Might Buy A Sd With A Dead Moter

[psychoman]

Well I found another 85 SD with a blown moter. They ran it out of oil. It is the exact color of the one I have now. In very good condition. AC and all doors work ok tires interior in good shape. All windows open and sunroof works. They claim the tranny shifted right. What is it worth? I need alot of little parts off of it.
But I also have a 82 TD that has alot Vacum problems and hood paint is bad tranny shift real bad. So I have thought about putting the moter out of the TD into the SD. Will it work or will I do better to sell the TD and find another motor. The TD's interior is in excellent condition. I answers are great info. Thanks Alan

[psfred]

I would personally trade motors or get a used one -- around $2000 or so for one with less than 100,000 miles. Or rebuild it -- figure on pistons, sleeves, crank grind, and undersized bearings -- also in the $2000-3000 range if you do the disassembly/assembly yourself (check with engatwork, he did a 240 last year and is thinking of doing his 300D this year).

I hate to see a good car go the the junkyard....!

Peter

[P.E.Haiges]

Psychoman,

Do you mean the SD has a bad ENGINE? Starter motOrs are easy and less costly to replace than an entire ENGINE.

What is the SD worth, what ever a willing buyer will pay for it from a willing seller but probably not more than $1000 because of the high repair cost. However if you have a good engine, it won't cost you much to replace the engine.

Whether to sell the TD and get another engine or rebuild the engine in the SD depends on what you can sell the TD for and the cost of the rebuild. However using the TD engine, you are puting in a used engine compared to a rebuilt one.

P E H

[psychoman]

Yes the engine is dead. The owner did not check oil for a long time. So you know the end result. My TD is in ok condition. You are correct about rebuilt versus used with 200000 miles. Can you get kits for these engines easy, or do you have to buy everything by the part. Could real expensive by the part. If any body is intrested in the TD email me at CALREBEL@aol.com Thanks

[psfred]

Psychoman:

Check FastLane for parts -- you will need, at least, pistons, rings, (usually as a set, I don't know how they are listed here) -- about $110 each, maybe lower. Crank may need grinding, bearing set, check rods, need rod bearings, maybe new wrist pin bushings. Unless you want to go to oversized pistons, you also need sleeves for the block (all MB cast iron blocks are sleeved -- the aluminum ones, surprisingly, are not!)

If they ran it out of oil, I suspect you need exhaust valves, too, intakes may be fine, you will need new valve guides and seals.

Total cost should be in the $2500 range, but that is based on my brother's 76 300 (non-turbo).

Ask engatwork -- he is contemplating a rebuild of a 300 turbo, too.

Peter

[engatwork]

What is a check rod Peter?

I am going to start by pulling the head on the 300D over the next week or so and try to ascertain what is going on. I got out and messed with it a little yesterday. I advanced the timing a little and it seemed to smooth it out some but I probably decimated the mosquito population in the neighborhood with black smoke . My plans are to have the authorized Bosch FI shop calibrate the fuel injection pump while it is down. My concern is when I get the engine at top notch condition I am going to have to put a rebuilt tranny in the car. It does not make any economic sense right now but will in a couple years when the oldest boy starts driving.

Anyway, rebuild on a 240D (new pistons, rod brgs, sleeves, head rebuild) came in at around $1100 or so. Cassidy (the machine shop I use) charges around $250 to go through the head. The machine shop labor on the four cyl came in at around $400 and the parts were around 4 or $500. I would suspect that you should be able to go through the 300 engine for around $1500 without much trouble as long as you do the majority of the work yourself outside the machine shop work. The most expensive part is the pistons - they were around $85/each on the 240D. I have not priced out any of the parts for the 300 yet.

[P.E.Haiges]

Psychoman,

You might not need new pistons, one of the most expensive parts, if they are not scuffed too bad. New piston rings will be needed but ring groves can be restored by a competent automotive machine shop. Measure the sleeves to determine out of round or if over size spec. Maybe you don't have to replace them either. Crank may not have to be reground, just new bearings. I can't really see why you would need new exhaust valves, also an expensive part.


In other words you have to disassemble the engine and measure and inspect to find out what has to be replaced or machined. Possibly a lower cost overhaul will be sufficient instead of a complete rebuild. Maybe a rebuilt short block is what you need. Sometimes this costs less than doing it all yourself and you get a warranty.

