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-   -   R12 to R134a conversion kit for 83 300D (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/61530-r12-r134a-conversion-kit-83-300d.html)

sdelasal 04-06-2003 05:36 PM

R12 to R134a conversion kit for 83 300D
 
Any idea where I can get one of these for an 83 300D. I'm assuming there is some kit out there with all the new seals that are required!
STeve

engatwork 04-06-2003 05:54 PM

Can I ask why you want to convert? If you live anywhere in the south it is a big mistake on these cars. Spend the extra $ on the 12 and keep it blowing COLD. I converted my 240D back to 12 and it will freeze you out - just like it should. 134 just does not work very well in the cars if you live further south than say New York state.

sdelasal 04-06-2003 05:56 PM

I live in the UK and, as I understand it, you can't get R12 any more!
Steve

DieselHead 04-06-2003 06:56 PM

I recently converted to R34 because I couldn't find anyone who would sell me the R12. I would take your car to a service place to do the conversion (take it to a trusted mechanic). These are old delicate systems and mechanics can make sure that the pressure and everything is right. Also, the receiver/dryer needs to be changed. Good luck.

Alex

123c 04-06-2003 08:20 PM

My a/c is broken, and I am not going to bother fixing it because it will cost more money than I will want to spend. I figure I can just roll down the windows and open the sunroof. This is enough to keep my cool.

kerry 04-06-2003 10:18 PM

Why the heck would anyone in the UK want AC? Wouldn't you be better off with a dehumidifier?
On a somewhat more serious note, a creative and brave AC person might fill it with propane. I understand it is standard practice to use propane as a refirgerant in household appliances in Germany.
I converted a Buick I used to own from r-12 to r-134a. Never functioned well afterwards.

LarryBible 04-07-2003 07:13 AM

sdelasal,

On the air conditioning sites they refer to these kits as "Death Kits." They are not the death of the person using them, rather they are the death of the a/c system that they are used in.

At the time of most any a/c repair, R12 is the least expensive component in the repair. Usually the part that failed that is causing the system to be repaired is more costly.

Secondly, the 123 a/c systems are marginal, there is just not enough reserve capacity to tolerate the use of 134. If you run only on the highway in one of the cooler areas of the world you can probably get by with it, but it needs to be done correctly, not with a "Death Kit."

Good luck,

leathermang 04-07-2003 10:18 AM

Kerry , How do you figure a dehumidifyer works ? LOL
Sdelasal, You can put your location where it shows on the left by your name.... that will explain somethings without an extra post...
123c, Well, with that good short haircut you sure won't have to worry about the wind messing up your hair...(mine is same way)
DieselHead, you could go on the internet and pay about $15 and take an open book test for your r12 license.. then buy it from anyone on Ebay ... or find a local dealer....

Sdelasal, The conversion kits should be available from any auto parts store... there is not one specifically for your car... just fits any R12 system... it involves flushing your system, putting new reciever/dryer in , screwing the new quick connect valves on the top of the Schraeder valves, being sure your oil in your compressor is compatible with the R134 , and has the right amount, ....and be sure to only fill the system to about 85% the weight of 134 which you would have put R12.... but I do think you need to have someone experienced pull the system to as many inches of mercury for several hours as possible... to check for leaks and to get the moisture out.....then you need the 134 gauges to install to the correct head pressure.... You may can rent vacuum machines.... and perhaps the guages... (?)...good luck... I would not mess with the ac system without first obtaining a MB factory shop manual for your car....

R Leo 04-07-2003 10:44 AM

My 134 system...
 
will freeze your a** off at highway speeds. Granted, extended idling at a stoplight will see increasing cabin temps that would be considered unacceptable in a current luxury car but, generally speaking I haven't found the conversion to 134a all that much of a hardship. IMHO-that MBZ high-volume condenser fan is a huge contributor in gettting 134a to work well down here in Texas.

I think the biggest single advantage of 134a is that the DIYer can have access to the refrigerant without being licensed, and therefore regulated, by the Freon Nazis here in the good 'ol US of A. My expereince is that most a/c shops are notorious for ripping of the customer and the less I have to be exposed to that risk, the better off I am.

SWMBOs 300D is a R12 system and it goes to the only honest a/c shop I've ever found. If it ever fails, I'll convert it to 134a and it will be DIY from there on...

