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  #16  
Old 05-30-2017, 12:39 AM
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Dieseldiehard
 
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Location: Bay Area No Calif.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diseasel300 View Post
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Will the ALDA adjustment tune the entire fuel band? Or just the "on-boost" fuel band? Additionally, is leaning out the ALDA going to make the off-boost 500-2000 RPM range even more of a slug?

The smoke wasn't as bad with the old Bosch India injector nozzles, but the engine also didn't run anywhere as well or with as much power as with the new Monark nozzles that are installed now. I'd assume leaning up the fueling will have a direct correlation to fuel economy numbers as well. I currently get 26-27mpg in city traffic, but only 23-24mpg on the highway in 75mph interstate driving. I'd have expected that second number to be higher than it is, but running rich would certainly explain it.
Leaning the ALDA will reduce fuel during boost, you don't want to mess with that. I wonder how you came up with better mileage figures in city driving? that is opposite what you should have could it be a measurememnt error?

I just got a set of Monarks for my '99 turbodiesel. Oddly though they were marked ECS or something but they came from Germany by a seller who claimed they were Monarks. Tomorrow I will find out how they perform after they get installed, along with new seals.
The reason for changin is because I have nailing after a recent valve job and its my hope that the nozzles are the cause. Performance is fine but the nailing I can't stand.
DDH
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'00 E320 (wifes car), '95 E320 Wagon my favorite road car. '99 E300D wolf in sheeps body, '87 300D Sportline suspension, '79 300TD w/ 617.952 engine at 367,750 and counting!
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  #17  
Old 05-31-2017, 08:44 AM
WTB: 94/95 E320 Wagon
 
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My first set of "Monark" nozzles from a seller in Germany also did not have Monark markings, but some other brand. I was a little upset at first, thinking I'd been had, but then I researched the mark and found out it was a brand owned by Monark, so all was good.
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'87 124.193 (300TD) "White Whale", ~380k miles, 3.5l IP fitted
'95 124.131 (E300) "Sapphire", 379k miles
'73 Balboa 20 "Sanctification"
Charleston SC
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  #18  
Old 05-31-2017, 09:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieseldiehard View Post
Leaning the ALDA will reduce fuel during boost, you don't want to mess with that. I wonder how you came up with better mileage figures in city driving? that is opposite what you should have could it be a measurememnt error?

I just got a set of Monarks for my '99 turbodiesel. Oddly though they were marked ECS or something but they came from Germany by a seller who claimed they were Monarks. Tomorrow I will find out how they perform after they get installed, along with new seals.
The reason for changin is because I have nailing after a recent valve job and its my hope that the nozzles are the cause. Performance is fine but the nailing I can't stand.
DDH
Under boost is where I was having the most problems. Soon as the turbo would spool up and a heavy load, BIG smoke. Leaning the ALDA has put an end to that, with no affect to drivability or power.

Around town, most of our speed limits are 30 or 35. No boost there since the engine is usually running around 1500 RPM or less. Overfuelling under boost would explain why the in-town mileage was ok, but the highway mileage was utter crap.

I went to Monark nozzles after being disappointed with the random failings of the Bosch India nozzles I had. You won't be disappointed. All things being equal, the engine seems much more lively with the Monark nozzles installed.
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  #19  
Old 05-31-2017, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diseasel300 View Post
Under boost is where I was having the most problems. Soon as the turbo would spool up and a heavy load, BIG smoke. Leaning the ALDA has put an end to that, with no affect to drivability or power.

Around town, most of our speed limits are 30 or 35. No boost there since the engine is usually running around 1500 RPM or less. Overfuelling under boost would explain why the in-town mileage was ok, but the highway mileage was utter crap.

I went to Monark nozzles after being disappointed with the random failings of the Bosch India nozzles I had. You won't be disappointed. All things being equal, the engine seems much more lively with the Monark nozzles installed.
I suppose by leaning the ALDA you altered the fuel delivery curve that was set in the IP for the 3.5l engine. sure cheaper than rebuilding the IP. I was lucky the fellow I had do the job to mine had a scrap IP he salvaged the capsule out of.
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  #20  
Old 05-31-2017, 03:14 PM
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The original IP off this engine is trashed due to a failed ball bearing on the main camshaft. Due to the excessive runout, the governor and torque capsule are garbage on the original pump. Since this is IP #3 on this engine, I'll take my chances fiddling with the ALDA. Not really in the mood to replace the IP again or spend money on #4.

