Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help




Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-05-2003, 01:59 PM
Diesel Power
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Unhappy BAD Sunday morning

On my way to work this morning, I heard a quck rattling noise (not internal engine thankfully), then got to watch the alternator light, and the mystery light next to it gradually increase to full brightness, and got a whiff of coolant. I also got to observe the temp guage race to the red peg faster than I've ever seen a car heat up in my life. I got it off the road and parked on a side street before any truly expensive engine sounds started happening thankfully. Anyway by the time I got home, and back to where I left the car with the truck and trailer, I had full daylight to look under the hood. I started the car and tried to see if I could get a better idea as to what died. NONE of the belts are turning, as well as NONE of the pullies - INCLUDING the crank pully. I just got home a few minutes ago, and haven't yet started dismantling the front of the car. I suspect the failure to be the water pump as there was quite the coolant mess, steam, and the overheat when all this started happening. What should I expect to find in the area of the crank pulley? I'm VERY nervous about the fact that it was also not moving when the water pump locked up. PLEASE tell me honestly that I'm not looking at a huge expensive repair. Oh yes, this will be the 80 240D.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-05-2003, 02:25 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 139
if you shut her down before it got hot, you should be okay.


sounds like you sheared the pulley from the balancer.

good luck
__________________
g-wagen
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-05-2003, 03:57 PM
LarryBible
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I will assume that is your 240D that has suffered this problem.

It is almost certain that the harmonic balancer has sheared or otherwise come loose from the crankshaft snout. This is all too common. I expect that the balancer has been off the crankshaft before.

These balancers do not have square keyway like American cars. What happens is that someone not familiar with this arrangement which consists of two round pins, simply puts the balancer on, puts the bolt in and runs it, maybe even with an impact wrench. These round pins are rarely aligned properly, so forcing everything in place is a total disaster.

The correct way to put it in place is to place it a little counter clockwise from its final position because it will turn a little as you tighten up. As it pulls about half way into place if the bolt gets tight, pull it and start over. Repeat this until it is lined up correctly. It could very easily take a half dozen attempts or possibly many more, but DO NOT FORCE IT INTO PLACE!

If you are lucky, there will be enough crankshaft snout left so that you can put the balancer into proper position, with TDC aligned, and then drill new pin holes 90 degrees from the original.

Best of luck,
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-05-2003, 05:46 PM
Diesel Power
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
This does not sound fun. Indeed the harmonic balancer is no longer attached to the crankshaft. My neighbour and I were removing the pullies to find that the water pump was turning normally. Right now we are fighting with breaking the bolt loose from the crankshaft front end. So far all we've done is shatter a 27mm socket. I'm trying to get this apart without dropping the oil pan. So far a trick shown to me by a local mechanic here hasn't worked in breaking the bolt loose. Off to the store for a new socket.................. Thanx Larry, I think you hit this one right on the head. Yes it is the 240D. I had originally forgottent to add this to the first post.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-05-2003, 05:55 PM
engatwork's Avatar
busy
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Soperton, Ga. USA
Posts: 11,968
DP - that post number don't help you any but it is one you have to get through.
You are going to have to have a HEALTHY socket to break that baby loose. I would suggest the Hazmet crank bolt socket or maybe an impact socket. A cheapie probably ain't going to do it. I have seen them broken loose by using a large screwdriver properly fitted into the teeth of the flywheel while someone else breaks the crank bolt loose. I do not have the torque figure in front of me but it is a couple/few 100 Nm.
__________________
Jim
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-05-2003, 06:46 PM
Diesel Power
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Well, we got back from Sears with new tools. The trick shown to me is to use the starter to break the bolt loose. That thing isn't budging, I've developed on nasty headache, and I'm getting too tired now to mess with it. I gotta get up early in the AM, so I'm gonna wind down, have some supper, and attack this again on my day off.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-05-2003, 07:47 PM
LarryBible
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Now that you have confirmed my suspicion, you must keep your fingers crossed that the crankshaft is salvagable.

Do you have access to an impact wrench? If you do, don't use the chrome socket on the impact wrench, you will need an impact socket.