I converted my prior ride (a '92 S-10 Blazer) to 134a at about 60k miles when the accumulator decided to ventilate itsself to the atmosphere. The next 30-40k miles were on 134a and the original compressor. When that compressor died, I added a supplemental electric condenser fan as a part of the repair. The additional air movement significantly improved cabin cooling at speeds under 30 mph...If I had known about those kick-a** MBZ condenser fans when I did that work, I would have installed one of them instead of the wimpy, over-priced aftermarket fan I found at Auto Zone.


Regards,
R

airfoill 04-07-2003 11:15 AM

sdelasal

You don't give details as to whether your system is in need of repair or if you just want to change over just to change. I would stick with R-12 if you can still get it in the UK if you just need to replenish a little. However, if you need to do more work on it you may want to consider the following.

My 240D was converted to R-134 when the compressor went out; however, I wasn't satisifed with the cooling results. I live in Houston and the summers here are brutal with high humidity. I wanted to reconvert to R-12 but didn't want to pay the cost of this scarce commodity. I did some reasearch and found an alternative refrigerant called Duracool. www.duracool.com

It is compatible with all oils, is non corrosive and is non-ozone depleting. The only potential risk is that this type of refrigerant is flammable. But with only about 16 ounces of this stuff, it isn't worth worrying about.

The results from R-134 to Duracool is like night and day. I had a thermometer placed on the vent to see the difference before duracool and after duracool. The temperature dropped about 10 degrees cooler with duracool as opposed to r-134. It was well worth it for me. But as somebody else has said, the 123 body style a/c is marginal. But I am able to stay cool in the summer time as opposed to the r-134 system.

From my understanding, the UK doesn't get particularly warm. Since you live in UK, r-12 or r-134 may be ok for you. You need to make the determination how cool you want to be and whether you can even get r-12 anymore in your country.

Herb
'82 240D
'87 300SDL
'92 300D 2.5 Turbo

LarryBible 04-07-2003 11:51 AM

There are a number of downsides to the alternative refrigerants such as DuraCool.

To begin with, if it is a blend and you need to add some at a later date, you will have to empty it and start over. If it is explosive as are many of them, a failed compressor could cause an explosion. To me, however, the most important reason not to use alternatives is that they commonly get recovered into an R12 recycling vessel. When this occurs that WHOLE vessel full must be destroyed. The only R12 we have left on the planet is the virgin R12 on the shelves and whatever we can recover. PLEASE don't cause contamination of recovered R12 by using such alternative refrigerants.

If you insist on going away from 12, make the alternative 134. You will be doing yourself and everyone a favor by doing so.

Have a great day,

190D22 04-07-2003 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by kerry edwards
Why the heck would anyone in the UK want AC? Wouldn't you be better off with a dehumidifier?

ACs are dehumidifiers. Open your dehumidifier in your basement, it has a compressor, a reciever dryer, and an evaporator just like the car. :)

airfoill 04-07-2003 04:04 PM

Larry,

You are right to an extent about the downside of duracool.

True, you do have to evacuate and start over if you need to add some, but that doesn't take long to do since I have all the equipment to do it with. It's no big deal, but if you do have a big leak, you have to fix the leak anyway. You would do that no matter if you have r-12 or r-134.

However, I disagree with you on explosion due to a seized compressor. In order to have an explosion, you must have the right mixture of oxygen to propane to make it burn. Another item to consider is when you evacuate the system, there is no oxygen present which is required for an explosion. When the system is charged with duracool, that is all you have, just duracool....no oxygen. If the compressor was to seize, an explosion would not occur because the essential element of oxygen is absent from the equation.

As for contaminating the existing r-12 supplies, I would never do that since I now do my own ac work myself but if I took it to someone, I would evacuate the whole system first. In addition, I have come to the conclusion that r-12 will never be available again..........a losing battle. And even if it was, I refuse to pay the exorbitant prices for this liquid gold. So why even try to use something that is now obsolete. I wish r-12 was available, I would still use it, but we've got to face reality.

Herb
'82 240D
'87 300SDL
'92 300D 2.5 Turbo

123c 04-07-2003 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by leathermang
123c, Well, with that good short haircut you sure won't have to worry about the wind messing up your hair...(mine is same way)
That is very true, I don't have to worry about the wind messing up my hair. I have also noticed that hats won't mess up my hair anymore either.

Maybe if everyone got short haircuts, then they wouldn't have to worry about fixing their a/c's.

leathermang 04-07-2003 04:34 PM

It is true that Larry had the particulars wrong... but his overall stand is correct...
Because the danger is in a collision... where the gas could be vented in a hot situation like around the exhaust or crunching metal ....
123c, You are in Washington State.... lets not try to generalize too far into the humid, hot south .... it was 90 degrees in Ausin yesterday....


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