Originally Posted by sneaky98gt

Good afternoon everyone! My name is Will, first post here. I've already learned quite a bit reading around old threads here, but still looking for some advice. If this is in the wrong forum, I apologize in advance and hope someone will move it for me.

Skip down to the bottom for the TL;DR.

Before I start, just some quick info about myself. I've noticed there are lots of international people around here, so just to clarify, I'm in the 'States. North Carolina to be specific. Young guy, mechanical engineer, and plenty able to work on things myself. I've built the motor, transmission, and rear end in my supercharged Mustang. Also have rebuilt the engine in my daily driver, an '01 Honda Civic. The point of all this, is that I'm quite capable of working on something. That said, I don't like doing it all the time, and hence why I'm here.

I'm looking to replace my current daily driver, a manual transmission 2001 Civic. I've had it for many years now, but with almost 350,000 miles on the clock, it's getting to the point where it seems like I'm working on it every few weeks. Combine that with the fact that it is so unbelievably boring to drive, and that I'm no longer a broke college student, and I'm just ready to move on.

Some more info about me: I drive around 30,000 miles a year to and from work. Literally 95% of the drive is interstate, where I ride at 70 mph with the cruise control on. To keep my yearly fuel costs down, highway fuel economy is very important to me; my goal so far when looking at a new ride has been at least 30 mpg on the highway. I have been impressed with my Honda concerning fuel mileage and overall cost to operate, and after looking at lots of different cars, I decided on getting a 2006-2007 Honda Accord, 4 door, V6, with 6-speed manual. It hits the 30 mpg highway check box, pretty roomy inside, has a nice 240 horsepower, and a nice transmission. Also, at roughly a $7000 price tag, the depreciation won't kill me on it either.

Still, it's a pretty boring car, without any real 'soul', and $7000 is on the upper limit of what I'm willing to spend for a car being driven 30k-40k miles a year. Regardless, this is the baseline I'm comparing everything to.

Enter Mercedes. I hadn't considered one during my search for a couple of reasons. 1, I'm not a huge fan of German long-term quality (or at least my perception of it). And 2, (kinda related to #1), they aren't available in a manual, or at least are very rare. I plan on driving a DD until it has at least 300,000 miles, and I tend to believe that autos, on a percentage basis, don't hold up for that long nearly as well as a manual does.

BUT, after some first hand accounts and good ole internet research, I've come to decide that a W124 Mercedes may offer what I want in terms of reliability, and whatever it sacrifices in fuel mileage, it should more than make up for in terms of a sweet looking ride with a lot of soul, as well as quite a discounted entry price well below the $7000 tag of the Accord. That being said, I still want to make an educated decision.

Assuming gas averages $2.50 a gallon over the next 3-4 years (it's currently $1.50 here, but I'm assuming it'll go up a good bit), the Accord would cost $2500 a year to drive to and from work. If I got 25 mpg from an old gas-burner W124, that yearly cost would be $3000 a year. Assuming I got the Merc for a good bit less than $7000 (which seems very reasonable), that'd be a breakeven point of several years, which I'm perfectly OK with. I'd prefer to go diesel, but it is roughly 25% more expensive here, so I'd need to get roughly 32 mpg from a diesel to equal the driving cost of a gas version (assuming it got 25 on the highway).



So, the TL;DR. What is the best gas model W124 for fuel mileage? Best diesel model for fuel mileage? Are my proposed numbers above possible (25 mpg for gas, 32 for diesel)? What are reasonable numbers I can expect on the highway at 70 mph? Best for reliability (I hear they're all roughly the same, just little quirks here and there)? I'm not particularly keen on the post-facelift models, so I want to keep it prior to 1993 or whenever they changed over. While more power is virtually always better, I'm ok sacrificing some in exchange for fuel economy.

From my reading, it looks like my best gas bet is a 260E or 300E 2.6, and my best bet with a diesel is the 90-93 300D with the turbo 2.5. Opinions?

Is $3000 going to get a decent gas model? $4000 for a decent diesel? Knowing that I plan to keep this and put at least a couple hundred thousand miles on over the coming years, I don't really want anything over 150k miles. Around 100k would be preferable, but I know those are getting rare and I'd have to pay for it.

Also, is it an option / worthwhile to swap a taller geared rear diff from some other model? I'd assume that the V8 models might have taller gears, and swapping those into a I6 or diesel model would potentially help highway fuel economy out quite a bit.

Thanks in advance for the help!

Originally Posted by babymog

Man, you have a dismal view of diesel 124s, I've had all good luck with transmissions.

Originally Posted by 83w126

As far as the W210, I suppose that the dealer isn't necessary, but there is too much you can't do at home, and that's why I don't like them. The fact that i can't fix mine without having it towed to the dealer or other shop (which with the difference in distance would end up costing the same whether I paid in labor or towing bill) is why I don't want it any more.

Originally Posted by jbach36

The 1995 has a bigger tank, something like 22 gallons rather than 18 in the other W124's. It doesn't mean it gets better gas mileage, it just means it stores more fuel.

Originally Posted by 97 SL320

Sounds like you have things worked out pretty well. A few more points.

Being a landlord is lots of work, being one long distance can be an issue so take that into consideration if you move and rent the old house.

It's good that you are getting some $ from room mates but don't count on that income, they can leave in a split second and change your situation.

While not part of your original question it was eluded to in your above post. You are applying rational thinking to $ however here is another consideration. Given you lived like a poor college student in the past run the numbers at to what financial situation you would be if you continued to do so until your house ( and other debt if any ) was paid off early. Early pay off results in interest you don't have to pay.

Going into debt for a house is pretty unavoidable, however all other forms of debt are. Student loans , car loans, credit card debt are all things that will drag you down long term and are difficult to get on top of the farther down the line one goes.

