How about 300SDL's and othe4 W126's?

Not old enough?

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1998 Ford Escort ZX2 5 speed - 279,000 miles My Daily

1992 Mercedes 300D 2.5 202,000 - Pure junk
2000 Mercedes E320 Black - 136,000 miles - Needs repair

Don't forget to grease the screw and threads on the spring compressor.

I dunno about W123's actually selling for over $3K in So. Cal. .

I'm here and see what I consider good cars in the Junk Yards from time to time right next to the usual clapped out beaters .

Last week I happened across a 190,000 mile 1981 300D, the paint was peeling and some boob took the rocker box off in 1997 then it sat until recently donated, straight to the scrapper where I and one other guy found it, he stripped off lots of cosmetics, I took some hard parts, last weekend was the 40% off deal so I imagine it's a shell now .

I'da paid $1,500 for it in a heartbeat knowing the engine was a crap shoot and it needed paint but it really was a nice old 'Benz IMO, NA and all .

Everyone loves my battered old 300CD T even with it's 418,000 + miles but no one offers to buy it anymore .

OTOH, SWMBO's European Spec. (yes I said it, it is so sue me) 7 passenger fully optioned TD W/ 140,000 on it, folks try to buy it every time she drives it and a few guys have summarily whipped out large wads of $100 bills thinking I'd ever sell it .

My Son said he'd like it and I don't really care 'cause it's TOO DAMN BIG so the *instant* SWMBO says " get rid of it" I'll drive it to his house and not look back .

BTW : anyone who drives and maintains a OM616/617 Mercedes Diesel is by definition a Nutter .

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-Nate
1982 240D 408,XXX miles
Ignorance is the mother of suspicion and fear is the father

I did then what I knew how to do ~ now that I know better I do better

Fact is, these old diesels are a dime a dozen
It also doesn't help that although they have bullet-proof engines, getting them to run very well and not leak is hard to do
If people buy them, they don't know how to maintain them, and then they get rid of them for the flimsiest of reasons

I was at the junkyard yesterday, and I saw a 1995 e320. Very nice interior, exterior, and clean engine bay. I'd give it an 8.5 out of 10 for its age. In the glove box, there was the smog test paperwork. Smog failed NO2 levels at 15 and 25mph a couple weeks ago, so the owner decided to use the California program where you can get rid of your car for $1k. That's well below the value of that car which only had 150K miles. My point is that with these old cars, even if they have resale value, when they get into the hands of someone who doesn't know how to repair them or doesn't care to, they will end up selling it for a lot less than what the car might be worth, thereby driving down the average price of sales. There might be a lot of good used cars out there with only a thing or two wrong with them that the owner doesn't care to explore, and that lowers the average sale price.

That all being said, I'm fairly certain that there's a cycle to cars and their values. A car probably depreciates along a curve on a graph. Then at a certain point nostalgia may take over and their value might go up--a blip on the graph that will last for a few years. Then the car reaches a certain point where a combination of factors takes over: the average amount of miles on cars of the same type on the market are so high that their value goes back down; or the mechanics who know how to fix them or want to aren't out there anymore; or government forces take over (emissions standards). All of these drive down the value of the car, or make owning one not feasible.

Then there's the final stage of evolution: the car is around 50 years old, and becomes a classic car. Excellent examples are sought-after by old timers or their children who want to restore them for nostalgic purposes. I would say that we are in the pre-final stage of these cars. They're a dime a dozen, no one wants to repair them, they're hard to maintain without leaking, mechanics who know how to fix them are drying up, and they are high mileage and high rust. In about 10 years, the w123's and w126's will become what the w114 and w115s are starting to become, which is final stage.

Anyone agree or disagree? If you agree, post a reply, if you don't...well...

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Well said SEV ! .

This is why I usually buy my vehicles at Junk Yards or Impound lots : mostly untouched originals with various niggly little things needing attention I know how to put right again cheaply .

I rarely pay over scrap value because I know going in I'll be dropping $ into parts - a - plenty .

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-Nate
1982 240D 408,XXX miles
Ignorance is the mother of suspicion and fear is the father

I did then what I knew how to do ~ now that I know better I do better

Because they were SO COMMON and so reliable, there are a ton of diesel Mercedes from the 70s, 80s, and 90s still on the road. Just go on your favorite auction site or personal sales page and you're probably spoiled for choice.

