I had my mechanic check out my A/C system because it wasn't working properly. There were two problems, one the blower doesn't cut on, and he didn't find what that is because it's apparently some electrical problem and he didn't wanna run up the bill on me. The other problem is that the A/C doesn't cool.

He says the compressor wouldn't cut on until he jump started it because the low-pressure switch wouldn't let it start because the compressor is low on refrigerant. Apparently that's the only problem with the A/C not cooling, but it's the R12 system and the mechanic says he can't get any R12.

I did some checking up on here and most people (and my mechanic) agree that R12 is better than R134a, plus the conversion would run upwards of $1000. So, the mechanic said he'd put in R12 if I can get it, and I wanted to know if any of you guys know a good place to get them. I did a search on e-bay and found this, but I'm not sure if it's the right stuff.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=33547&item=2465468612

Any help you guys can give me is greatly appreciated.

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Gabriel
'91 350SD 162k
'83 300SD 210k - rear-ended and scrapped
'84 300SD 210k - totalled

I bought it last year at Advance/Discount auto parts. It isn't on display, you have to ask for it. And when I asked for it, the kid behind the parts counter looked at me like I was from Mars - he honestly didn't know what the stuff was. Fortunately, the store manager was within earshot and he said "We keep it locked up in my office." You will have to show a 609 certification, which costs $15 and is trivially easy to get at IMACA.

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Rick Miley
2014 Tesla Model S
2018 Tesla Model 3
2017 Nissan LEAF
Former MB: 99 E300, 86 190E 2.3, 87 300E, 80 240D, 82 204D Euro
Chain Elongation References

That is the oil that's put in the system to lube the compressor. It's not R-12 or coolant at all.

Goto your local flea market and look for "Cool 12" or Freeze 12" I believe it's R-12, just not labeled exactly as such.
http://www.freeze12.com/
http://autorefrigerants.com/co00031.htm

Freeze12 is not R12!!

Oh my goodness, let the refrigerant wars commence.

For the newer folks here, take a peek at this: R-12 Alternatives.

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Rick Miley
2014 Tesla Model S
2018 Tesla Model 3
2017 Nissan LEAF
Former MB: 99 E300, 86 190E 2.3, 87 300E, 80 240D, 82 204D Euro
Chain Elongation References

OK, I'm new to this board but I'm MACS Cerified and can straighten you out on a couple things.

Yes, that stuff on ebay is R12 refrigerant with an oz. or two of oil in the can. Buy it, get a can tap and top off your system.

No, that Freeze12 crap is not R12!! God knows what it is, but probably R22 or R134.

No, R134 isn't as good as R12 if you ask me, but it's just my opinion.

No, retrofitting an R12 system to R134 doesn't cost $1000. Recover what R12 is left, change the reciever/drier, maybe drain the old oil from the compressor if it's easy to get to, add a few oz. of PAG oil and some UV dye, change the charge ports, vacume for a good long time and re-charge. You'll take about 15% less R134 in the system but it should work ok and be cheaper to fix when the next problem occurs.

jim

Dude,
You better get your flame suit back from the cleaners....you can always tell that summer is here, oil and GP wars end and the refrigerant wars begin.

FWIW, I have an R12 W123 and a R134a W123...there's NO comparison on the cooling. On a hot summer day in the 134a car, you might as well bring soap and a towel; in the R12 car you'll need a light jacket.

Wanna guess who gets to drive the hot one?

__________________
Never a dull moment at Berry Hill Farm.

So I read some of the thread that Rick Miley pointed to, and I followed some of the links you guys posted, and it seems that the Freeze12 is not R-12, it's just some form of R134a.

That link for the certification to buy R12 was great, but I still don't know where to get R12. I called around at the local shops and they don't carry them, and the ones that used to quit selling them because they sold for about $1200 for a 30lb cylinder. The two problems with that is that I don't have $1200 nor do I want 30lbs. I just want 3lbs for like $100 (I hear it's supposed to cost around $30 per pound).

