Reduced OM617 blowby: easy - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

vstech · #16 08-03-2016, 02:11 PM

Hmm.

Interesting plan. Are all conditions the same with regard to the air filter cleanliness?

To really test this you need to change air filters each oil change. Also drive the same route and speed the entire test... You need to try it with correct oil level as well.

It is also possible your rings got oil caked on them from the froth and are now scoring your cylinder walls...

Or your old stuck rings are now washed by oil froth...
Maybe a short overfill then returned to correct level?

I STRONGLY advise you dont drive extended time with this overfilled condition...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rocket99

Ah, signs of intelligence.

I do disagree with the technical point and place more stock in what I observe as I posted than what has been mentioned by many. In fact my observation is the opposite .... with the oil kept at a higher level it consumes less. No kidding and its well worth it in effort and expense of fouled air filters too in addition to smoke, pollution etc.

Many things have been written and in settings like this any low life with a keyboard can express his problems projected at others .... only a small, actually a very tiny, proportion are technically proficient, and make sense too. Tiny.

I've noted your good intentions over the years, so I do read what you write.

This environmant, unfortunately, is like hanging out in a dive bar.

I do not think it used to be this bad. I definately no longer hang out here, so few knowlegeable folks and too many sicky folks.

The initial responses are a good example if that.

moon161 · #17 08-03-2016, 02:25 PM

I find not taking it personally helps. Some people will, with consistency take the shop manual as definitive, and use the argument to (engineering) authority as absolute justification. They still say useful things, just based in their as noted rigid framing, their form of people being people. Someone is no doubt ready to jump in and correct my use of their/there/th*r*

Is harm being done? A dude-ish frame of mind works for me here.

The upper mark, I think is to keep the fluid level below the moving crank.

leathermang · #18 08-03-2016, 03:16 PM

Moon161,
IF you are referring to me.... I am a long time hot rodder.....and as far back as the 1960 's racers were using windage trays and dry sumps to keep the oil from being foamed due to the high rpm's causing so much air turbulence in the oil pan that it was a problem... also , aside from the oxygenation point... is the fact that if the oil pump is sucking up any bubbles... it is not pumping the amount of oil it needs to... or at the pressure it needs to....
This is not Rote MB FSM recitation on my part..

Screwdriva · #19 08-04-2016, 03:25 AM

I actually had some OM617 blow by. Oil cap danced around quite a bit. I used Auto-RX oil additive for 4K miles. Now the oil cap sits perfectly still.

Stretch · #20 08-04-2016, 03:38 AM

[/OIL THREAD]

t walgamuth · #21 08-04-2016, 07:40 AM

I agree filling one or two quarts above the full mark is potentially harmful to your engine. I do keep it on the full mark though.

If you expect people to not respond to your posts unless they agree, well, that's not happening because our intention here is to help people keep their old Diesels on the road so we'll speak up if we see a post of someone doing something potentially harmful to their cars.

Some of us are more cranky about it than others.

sloride · #22 08-04-2016, 08:32 AM

I wonder if that is the same MB mechanic I ran across a while back. I went to look at a 92 300d being offered on CL by an "MB mechanic" When I got there I asked him, so how long and what MB dealer do you work for. His answer was "well I am not employed at a dealer as a mechanic but I have changed the oil a few times on the 300d I am selling and it's a Mercedes.

Rocket99 · #23 08-04-2016, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

I agree filling one or two quarts above the full mark is potentially harmful to your engine. I do keep it on the full mark though.

If you expect people to not respond to your posts unless they agree, well, that's not happening because our intention here is to help people keep their old Diesels on the road so we'll speak up if we see a post of someone doing something potentially harmful to their cars.

Some of us are more cranky about it than others.

You agree. Thats a big deal. Based on what? Something you bestow on yourself?

What I look for is intelligence and something more than heresay.

Both are so thin in this setting its become a waste of time to read anything except things written by two or three regular posters with proven intelligence, ability to communicate.

Forums generally are like haning out in a sewer because of the sick people who have nowhere else to go.

this one has gotten worse.