If you can't get it, I have an Ingersoll 1/2" impact and a Snap-On 27MM deep impact socket that's made of kryptonite. I also have a small portable compressor that will run on 110 VAC. I will come over and see if we can bust it loose. I can't remember if, on the four cylinder, you will have to pull the radiator to have enough room for the impact wrench.

It will be early next week at the earliest before I can get over there though. My 300E is torn apart, and I'm quite sure the compressor won't fit in the trunk of my C. If you have everything stripped and ready for the impact, it shouldn't take long to bust it loose. I could come over one evening after work.

Good luck,
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-05-2003, 07:55 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: central Texas
Posts: 17,277
Just be sure you put the handle in the proper position... have seen some real damage doing it that way if you basic mechanical visualization is not perfect....
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-05-2003, 08:09 PM
Diesel Power
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally posted by LarryBible
Now that you have confirmed my suspicion, you must keep your fingers crossed that the crankshaft is salvagable.

Do you have access to an impact wrench? If you do, don't use the chrome socket on the impact wrench, you will need an impact socket.

If you can't get it, I have an Ingersoll 1/2" impact and a Snap-On 27MM deep impact socket that's made of kryptonite. I also have a small portable compressor that will run on 110 VAC. I will come over and see if we can bust it loose. I can't remember if, on the four cylinder, you will have to pull the radiator to have enough room for the impact wrench.

It will be early next week at the earliest before I can get over there though. My 300E is torn apart, and I'm quite sure the compressor won't fit in the trunk of my C. If you have everything stripped and ready for the impact, it shouldn't take long to bust it loose. I could come over one evening after work.

Good luck,
Thanx for the offer. I think that the A/C condenser has to be removed to get to the bolt as well, unless your impact wrench is more compact than what I'm used to looking at. I already have all of the pullies, fan, radiator, and everything else that I could possibly think of to get out of the way removed.

I don't remember what part of TX you live in. If it isn't an overly long drive to my place from yours, and we don't get this thing broke loose by next week, then I would be thrilled to have your assistance. We're gonna try the screwdriver/flywheel lock thing and use the cheater bar from hell on my next "weekend" (tues/wed). The starter trick just wouldn't budge the bolt, so I called it so as not to tear up something else.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-05-2003, 09:50 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Knoxville TN
Posts: 121
Been There, Got the Scars...

I just went through all of this, you will need, at a minimum, to replace the balancer. You can probably get one cheaper through this web site than I did, MB dealer, $180, twice. When you get the original off, you'll notice that the two pins shear axially, very cleanly, you'll hace to clean the hub ID to see them, then drive them out with a punch. In addition to the pins, replace the bolt & 3 spring washers. Removing the radiator is enough, you don't need to pull the A/C cooler.

Your new balancer won't have balancing holes drilled like the old one did, or a pin sticking out from the side. This worried me to no end. Don't let it bother you. Evidently, this balances the pully assembly, not the crank. Your engine will run with smoothly with the new balancer.

Wear between the balancer ID & crank end effectivly kills that engine. I had three different MB shops tell me I had to replace my crank. The redrilled hole trick is unconventional, but works like a charm, but it has to be done by somebody who knows what they are doing. You can't drill it by hand, since the crank is hardened and the balancer is much softer cast steel, the crank will push the drill off into the balancer and ruin it. You must make a drill guide. But first replace the balancer, and try that. If however, the new balancer slips on easily, by hand, I doubt if it will last long, mine lasted a week.

If your first repair try dosen't work, let me know, I'll try to detail the guide, and give you more info.

Good luck, Andy.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-06-2003, 01:50 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: PA
Posts: 5,440
Diesel Power,

Have you tried to heat the Crankshaft bolt. Try heating it red hot with an actelyene torch and turn while hot. This will usually free stuck bolts.

You mwy destrot the oil seal but this should replaced anyway while you have it apart.

P E H
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-06-2003, 02:10 PM
Diesel Power
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
I haven't tried anything today. I'm at work, and it'll be dark before I get home. I have a doctor appointment tomorrow AM to look at this foot problem that is refusing to go away. I'm planning on cursing it mercilessly tomorrow after I get back from the doctors office.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-07-2003, 01:09 AM
rdanz's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,158
Get the front of the car off the ground as high as you can and use a 1/2" breaker bar with a piece of pipe over it as long as you can and push with your FOOT .
Works for me!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:06 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page