Has anyone done the math to calculate the surface area difference between the stock air filter and the cone type filter or the K&N ?

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Diesel-guy

Better yet, does anyone have some 0-60 times, before and after the mod?

I don't think it improves 0-60 times as much as it helpes MPG, turbo lag, the overall look/cleanness of the engine bay, and bring out the oh-so-sweet turbo spooling sound.

I notice a difference in performance on a day-by-day basis. It's like a person, it has it's good, fast/"Right away SIR!" days and it's bad, slow/"screw you" days. On good days I can squeeze out 15.2seconds 0-60. On bad days, I'm lucky to make 17 seconds.

Not to be harsh, but you can KEEP the turbo noise, thank you very much! Driving around with the turbo whining up and down with the throttle gets annoying, the Volvo was pretty bad at it.

Sounds like a police siren a block or three back. I'm sure it's louder outside, too!

Peter

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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!

It sounds like a turbo-diesel to me.

Always gotta go back to the age old question- what was wrong with the original set-up? Take the test- drive with the stock set-up. Drive with the new set-up. Drive with NO filter at all. Vitually everyone who has made this comparision and posted results has had no measurable differences. Controlled, repeatable tests, my friends, are what counts.

617...Simply driving without the filter is not a proper test, because the bottleneck is not at the air filter itself. The bottleneck is due to the air intake routing. If you want to really do a proper test you should take off the platic routing from the turbo to the air filter housing and let the air flow directly into the turbo intake. You will see a faster spool of the turbo and increased performance in the upper-mid to high rpms. I have tested it, and there is a very noticable difference. My turbo spools at 2400 rpm going through the stock air-intake's twists and turns. With air flowing straight into the turbo it spools at 1900 rpm. That 500 rpms makes for a noticable difference in drivability; with the a/c running it makes a world of difference.

What's wrong with the stock system? Almost everything, except for the filter itself which is large and breathes very well. There is way too much routing, and a U-turn between the turbo and the housing. The mounting design is very poor for a diesel. It simply can not stand up to the stress that the 617 puts on it; broken mounts all the time, broken brackets all the time, broken oil return pipe sometimes. How many of you guys can make it for even twenty thousand miles without a rubber mount failing? How many of you guys can make it for 30,000 miles without the bracket rear breaking? Oh yeah, and last but not least, the valve cover is too close to the filter housing which creates a wonderfully hellish nailing sound when they jack-hammer against each other.

Reading the rave reviews of those seeing the photos . . . I am trying to figure out why I am only seeing squares with "x's" I feel like I am on a game show. Anyone able to help me with this ongoing dilemma?
Thanks
Steve

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Steve
'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
'84 300D Turbo - 122K - Driving
'77 VW Type II - 77K - Restored
'08 250EX Ninja
English Bulldog (Brier) - My best friend. Passed away 12/02/04 while in my arms.

Old post that had photos linked to a server that is no longer out there.....or to a valid server that no longer has the photos...

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Proud owner of ....
1971 280SE W108
1979 300SD W116
1983 300D W123
1975 Ironhead Sportster chopper
1987 GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 Diesel
1989 Honda Civic (Heavily modified)
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Section 609 MVAC Certified
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"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche

Many tanks . . .

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Steve
'87 300TD - 132K - Soon 4-Sale
'84 300D Turbo - 122K - Driving
'77 VW Type II - 77K - Restored
'08 250EX Ninja
English Bulldog (Brier) - My best friend. Passed away 12/02/04 while in my arms.

Wouldn't it be quicker to just dump dirt directly into the air intake?

Funny, but mine runs just fine without shaking the air cleaner off the engine. Maybe it would be more useful to properly tun the engine so it doesn't shake itself apart.

Maybe the best of both worlds be to have an external oil separator? Outside of the air filter housing, I mean.

If that would be better, why do you think they designed the two components together?

Wouldn't it be quicker to just dump dirt directly into the air intake?

Ten minutes of test driving on a calm dust free day won't do any harm whatsoever to your oil-engine.

Craig, let me ask you a question; when was the last time you checked all of your rubber mounts and all three points of your bracket? How many miles can you get out of your mounts and brackets? Usually after the rear bracket breaks the filter housing actually settles down and there is less valve cover jackhammering.

My 300sd is very well tuned; valves adjusted, injectors balanced, new rack dampener. My indy tells me that it is extremely smooth at idle for 617.

Maybe it won't hurt YOUR engine, but mine is not going to find out.

I did find one of my 300D rubber mounts cracked several months ago (because the PO had apparently removed the heat shields), and I replaced all three mounts with the correct shields. That was after I had driven the car for 140K (4 years) with the old (unshielded) mounts. I believe the bracket is original and it is solid. The engine does not shake enough to make the air cleaner come anywhere close to touching the valve cover. My idle is set at between 525 and 550 rpm. If yours is actually touching the valve cover, something is not right. Maybe the bracket is not aligned correctly. The closest thing to my filter housing is the throttle linkage bracket on top of the valve cover, and it is at least 1/4 inch away. I tried to push on my air filter, and I can only get it to move about 1/16-inch.

The larger point is that there is no good reason to molest the stock system. If something is wrong with the air cleaner mounting bracket, just fix it. The stock system works very well. I don't understand the logic of removing the cold air inlet and putting an after-market filter in the hot engine bay. I doubt these filters are as effective (at filtering out dirt) as stock filters. Whatever advantage is obtained by reducing the inlet pressure drop is probably offset by the increased inlet air temperature, anyway. I do know I would not buy a 617 that had one of these installed.

I wouldn't try to sell my car without the factory system installed either. It's not a permanent modification. Changing it back is as easy as can be. I'm not really sure what the differences are between the 123 and 126 setup. With a brand new bracket and all three mounts my housing was almost touching the valve cover with the engine off. My setup uses the factory cold air intake to a cold-air box (no hot engine air whatsoever) around a K&N filter. It is a very straight shot right into the turbo intake. Turbo spools at 1900 instead of 2500; big difference in drivability especialy with AC running.