Originally Posted by 97 SL320

On the auto trans "" Are there parts kits and/or write ups out there on how to do this? ""

There are 3 auto transmissions for that era, others can tell you what specific one is used.

722.3 large 4 speed
722.4 small 4 speed version of the .3
722.5 large 5 speed version of the .3 ( not common, typically only found on the 300SL and 300 CE behind a 24 V inline 6 gas motor )

Taking an auto trans apart and putting it back together isn't terribly difficult for a mechanically minded person. There are some picture heavy threads on this site. Yes, there are lots of parts but then tend to be packaged in sections. There are some parts that can physically fit flipped over but will only operate properly in one direction so pay attention to disassembly.

The difficulty is in finding what _caused_ the failure and not just identifying the parts that were damaged. The upper half ( gear train / frictions. ) can be visually inspected, the lower half ( Valve body , governor ) is more subtle in failure and can cause failures in the upper half.

ATSG prints trans repair books that are used by professional shops. These books are ~ $ 20 + and are worth the purchase as they typically have lots of real world hints and info that can be difficult to find in a manufacturers service manual. The manufacturers service manual is a good idea too as not everything is in the ATSG manual. And, both manuals assume that the reader has some sort of trans experience.

Originally Posted by 97 SL320

A quick note on the Honda repair. While the head is off, consider changing the piston rings and rod bearings if you are going to keep this car any length of time.

There are a couple of things in play here as a mini engine rebuild will extend the overall life of the engine. Connecting rod bearings are the number one failure point on an engine. When you get a head on it with good valve seal, intake vacuum will now increase causing more oil to be drawn past the rings.

And, with new found power from good valve seal, floppy original low drag rings, the car tends to be driven harder but the bearings are worn to the point that the hydrodynamic wedge can't keep the bearing off the crank journal. The bearing touches the crank, material is rubbed off, oil clearance increases.

Originally Posted by 83w126

I am referring to the fact that buying a 95 E300D on Craigslist for $3k likely means none of the gauges work, the a/c doesn't work, the transmission is starting to slip, it needs glow plugs and at least one will snap taking them out, etc. Pleasant surprises certainly may happen, but probably shouldn't be a part of deciding if you can afford it.

Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe

For your budget and the highest MB diesel mpg, I'd set my sights on finding an 05/06 E320 CDI W211. No other MB diesel gets the mpg that the CDIs do - especially on the open road at high speeds above 40 plus mpg consistently! I'd make it a priority getting in one of these for the long term, were it me.

Originally Posted by babymog

I agree that most used cars are frustrating and unreliable, especially at that price point. The key I feel, is the price point.
If you are looking at Tdi Jettas for $3,500, diesel Dodge Ram for $3,500, BMW anything for $3,500, etc. you will have a very hard time finding one that is reliable. Even a $3,500 Honda/Toyota will be pretty worn out and often neglected (have you looked at dealer prices on Honda & Toyota?).

Originally Posted by jbach36

The 1995 has a bigger tank, something like 22 gallons rather than 18 in the other W124's. It doesn't mean it gets better gas mileage, it just means it stores more fuel.

Originally Posted by 83w126

I

Is there really a way to clear w210 transmission codes for less than $400 (assuming that a tow to and from the nearest shop and an hour labor would be in that range too)? Thats why I feel like trying to fix it is unreasonable, if that isn't the ase it may change my mind.

Originally Posted by sneaky98gt

My folks have several rental properties. Based on the amount of time as a young 'un I spent helping them clean up ones as people moved out, I've got an idea on the amount of work they can be. Lol.

I'm not using the money I'm currently making from my roommates in my monthly budget. Half of it is going towards the principle on the house (to pay it off early), and the other half is going into savings for a down payment on the next house.

And yes, I'm still very much living like a college student. I graduated with no debt of any kind (student loans, CC, car payments, etc.), which is most of the reason why I was able to buy a house so early. This car I'm looking to buy to replace the Civic is going to be the first time I've spent more than maybe $1000 since graduating.



I figured there hopefully would be. I rebuilt the transmission in my Mustang, during which I learned that it isn't nearly as complicated as most make out. But then again, with there being millions of 4R70Ws out there, there was also LOTS of info and writeups on how to do it.



That's a good call, but I actually just did that about a year ago. It was burning over a quart of oil every gas tank (~400 miles). Turns out, all the oil rings were completely seized inside the piston.

Unfortunately, I screwed up and didn't go ahead and have a valve job done on the head while everything was apart. And now I'm reaping the consequences.



I suppose we'll see. Hopefully going to look at one either tonight or tomorrow.



Not happening. Way more money than I'm going to spend, and by the time the extra cost of diesel is factored in, it's not any more economical per mile than the Accord.

Originally Posted by vstech

I have seen EXTREMELY RARE examples of the 05 CDI's sold for 3-5K...

Originally Posted by babymog

... if only there were a higher capacity tank for the wagons.

I agree that most used cars are frustrating and unreliable, especially at that price point. The key I feel, is the price point.
If you are looking at Tdi Jettas for $3,500, diesel Dodge Ram for $3,500, BMW anything for $3,500, etc. you will have a very hard time finding one that is reliable. Even a $3,500 Honda/Toyota will be pretty worn out and often neglected (have you looked at dealer prices on Honda & Toyota?).

But, if you find that gem, the one that is well maintained and loved, you should have a car that is reliable. If not, and you have the time/money/skills to make it nice, you still can have a reliable daily driver ... eventually.

Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe

05/06 E320 CDIs are available sub-$5K.. I believe you wrote "$4,000" for a 90s diesel. Strictly on dollars, the CDI would be the better value play.

Originally Posted by martureo

24 actually.

(And diesels rarely get good gas mileage)