How long and how many miles do you plan to keep the car? This will determine in part how much you should spend on it. You will have to make this decision but it has nothing to do with the market value of the car. It has to do with how much service you expect to get from the car.

P E H

Also, if you are lucky and know someone who deals with salvage, you might get a good deal on a running car which an insurance company has totalled, then the only cost will be whatever it takes to swap out the engine, plus whatever other items you want to swap from the parts car.

Personal experience from the other side, when I hit a deer in my previous jag (88 XJ6--a year to avoid for these sedans btw), the insurance totalled the car with just buckling on the hood, dented left fender, driver's door, smashed left headlights, grill, rubbing left front tire on turns--the car was still fairly driveable, engine and transmission in fine shape, but too expensive to repair. The insurance company wrote me a check for $5300, then offered to sell me the car for $632 as I recall, the lowest of auction prices for that car in the last six months in the area. Being an apartment dweller, I had no space to keep and part out the car, but with eBay I am certain I could have easily come out ahead on that deal (the seats alone probably would have gone for double that).

Anyway, just another way to approach an engine swap.

[psfred]

Jim:

"Check (the) rods" ---! (Actually, the little device that keeps you from spending too much money -- right next to the headlight oil tank)

Since this engine was locked up from oil starvation, I would assume the bearings are melted and smeared all over the crank. May and may not have scratched it, but it will have to be polished anyway to get the remains off.

Sleeves almost certainly have excessive wear, again from no oil (and where did the oil go, anyway!).

On high milage engines, the exhaust valves are often worn to the point they cannot be ground, especially if ground once already. May and may not be true, but if you plan to reuse them, they will be bad for sure.

I don't know if you can get oversized rings to compensate for machined grooves, but I wouldn't anyway. If the lands are worn, there is a risk of complete failure later. Cheaper to replace pistons than rebuild again later! Check ring side clearance with new rings -- if out of spec, replace pistons.

Peter

Not to see a good car go to waste, but an overhaul on a Mercedes diesel that has run out of oil WILL be expensive. I rebuilt one the ran out of oil, and boy does the comprerssion from the engine do a number on lower end parts when they don't have any oil. I had to cut to connecting rods in half with a torch to get the pistons out of the engine. Without even looking at your engine in that car I can tell you that the crank will be unsalvageable. The intense heat generated by high friction ruins the connecting rods journals far beyond having the crank turned.

I know its hard to think stuff like that but that is what you'l be looking at....at least a crank and 5 connecting rods, on top of the usual stuff.

If you look carefully I picked up a used non-turbo engine for $350, I was finding Turbo ones for under a grand....you can use www.car-part.com to search for them.

Just thought I'd add some info!!

P.E.,

LOL. I knew I would see a reference in this thread to such use of terms. I expected, though, that it would be simply asking "that's great, so how about the engine condition?"

Keep them coming.


psychoman,

It sounds like you have the solution by pulling the engine out of the TD. Is the TD really bad enough to put in the scrap pile once the engine is sacrificed. Remember, these engines are EXPEN$IVE. You can do a lot of messing around to the rest of a car for what a decent engine or overhaul will cost.

Have a great day,

[P.E.Haiges]

Psychoman,

What Brandon says might correct but you will not know until you disassemble the engine and examine, measure and test the internal parts to determine what needs replacement or rebuild.

I had a 190D engine that siezed because the oil pump shaft broke and new rings and bearings got it going again.

P E H

[psychoman]

Well I went and looked at it again. The car is in very good condition. I made a mistake on the failure. The shop that has the car is selling it for his customer. The man drove the car for about 2 miles after the oil cooler line got a leak. Did not loose all of the oil but car now has a rod knock. It has oil pressure and turbo seems to spool up. The shop has a copy of all of the sevice done on the car for the last 10 years. Seems that it had oil changes every 3000 miles and all of the normal mercedes specified services. Has a new AC compressor and TXV and now is 134. I made them an offer of $500 they countered of 700 I will let you all know how it goes.Also it has new Michlin tires. Hope they sell it for $500. I might pay 700 for the condition it is in.

That is an excellent price, even if it gets turned into a parts car, its well worth it!

Now your engine repair doesn't sound to bad!!! At least it runs!

Good luck!