Its worth noting: not one person has said anything based on experience or verifieable technical reasoning. However there is plenty of mental and emotional human waste prducts being sprayed around. Its a sewer like that...

jetice · #24 08-04-2016, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rocket99

You agree. Thats a big deal. Based on what? Something you bestow on yourself?

What I look for is intelligence and something more than heresay.

Both are so thin in this setting its become a waste of time to read anything except things written by two or three regular posters with proven intelligence, ability to communicate.

Forums generally are like haning out in a sewer because of the sick people who have nowhere else to go.

this one has gotten worse.

Its worth noting: not one person has said anything based on experience or verifieable technical reasoning. However there is plenty of mental and emotional human waste prducts being sprayed around. Its a sewer like that...

Anybody with ANY experience with the function of an engine knows how harmful overfilling oil is, especially at >25% overfill. At that level, windage is dramatically increased, power is lost, and the oil starts to froth, which can cavitate the oil pump. I for one would be much more concerned with longevity of my engine over the longevity of an air filter, but it is your engine and your money, so you are free us use it how ever you like.

This scenario indicates to me that the overfilling is covering up another, potentially harmful issue.

sloride · #25 08-04-2016, 09:27 AM

There are a few threads here on in line oil separators (catch cans) home made and store bought. I think I would invest in one of those before gambling on the overfill theory.

Demothen · #26 08-04-2016, 09:29 AM

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_engine_runaway
Note that one of the potential causes is overfilling the engine with oil.

t walgamuth · #27 08-04-2016, 11:16 AM

obviously a trolling thread

scottmcphee · #28 08-04-2016, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldsinner111

Overfilling causes blow to front,and rear seals,plus all seals

ya, that's what I was thinking... fill enough to cause blockage on vents where blowby is supposed to go, and it finds new ways out.

question: when you're running over-filled, do you find your dipstick already pushed up an inch when you go to check the oil?

moon161 · #29 08-04-2016, 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

Moon161,
IF you are referring to me.... I am a long time hot rodder.....and as far back as the 1960 's racers were using windage trays and dry sumps to keep the oil from being foamed due to the high rpm's causing so much air turbulence in the oil pan that it was a problem... also , aside from the oxygenation point... is the fact that if the oil pump is sucking up any bubbles... it is not pumping the amount of oil it needs to... or at the pressure it needs to....
This is not Rote MB FSM recitation on my part..

How bout that, I would never have guessed that you were a hot rodder, nor would I have guessed that oxidation contributed to oil wear.
To list the things that I thought I knew about LM:

In texas
Worked in a spring shop
Has a W123 240D, with shop manual
Is familiar with said shop manual
Knows how many billion$ were spent developing W123
I googled leathermang once, and an article came up about an army helicopter pilot.

I have been schooled in sociability.

charmalu · #30 08-04-2016, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scottmcphee

ya, that's what I was thinking... fill enough to cause blockage on vents where blowby is supposed to go, and it finds new ways out.

question: when you're running over-filled, do you find your dipstick already pushed up an inch when you go to check the oil?

On my 85 300D I had the Dip Stick pushed up in the morning a few times when I checked the oil.
Didn`t always do it, maybe it was after an oil change and I had it to the full line. IDK.

But ya know, I drove that car a lot of miles and oil changes before it started doing it.

With the 80 240D, I notice in the morning after an oil change, the oil level
will be about 2 inches above the full line. Wipe off the stick, check it again
a couple times, and it will be at the full line.
Even during the day when it is warmed up, I check it and it will be at the full line.
Next morning it will show the high oil level.

After the engine has used a bit of oil, I don`t have the problem.

So these two indicators might have something to do with what MB sent out in their tech bulletin.
I don`t have a copy of it, I did read some time back on a post about it.
It may even be on a thread some where in the archives.

If I remember on the next oil change to cut back on one qt, I`ll see what it does.
Then add a little ea day to see where the issue starts

I probably won`t remember because my brain has, "very little sign of intelligence" as mentioned.

Charlie