
Hold your horses, gentlemen. The car still has six stars:
  1. The smaller star in the laurel on the top front of the grill.
  2. One star on each of four hubcaps.
  3. The steering wheel center star.

I believe Molyapina intends to replace the other hood star (we searched and failed to find one in my parts stash) and the trunk star.

Sorry but the rules clearly state the one on the front is what matters...


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