So, any tips on where to get actual R12, not Freeze12, and in small quantities?

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Gabriel
'91 350SD 162k
'83 300SD 210k - rear-ended and scrapped
'84 300SD 210k - totalled

Autozone
O'reilly's
Pepboys

I know O'Reilly's sells it in 12oz cans.
Dave

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1970 220D, owned 1980-1990
1980 240D, owned 1990-1992
1982 300TD, owned 1992-1993
1986 300SDL, owned 1993-2004
1999 E300, owned 1999-2003
1982 300TD, 213,880mi, owned since Nov 18, 1991- Aug 4, 2010 SOLD
1988 560SL, 100,000mi, owned since 1995
1965 Mustang Fastback Mileage Unknown(My sons)
1983 240D, 176,000mi (My daughers) owned since 2004
2007 Honda Accord EX-L I4 auto, the new daily driver
1985 300D 264,000mi Son's new daily driver.(sold)
2008 Hyundai Tiberon. Daughters new car

Shell "Quick lube" will charge with R12 for about $70 per pound.

Even if you did find it, you will need the 609 license to purchase it.

There are several retailers that sell it regularly on ebay(I have bought some, don't remember the name). You can buy 2 12oz cans and the tap for about 69.00

More importantly, you should find out why the sytem is low as it has a leak somewhere and you would just throw your money away. Never mind the legalities.

Do a search and you will find lots of verbal warfare regarding refrigerants.


:p

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Enough about me, how are you doing?

If you get the certificate you can buy a few cans or a cannister on ebay. No problem.

Good luck,

Yes the certification is only like $20, simple open notes & select the right answer type test. After being certified you can buy the R12 at fairly cheap prices, probably the easiest to find it on ebay. The certification type you want is the EPA609, I got my certification just to buy a couple cans of it plus is sounds nice.

EPA609 Certified by Mainstream Engineering

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Jeff M.
Mercedes W123 DIY pages are now located here.
1983 / 1984 300D Sold
2000 CLK430 Cabriolet ~58k Sold
2005 Avalanche 4x4 ~66k

How easy is "easy" to get the license?

I need to re-do the a/c on my truck; there's no actual leak, but I got some air trapped in there...and it'd be nice to put R12 back in. With doing it yourself, how does R-12 compare to R-134 in terms of price?

Heck, for that matter, maybe I could convert the car back to R-12...the R-134 isn't really cutting it, particularly for this polar bear.

I don't even want to think about AC..


I have r134 in mine, and on the upper 60 degree days lately, it's been nice and cool. But I know good and well on the really hot days in the suummer it will be all but useless. 134 just don't cut it in a lot of vehicles.

My father, a helo pilot/mechanic and an automotive tech in the 60's, been AC certified longer than many of us have been alive, swears some of the r-12 alternatives are a better deal than r-134.
He's used them in older VW's with good success(COLD!) and they seem to still be cooling years later. I personaly have read all sorts of nasty stuff about the different types of *fake* r-12 there is out there and the thought bothers me. However I may give in at some point.

I'm just glad I have a sun roof... yay for vintilation..


Too answer the questions, as others have, autozone, advance auto, parts america, napa, etc, etc. Might take some calling, not all stores have it, but some will. Make SURE the leak is gone first, or your tossing money away.

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One more Radar Lover gone...
1982 VW Caddy diesel 406K 1.9L AAZ
1994 E320 195K

Ridiculously easy. It is an open book test on the internet. So you open two browser windows - have the test in one while you look up the answers in the other. I did it in under 30 minutes. At the link I posted above, the cost is only $15 and you get a certificate you can print out right away. Then they send you an "official" certificate and wallet card in the mail.

__________________
Rick Miley
2014 Tesla Model S
2018 Tesla Model 3
2017 Nissan LEAF
Former MB: 99 E300, 86 190E 2.3, 87 300E, 80 240D, 82 204D Euro
Chain Elongation References