Let me get my calender out and mark this day.....

PEH, after checking my calender I find that we agreed once in my first year on the forum...
You had posted your annual ' Going South' thread... and said you would be out of touch... and I suggested that you stop by the local library once in a while in order to not get too far behind ... you did and got an important message from someone .... and posted and thanked me for the suggestion...

When I bought my 409d, (617 engine)it only had an electric fan due to the fact that the visco and mechanical fan had been damaged in an accident. The electric fan could not keep up under heavy load conditions. I have since re-installed a mechanical fan and the temperature is much more consistent across a wider range of conditions.
I would not remove a functioning visco and mechanical fan.

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1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13

Leather,

Yes, I remember that, I just didn't remember it was you. Its this damn CRS (can't remember ****) disease I have.

I used the library computers in Kissimmee and New Orleans again this year.

P E H

Had the largest aftermarket electric you could get mounted as a puller (the stock plastic fan had one blade broken and couldn't find a junkyard one.) Still was hotter than I liked (up to 100C most of the time with "spirited" driving.)

Then decided to wire in the front AC fan to the same relay so it would come on with the puller.

No change.

So I decided the cheap waterpump I replaced the leaking stock one with (the un-balanced fan probably drove the bearings out in 250k) was, well..., cheap. So I Installed a NEW Laso pump.

No change.

Then I found (thanks to grimgaunt calling me from a junkyard to tell me where there was a car with the 9-blade plastic fan) a stock fan and installed it, removing the electric.

No change in temp, but the car doesn't "feel" as "peppy".

Then I decided maybe the stock clutch was carp. Installed a good stiff one from a junkyard.

No change.

So now it's looking like a new rad is the ticket (cleaned and power-washed the fins out a while back and the engine has been citrus flushed twice with MB coolant used.)

With my luck lately, I'll have a new rad in and it'll STILL run the same temp.

That's going to be the signal to drive the car down to the ft carson arty range and see how precise the guys are at targeting!

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1984 300D Turbo - 4-speed manual conversion, mid-level resto

1983 300D - parts car

1979 300TD Auto - Parts car.

1985 300D Auto - Wrecked/Parts.


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"If you don't know where you are going, any road will get you there". Lewis Carrol

The fan draws 9.5 amps at full power and varies in speed from 60 to 100% depending on radiator temperature (we'll have to see how that works). I'm installing a new 115A alternator anyway, because my old 65A one just barely cuts it now and when I go on a road trip this summer I may have both a cooler and a laptop plugged in as well.


LOL, are you nuts? I think most people here would rather go broke and live in their cars than not use them .


I dunno, we seem to have fairly strong evidence that being 57 doesn't keep some politicians from being a braindead monkey .


I have to say, you old people () have really lost your sense of adventure. If it doesn't work, it shouldn't take more than half an hour to make it stock again!

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'81 300TD Wagon 355k (Miss Diesel)
'83 300SD 180k
'84 500SEL 190k (Parting it out)

No. But it USED to get to 80C and just stay there.

Thermo is a new Wahler, tested pre-instal, and can only be installed in one drirection and has an air-bleed hole in it. Tested it again when I replaced the H2O pump the second time and it still starts the open EXACTLY at 80C.




Oh great. Was thinking of buying the Nissans hoping it would be a better rad than the POS Behr. Guess I'll have to think again. Problem is, the Behr is about 2X the price of the Nissans. For $400 for plastic tanks, .... I'd rather adapt in a super-duper custom! Maybe find a Toyota rad that I can fab mounting brackets for.

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1984 300D Turbo - 4-speed manual conversion, mid-level resto

1983 300D - parts car

1979 300TD Auto - Parts car.

1985 300D Auto - Wrecked/Parts.


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"If you don't know where you are going, any road will get you there". Lewis Carrol

Tsk tsk. Don't you know nothing will ever work as well as the STOCK configuration? The MB engineers are omniscient!

Oh, I see from your profile that your birthday is "N/A". My apologies. I guess an immortal might actually have a little experience up his sleeve .

I found this thread that looked kind of interesting:
Broken rad neck:Nissen/Behr/temp fix >tradein?

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'81 300TD Wagon 355k (Miss Diesel)
'83 300SD 180k
'84 500SEL 190k (Parting it out)

81wagon

I bought my first Mercedes (a 62 190C) a year before you were born - I made lots of "performance enhancing" modifications to that car and I pretty much ruined it. Of course I did learn quite a bit while performing my "enhancements" so I guess there is an upside here.

One of the reasons I enjoy driving MB cars is that they are, for the most part, very well thought out. For years the slogan was 'engineered and built like no other car in the world' and at the time your car was built it was pretty much true. Its less true today.

If you want to mess around with a new fan, relays, wiring, engine temp sensors, control circuts for a variable speed fan, fuses, upgraded alternators, fabricating brackets to hold the new fan, removing the existing mechanical and electircal fans, figuring out how to make sure that the A/C pressure switch trips the "enhanced" fan circutry so that A/C condensor pressure does not get too high (this is already handled by the substandard stock set-up) so that you can get an additional 1-2 horsepower have at it.

But don't kid yourself that you are improving the car - In most cases the way it was built is the best blend of performance and relibility. This is a classic example of this truth.

