190 Diesels: 2.2 VS 2.5 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

2mAn · #1 08-26-2020, 05:51 PM

Looking to finally get a 190 Diesel car and Ive found a few that have my interest.

2 are 1984 Manuals with the 2.2 and claimed 5 speed gearboxes and then theres a 2.5 NA also.

I LOVE the 2.5 and looks solid, but its thousands of miles away, and the 2.2 are much closer so Im a bit conflicted...

Can someone give me details and experience between the 2 motors and also what the potential of the 2.5 because there was also a turbocharged 2.5. Is there major differences between the 2 size motors and what are the differences between the NA and TD 2.5s

Thanks
-Simon

pawoSD · #2 08-26-2020, 10:01 PM

2.2 is naturally aspirated and makes 72 HP and about 98lbs of torque if its in perfect health. I had one, loved it, but slow as can be.

But slightly faster than a 240d. Think 20 seconds to 60 and you'll be not disappointed.

2.5 is one more cylinder added onto the 2.2, also a good motor, known for more issues with the headgasket, but most I've heard of having that issue were turbo versions. It makes around 90HP. The turbo OM602 2.5 is the most powerful by far, at around 127hp and much more torque.

If you want power, 2.5 turbo for sure. Extreme simplicity, 2.2

The OM601 2.2 is probably one of the most durable engines ever. I had one and drove it to 335,000 miles before selling and it was still going strong, zero issues.

With a manual the 2.2 probably isn't that bad. Mine was an auto and it was "bearable".

Avg mpg was around 28 in all conditions. If driving long distances under 60mph you could reach into the mid 30's pretty easily.

If living in a cold climate the OM60x series are a big upgrade over the OM61x series in winter starting and warmup too, as they have alloy heads and a more advanced design. Also no valves to adjust. They do need valve lifters if they start ticking, along with properly serviced injectors. This is a once every 150k type of service, and is not all that expensive.

Screwdriva · #3 08-27-2020, 07:09 AM

^ Agree with everything shared. The 2.5L motors didn't have severe issues at all - most head gasket problems arose due to poor maintenance or significant deviation from factory recommendation.

Go with the one with the least rust and best service records. In the end, the power difference won't set anyone's hair on fire but the rust repairs could give you a real long lasting frown.

vtmbz · #4 08-27-2020, 08:37 AM

My current 2.2 consistently gets 37+ mpg with an automatic trans, runs perfectly, starts easily and handles well. For some unexplained reason, when I leave my road to get on the highway from a stop first thing in the morning, it chirps the tires on takeoff. After it warms up that behavior disappears. I have a complete manual setup as a backup transmission, but so far I haven’t needed it. I don’t baby this car but I only drive it in the summer and keep it garaged.

2mAn · #5 08-27-2020, 10:59 AM

Thanks everyone.

Is there any difference between the OM602 long blocks, turbo and NA?

Of the 3 cars, the cleanest one is a NA 2.5 with 300k but its the furthest away from me. The 5speed 2.2 has 250k & is the closest (and most expensive! haha). The Unicorn 2.5TD has 280k, is cheaper, manual swapped but has paint and interior issues...

Theres this one too which is basically a "brand new car" haha 147k, but auto...

https://seattle.craigslist.org/see/cto/d/seattle-1987-mercedes-benz-190d-25/7179367778.html

Jay Gibbs · #6 08-27-2020, 06:34 PM

The 2.5 TD has a different block....it has (at least) piston oil squirters and sodium filled exhaust valves which the NA does not have. Maybe other differences too. My 190D 2.5 turbo never got higher than 32-34 mpg with the auto trans. I swapped in a 5 speed from a 92 190E 2.6 Sportline and my mileage surged to 40+ mpg with careful highway driving. The manual makes it a totally different and much more fun to drive car...Driven like a fun car, my average now is 35 mpg overall...

J.G.

Bob338 · #7 08-28-2020, 09:31 AM

Where are you located? I have an '85 2.2 that I'm contemplating selling. Have ALL the records. 161,000 miles on the clock. Auto tranny that I had revalved to start in first gear which makes the car infinitely more driveable. I've changed quite a few things on and in dash, including a new dashboard. I'm single, 90 years old with two cars, which I don't need. Love my GLK almost as much as this 190D.

Bob338 · #8 08-31-2020, 11:42 AM

PM's don't seem to be working for me. Email me at address in profile.

volosong · #9 08-31-2020, 06:38 PM

My '85 190D 2.2 is indeed a five-speed manual. Even with the stick shift, it is slow, slow, slow. I've been yelled at for "driving like an old man". But that was going up a slight hill with four people in the car. No wonder it had a hard time pulling the grade.

Don't drive it much and almost dumped it to a charity last week. But jump started it and drove it around the neighborhood. Too much fun to give away. On the hunt for a battery now. Not many places carry them anymore.

pawoSD · #10 08-31-2020, 06:43 PM

It uses a regular group49 battery.....they're available at most stores (or the dealer).

rmasteller · #11 09-01-2020, 12:34 PM

Simon, Have you driven any 190D? You need to experience one as a baseline, then set expectations from there.

When I started looking for my first diesel, I thought I wanted a 190D. I drove a 2.2 w/ manual and thought it was a fine enough vehicle in general, but it might have been too small for my frame (and that particular example had too many little issues). I started chasing a nice 2.5 N/A w/manual and showed it to my wife. She said it was too old for a daily driver and she put her foot down. No w202 diesels out there, so I ended up with my 97 E300D, which is roomier and was new enough to appease her. Just get out and drive one or two and be patient in finding the right car for you.

resago2000 · #12 09-01-2020, 12:44 PM

Why are all these great cars SOO far away from me?

2mAn · #13 09-06-2020, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmasteller

Simon, Have you driven any 190D? You need to experience one as a baseline, then set expectations from there.

One of the first cars I drove was my dads ‘87 190e 2.3 Auto. That car wasn’t quick unless you started in first, but overall it wasn’t bad. My first diesel car was a ‘84 Jetta Coupe with its 1.6 NA diesel, so I’m used to slow cars. Eventually it had a turbo diesel. I have a good idea of what I’m getting myself into.

I haven’t owned a diesel in a while, but if I do this right I get to have my fun car and this can simply be my “daily” however working from home means it really won’t be driven much at all but we have a young one on the way and my little MR2 definitely won’t cut it.

pawoSD · #14 09-06-2020, 10:53 PM

I converted a dead 190e 2.3 to a 190d 2.2, and oh man was it slower after that conversion. You lose about 45-50hp.... But gain about 2x the fuel economy....and 1000x the reliability, so well worth it.

2mAn · #15 09-21-2020, 12:10 PM

Still here contemplating things. Bob's car is a strong front runner now, but the Auto worries me that I will get run off the road here in Los Angeles haha

Can anyone shed some light on potential engine swaps should the bulletproof motors show some vulnerability?

Ive heard the later 6cylinder cars (like a 2.6) are the better cars to get if I plan to swap, but ideally I can keep the diesel a diesel, maybe with a 2.5TD in place of the NA 2.2 or 2.5s.. Im assuming I could commit blasphemy and swap in a gas 4cyl into a diesel 4cyl car also, but I am sure thats easier said than done...

Just thinking out loud here.

Thanks