Unless you have a really nice example or something unusual or rare, you probably won't be able to get big bucks for it. Wait a few years and that may change.

Right now they're a dime a dozen. The VW emissions fiasco and the fact that fuel costs are up doesn't help their case. Compared to cars on the road 10 years ago during the last fuel "crisis", their fuel economy isn't all that spectacular anymore either.

A car's value is directly tied to its rarity and desirability. The common Joe doesn't want a "wimpy" Mercedes diesel from the 80s. With all the muscle car madness (and it's just that, sadly), they want the vintage Charger or Challenger. Something to compensate for their midlife crisis.

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Current stable:
1995 E320 149K (Nancy)
1983 500SL 120K (SLoL)

Black Sheep:
1985 524TD 167K (TotalDumpster™)

Gone but not forgotten:
1986 300SDL (RIP)
1991 350SD
1991 560SEL
1990 560SEL
1986 500SEL Euro (Rusted to nothing at 47K!)

I'd just pay attention to the w123 diesels at auction on BAT. Yes these are nicer examples, usually, but not concourse show cars.

Craigslist beaters for 2500 are a dime a dozen, i agree. They probably need 4k of work just to be road worthy.

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Andrew
Montclair, NJ
--------------
1982 300D Turbo
120k
Petrol Blue Green

Most cars are bad investments, but mostly they shouldn't be considered as such. They're tools, transportations appliances, and, if you're picky, they can be fun to drive. An older MB diesel, in particular, is a niche vehicle without broad appeal. As another poster said, ask a random friend or relative (non-car person) what they think your 30-year-old "beater" with 300K on the odo is worth. They probably think we're nuts for driving these things.

That said, for me (and I imagine for many of you as well) this is a hobby. I enjoy 1980s-era European cars, and I like the fact that my W124 is not too hard to work on myself. Which is good, because it requires lots of periodic wrenching! But isn't that part of the point? In my case, my Merc is not my only car, though I do daily drive it as much as possible.

I think the value of a clean, well-maintained W123 is actually going up, especially wagons and/or manual transmission vehicles. But the operative word is "clean!" There are many more run-down examples that, even if mechanically sound, don't present well enough cosmetically to command top dollar.

W124s I think are at or near the bottom of their depreciation curve (not counting the 500E, which obviously has more mainstream enthusiast appeal). Maybe a nicer one will be worth more in a few years as they become more scarce, and maybe as time goes on they will even acquire some of the "classic" appeal that I think the W123 enjoys. I'm not counting on it, though - I'm just enjoying mine for what it is, and have no plans to sell - least of all for a profit.

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To own something different probably resides in the hearts of a lot of members. Nostalgia may also be a component. plus the interaction on the site.

Also as a do it yourself car that is still practical to use and maintain in modern day conditions it is still fairly solid. As your first line daily driver except in limited geographical areas perhaps. Their time is passing.

In a way it is good they do not have too high of a financial value. As the average guy that for whatever reason wants to have a semi antique car is not barred from obtaining one.

It may be the time to pick up a parts car if storage of one is practical. If you intend to keep one of the 70 or 80s models long term.

I think we all got it wrong. All prices are subject to supply and demand. Old Mbz, diesel or otherwise, has a very small audiences within the car buying population. The supply may be there for w123 but the quality is not there. Supply>demand, price depressed. You may find one sold for top dollars but those are few and far between and was bought by nuts like us. So just enjoy what you have. Your friends will admire/surprise at you keeping a 30 years car on the road, give you a pat on the back. That is about it. If you enjoy that then it is all worth it, money and sweat.

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Not MBZ nor A/C trained professional but a die-hard DIY and green engineer. Use the info at your own peril. Picked up 2 Infractions because of disagreements. NOW reversed.

W124 Keyless remote, PM for details. http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/mercedes-used-parts-sale-wanted/334620-fs-w124-chasis-keyless-remote-%2450-shipped.html

1 X 2006 CDI
1 x 87 300SDL
1 x 87 300D
1 x 87 300TDT wagon
1 x 83 300D
1 x 84 190D ( 5 sp ) - All R134 converted + keyless entry.