Nissens..................lets start another thread on this and I can tell you about the machine applied (minimal solder to save cost) issues with mass produced metal radiators. This was for a Volvo and I had to pull it twice after one year for 2 diferent seam splits.

The last radiator I bought for my 300D was a Radiators.com unit that was made in South Africa for Valeo (sp?). Fit perfect for $190. Its was a plastic tank knock off of a Behr.

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84 300DT Puke Yellow. Totalled after 438,000
84 300DT Orient Red. 169,000 (actual mileage may vary)
2002 Explorer EB (wife's)

Well I can't resist, I have to chime in here:p Lets see first of all in 1981 I was crusing around the western Pacific courtesy of the US Navy and spent Christmas in Hong Kong. At the time my car (at my home port) was a 74 Audi Fox that I had bought new. It had an electric fan set up, front wheel drive, but the engine was not transverse. The fan never did keep up with the SW US heat (AZ and NM) during the summer months - any hill climbing or driving over 55 required the AC to be off unless you wanted to redline the temp guage. If you look at the physics of it with an electric fan you are converting mechanical energy to electrical then back to mechanical. There ARE losses at each conversion. The electrical set up does give you some ability to store energy in the battery. The mechanical fan uses the most HP when the engine is hot (fan clutch engaged) and high RPM. In most cases, this is where you least notice it as the the high end is where the HP is greatest. If you are in traffic on a hot day, I doubt that even the 105 Amp Alt will keep up at low engine speed with A/C on and the engine fan running. Remember, that 105 Amps is only at high RPM. But having said that, give it a whirl. I just like to keep it close to stock so that when it breaks, my indie doesn't blame my modifications (boy do I hate those kind of looks!)

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D. Blake
86 300SDL 340K (for sale)
83 300SD 205K (gone)
06 Chevy K3500 LBZ CCLB 50K
94 Chevy K2500 6.5L TD 250K (gone)

While I am not usually one to speak against modification from stock, in this case I will. Several noted hot-rodding magazines have done dyno tests testing power losses with flex fans, direct drive fans and the thermal/viscous type. A correctly functioning thermal clutched fan draws the LEAST horsepower. How about NONE when it is freewheeling, since it only really functions in traffic on hot days. At highways speeds, or really any speed above 30mph there is usually enough ram air to cool the engine and the clutch disengages allowing the fan to freewheel. The only application I can see an electric being beneficial for is a tranverse motor or an exceptionally tight engine compartment. And then you can throw in all the other stuff mentioned above too. RT

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When all else fails, vote from the rooftops!
84' Mercedes Benz 300D Anthracite/black, 171K
03' Volkswagen Jetta TDI blue/black, 93K
93' Chevrolet C2500HD ExCab 6.5TD, Two-tone blue, 252K

The electric fan will turn off in either of these situations also.

How much HP does the stock fan use, anyway? I have to admit I don't even know. The electric fan shouldn't take much more than 1/3 at full speed. The others who have tried it on this board seem to agree that there's a slight improvement. Whether it's worth the potential risks is up to you; I'm willing to give it a shot. As I said, it's an easily reversible modification if it doesn't work out.

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'81 300TD Wagon 355k (Miss Diesel)
'83 300SD 180k
'84 500SEL 190k (Parting it out)

Getting rid of the shroud and the air blowing all over when your working underhood with the engine running is almost worth it alone. I've been swaping old V8 cars over to aluminum radiators and aftermarket electric fan setups for awhile now, everyone's been perfectly content with them. If your trying to run R134 the extra airflow on demand(manual switch) might be helpful around town.

I've read those articles that test parasitic loss from flex fans(junk) and electric and clutch fans as well. I'm sure there right about the clutch setup drawing less power when it's freewheling.
I've never gone out of my way to retrofit a functioning setup, but there generaly unattractive and anoying to work around. And in the case of the C3 vette, just don't move enough air(and god that shroud!). Granted most of this does not apply to an old Mercedes, but it's still true.

What do the new MB's use?

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One more Radar Lover gone...
1982 VW Caddy diesel 406K 1.9L AAZ
1994 E320 195K

I installed the electric fan three hours ago and then went on a two-hour drive (the nearest huge hill - the Conejo grade in Camarillo - being about an hour from here).

First impressions:

The coolant temperature at idle seemed just a touch higher (a few degrees) with the electric fan compared to the stock one. I will set it to come on at a slightly lower temperature and see if that changes anything.

The car has a tiny bit more pep starting from a stop. Getting rid of the stock fan seems to have had a bigger impact on freeway driving - I don't have to push the throttle near as much to stay at a steady speed (hopefully this means better milage, and judging by the fuel gauge and odometer this past couple hours that could very well be the case).

Going up the Conejo grade (7-8% grade for a mile and a half) the coolant temperature rose to 108 or so, again just a little more than with the stock fan. The extra power I seemed to have on the freeway was doubly apparent here - in an empty car I used to be lucky to get to the top going 70 mph; today I hit the top at 75 and I wasn't even flooring it until halfway up .

One of the biggest differences, and something I completely wasn't expecting, is that the car is now much quieter on the freeway! I can't explain it, but I'm not going to complain .

I still have more testing to do; I'll see how it performs over the next few days... But so far, i'm very happy!

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'81 300TD Wagon 355k (Miss Diesel)
'83 300SD 180k
'84 500SEL 190k (Parting it out)