It may not be the factory fuel curve, but it beats the heck out of what it was doing, and 25+mpg out of a 1980s barge doing 85+ on the highway is pretty respectable in my book.
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  #21  
Old 06-01-2017, 10:45 PM
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Dieseldiehard
 
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Report on New ECS aka Monark Injector NOZZLES!!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Diseasel300 View Post
(cut)

I went to Monark nozzles after being disappointed with the random failings of the Bosch India nozzles I had. You won't be disappointed. All things being equal, the engine seems much more lively with the Monark nozzles installed.
Wow I am really happy now! my engine is running and IDLING BEE-Yoo-Tea-Full !! it just purrs! like it should.
The pop spray test was not the final determination but the noisy idle was the final straw that led me to buy the Monarks and I really should have had them on hand while the head was being reassembled.
I ran the car a few weeks until I couldn't stand the noisy idle anymore and ordered the nozzles from Germany (thanks ECS who ever you are!)
So I had to remove and replace the injectors. I was able to reuse the Viton return lines fortunately, thats tough stuff!
The only minor glitch was the heat shields I ordered were the wrong type so I had to reuse the old ones - that appears to be no problem, based on the way this engine runs and idles now its really great!

Next time (uh, like there will never be another NEXT TIME to rebuild a diesel for old DDH !?) anyhow for those folks considering rebuilding a diesel with over 150K or more on it and you don't know the history on the injectors, just replace the nozzles just do it! OK? you won't regret it!
DDH
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'00 E320 (wifes car), '95 E320 Wagon my favorite road car. '99 E300D wolf in sheeps body, '87 300D Sportline suspension, '79 300TD w/ 617.952 engine at 367,750 and counting!
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  #22  
Old 06-01-2017, 10:51 PM
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Dieseldiehard
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diseasel300 View Post
The original IP off this engine is trashed due to a failed ball bearing on the main camshaft. Due to the excessive runout, the governor and torque capsule are garbage on the original pump. Since this is IP #3 on this engine, I'll take my chances fiddling with the ALDA. Not really in the mood to replace the IP again or spend money on #4.

It may not be the factory fuel curve, but it beats the heck out of what it was doing, and 25+mpg out of a 1980s barge doing 85+ on the highway is pretty respectable in my book.
OK, wow I see your talking the S body here.
That's a very good mileage figure from that barge! Did you use a special wax on it to help out?
I am lucky to get that on my lighter '87 300D with no AC.

I'll have to take a trip with the '99 turbo to see what mileage it figures out, if you trust the OBC displayed figure. I do. Never had reason to think it wasnt 32.5mpg because that was what it showed at 65-70 mph in cruise and the tank figure supported that on my return of a 400 mile trip.
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  #23  
Old 06-02-2017, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieseldiehard View Post
Wow I am really happy now! my engine is running and IDLING BEE-Yoo-Tea-Full !! it just purrs! like it should.
The pop spray test was not the final determination but the noisy idle was the final straw that led me to buy the Monarks and I really should have had them on hand while the head was being reassembled.
I ran the car a few weeks until I couldn't stand the noisy idle anymore and ordered the nozzles from Germany (thanks ECS who ever you are!)
So I had to remove and replace the injectors. I was able to reuse the Viton return lines fortunately, thats tough stuff!
The only minor glitch was the heat shields I ordered were the wrong type so I had to reuse the old ones - that appears to be no problem, based on the way this engine runs and idles now its really great!

Next time (uh, like there will never be another NEXT TIME to rebuild a diesel for old DDH !?) anyhow for those folks considering rebuilding a diesel with over 150K or more on it and you don't know the history on the injectors, just replace the nozzles just do it! OK? you won't regret it!
DDH
Give it a couple thousand miles and some drive cycles and it'll really quiet down. I've been very happy with how my Monark nozzles perform. When they wear out (assuming I ever drive that many miles in this car or the engine lasts that long) I'll replace them with the same nozzle again. The cold start performance alone is worth the upgrade. Never a miss, never a shudder. Starts on the 1st compression hit after a 3-5 second glow cycle. Can't complain. Not one bit.
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The Diseasel Thread - Everything You Didn't Know You Wanted To Know
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  #24  
Old 06-04-2017, 09:11 AM
WTB: 94/95 E320 Wagon
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieseldiehard View Post
The only minor glitch was the heat shields I ordered were the wrong type so I had to reuse the old ones - that appears to be no problem, based on the way this engine runs and idles now its really great!
Bzzt, wrong, you DO need new heat shields! Your engine may run fine at first, but eventually the increased heat will cause deposits on the injectors tips and more poor running.