I am finally going back to driving my 83 diesel wagon. Had a Toyota Cressida for 5 years as all around beater, but since I bought an 04 Lexus GX (for more comfy highway trips and winter driving), 3 cars was getting too much. Got less for the Cressy than I would have thought (rare rust free low kms) for reasons above (i.e nearly 30 year old heap when you can get a lease for $150 a month!). BUt it's gone, and now I'm re-enjoying my diesel wagon, and driving it all over town. what is it worth? rust free and decent interior? lots of mechanical upgrades by PO? To me it's priceless and a source of pride to own and drive. Hopefully I am never in a position where I need to sell it because the low-ball offers would drive me nuts. BTW I'm 60+ and retired, the wagon is essentially a 2 owner car I have all the records almost from day 1, and it hasn't seen many winters so no rot underneath etc.

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1983 300TD 240K - 1982 240D 215K - 1996 Dodge Cummins 70K

I don't know about the mb diesels but I looked at some used VW diesels like my Jetta wagon and they are asking more than I paid over a year ago now even with all the diesel brouhaha.

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

Notice that I've stayed out of this. To me, MB Diesels are parts cars - I trashed 2 of 'em to build Mutt. The OM617 ('85 300SD) is now living a life of leisure, going maybe 20 miles/year, along with the Getrag 4 speed ('83 240D). Of course, all those miles are at full rack but these components don't seem to mind. But it's fun to see you guys banging on them to keep them on the road - good for you!

I'd view keeping these old timers running as a fun hobby that you can drive rather than a potential investment. I've flipped many cars for profit in my years and this isn't the type of car with which you can plan to do that.

Have fun!

Dan

Having fun alone is and has value. If an old diesel car does it partially for you it is an upside. I just came back in from cutting the lawn. Using a thirty year old lawn tractor we brought new.

Why not? It runs well still needs little maintenance and the replacements in the same price range are not built as well nor have long lasting tires. The tires are still good on this one as well. It just does the job without complications. Sure there is some wear and tear but in general is not a problem.


My old beater Honda used when I got it is just approaching 60K total lifetime miles. Other than a battery and tires nothing other than the strange early failure of a tie rod end has happened.


Had it three to four years. Our dogs get transported in it and junk on occasion as well. It does not matter what it cost as it suffers as low a rate of depreciation as possible.


Perhaps cheap like it's owner but smart at the same time. It is super reliable and dependable. It just does what it was intended to Do. Starts and runs just as good as our new and newer cars.

I discovered the downside of having an older car that I know is worth more than the market will pay. I was rear ended in my cherry '87 325i a few months back. 228k, engine incredibly strong, one tiny body ding that really would bondo out easily, even a working cruise control, crack free dash, and rip free headliner. The lady driver - Toyota Sequoia - is from a well fixed background - her hubby a VP at a top software company. Good liability policy, and a good thing as the newer Honda behind me was also totaled and the Lexus I was pushed into probably sustained $2k in damage. Legal minimum property damage liability package here is $5k, not per vehicle, per incident. One friend said I should count myself lucky that the ins. co. offered my $3400 and change. I took it, after much attempting to raise it, minus $600 to keep the wreck. Everything I read said it's very hard to move them on property damage and lawyers will hardly ever take such a case because they know it's such a long shot.

I bought my 300SDL, a single owner car that spent most of its life in OR a few months back. 303 on the odo, perhaps not the smartest thing I've done but it's in pretty good shape all in all. In hindsight, I should have put in a boneyard 126 gasser odo with 150k before I registered it - not to defraud anyone - but to get a more reasonable ins. settlement in the event some clueless tank driver wipes me out. I suspect there was no history anywhere of the car's mileage. Too late now, oh well. Seems I've read that it's hard to swap speedos in these anyway, not sure.

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1986 300SDL, 362K
1984 300D, 138K

I largely agree with you. They're definitely a hobby/tinkerer car. A really nice example with low miles bought cheap and stored/maintained until the value comes back up may be a good investment, but on the whole, a car bought with the intention of selling for a profit is a bad investment. Unless it's something truly remarkable, expect to sell it for less than you have in it.

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Current stable:
1995 E320 149K (Nancy)
1983 500SL 120K (SLoL)

Black Sheep:
1985 524TD 167K (TotalDumpster™)

Gone but not forgotten:
1986 300SDL (RIP)
1991 350SD
1991 560SEL
1990 560SEL
1986 500SEL Euro (Rusted to nothing at 47K!)