The only way I'd re-use them, temporarily, would be after bending them back into original shape so that they form a seal against the injector nozzle again.
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M. Dillon
'87 124.193 (300TD) "White Whale", ~380k miles, 3.5l IP fitted
'95 124.131 (E300) "Sapphire", 379k miles
'73 Balboa 20 "Sanctification"
Charleston SC
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  #25  
Old 06-04-2017, 07:33 PM
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"Bzzt, wrong, you DO need new heat shields! Your engine may run fine at first, but eventually the increased heat will cause deposits on the injectors tips and more poor running."
Darn it all, is that true?

well, you say bend them back? implying they get bent after they are installed and torqued down? its a huge pita to have to pull the lines then remove the injectors all over again. And I wouldn't bother re-using them againg. Knowing what I know now.
I wish I had the correct heat shields in the first place. Can't say where I got the p/ns. But I'll be listing them FS sometime.
DDH
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  #26  
Old 06-05-2017, 01:51 PM
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Well, it is much less costly (and the same work, pulling and installing the injectors) to fix it now rather than later.

Another fellow on this forum posted his method, basically he used a large ball bearing to push the inner ring back up (toward the injector) so that the inner ring contacts the face of the injector nozzle to make a seal when the injector is tightened down.

I've done this myself for a short term fix and it worked fine.
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Respectfully,
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M. Dillon
'87 124.193 (300TD) "White Whale", ~380k miles, 3.5l IP fitted
'95 124.131 (E300) "Sapphire", 379k miles
'73 Balboa 20 "Sanctification"
Charleston SC
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  #27  
Old 06-05-2017, 02:00 PM
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Here's a thread that pertains, with pictures.

Do I NEED new injector heat shields?
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Respectfully,
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M. Dillon
'87 124.193 (300TD) "White Whale", ~380k miles, 3.5l IP fitted
'95 124.131 (E300) "Sapphire", 379k miles
'73 Balboa 20 "Sanctification"
Charleston SC
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  #28  
Old 06-06-2017, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxbumpo View Post
If there is too much fuel for the air, it has a cooling affect, which reduces the heat of compression, which reduces efficiency, which means even less fuel is burned (kind of a down-ward spiral) so you get even more smoke and overall less power.

I need to do both of the same adjustments (ALDA and max RPM on the governor) on my '87 wagon with 3.5 liter pump.
Excess fuel raises egt in a diesel. It is less efficient, due to suboptimal afr. But egt skyrockets. Where are you getting this info about excess fuel cooling combustion temps?

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  #29  
Old 06-06-2017, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atypicalguy View Post
Excess fuel raises egt in a diesel. It is less efficient, due to suboptimal afr. But egt skyrockets. Where are you getting this info about excess fuel cooling combustion temps?
Uhh, I read it on the internet???

Usually in a diesel engine, there is excess air for the amount of fuel, and so adding more fuel will indeed increase the EGT, because all of the extra fuel gets burned. Think of this as a curve. At the early part of the curve, adding fuel will increase heat. However, if one continues to add fuel until there is an excess of fuel to the air, the fuel will not burn, and black smoke (un-burned fuel) is the result. You may be correct that EGT will continue to increase, but my intuition is that because that excess fuel is NOT burning, it will be absorbing heat and reducing EGT.
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Respectfully,
/s/
M. Dillon
'87 124.193 (300TD) "White Whale", ~380k miles, 3.5l IP fitted
'95 124.131 (E300) "Sapphire", 379k miles
'73 Balboa 20 "Sanctification"
Charleston SC
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  #30  
Old 06-07-2017, 10:52 PM
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I can buy the argument that running rich does cool the combustion temperature. When the fuel/air ratio is correct, the combustion occurs in the combustion chamber, very rapidly, almost a detonation. If the mixture is too rich, the burn won't happen as quickly or as fully and the rest of the combustion will take place in the exhaust manifold as the gas expands (high EGT's). I'm not a combustion engineer or an engine mechanic, just a theory.

What I can say is that my car has been much happier since tuning the ALDA. I wound up a full 3 turns CW. Just about 1/4 turn CCW from fully CW. No smoke, good power, smooth running, and the fuel consumption has gone down significantly. Currently a little over 280 miles on 1/2 tank of fuel.
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The Diseasel Thread - Everything You Didn't Know You Wanted To Know
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