Options for performance V8 & V12
 

Hey!

I would like to learn about the performance potential for the Mercedes V8 & V12 engines. I am particularly interested in the 1990-2002 SL500 and 1993-2002 SL600 engines. Are there performance shops that can build a Mercedes engine with light weight reciprocating mass with high RPM potential? I would like to find out the horsepower potential of the factory fuel injection system and limitations. Are there knowledgeable Mercedes custom cam grinders? I am not interested in superchargers or turbos or larger displacement. I like a built engine that revs!

Thanks for the information,
Jamie

Basically the sky's the limit. What you do to your engine depends on what you’re trying to accomplish. If you’re looking for good reliable horsepower stick with the stock engine and have fun. However, if you want a fun weekend warrior with some more kick like me, It can be done. Not easy or cheap though. The key to making more power is flowing more air through the engine. Weather that be supercharger, turbocharger, higher compression, higher revs, more displacement or nitrous; your goal is the same. In my opinion, I would not consider the V12 as a candidate unless you’re rich. A. Very expensive car/engine. B. That many more parts to replace if and when you grenade the monster. I would stick with a V8. Also, keep in mind your not going to be able to buy a stoker kit or high flow heads like you can for a small block Chevy. Unless you want to pay Renntech $30K, I know I don't. Everything will pretty much have to be custom made. I know this from first hand experience. The easiest way to get some bolt on power would be to buy a supercharger form Kleeman or HPS but you don't want to go supercharged. Other than that, you can go with nitrous and if done right it will give you a nice safe little kick but your fun is limited to the amount of nitrous on board. Stuff like port matching, cam grinding, polishing ect. alone won't yield enough extra power to make these mods worth while since Mercedes already did a good job there. You have lots of options but it's going to be expensive either way. I would highly suggest setting a goal for how much power you want to produce and how the car will be driven. From there you can analyze what performance options are best suited for you. Also, go to a bookstore and pick up some performance tuning books. There are many good ones out there and you will learn a lot about where to start on your little project.
Good Luck!
Adam

ADAM:

1. What did you do to make your exhaust manifold look that beautiful?

2. Since you have a 1994 E320 and a 1987 300E and a 1992 500e I would like to ask you which hood/grill setup you personally like more, the 1993 and under or the 1994 and up?

3. Do you have HELLA euro lights on any of your W124 cars?

Thank You

A stock 8-cylinder engine of the vintage you mention is pushing 315-330 BHP. With the "normal" mods of porting, headers, and general intake and exhaust airflow improvements, I believe that gains of around 50HP would be possible.

With more radical means, such as increasing displacement from 5.0 to 6.0 L, combined with the mods above, I believe that gains of 100-125 HP are achieveable. This would be a displacement increase along with compression bump. I believe that the stock injection system could handle fuel delivery needs for this type of setup.

Any normally aspirated motor with a HP rating of 400+ HP, with factory reliability, is doing quite well. To extract much beyond this, an exponential amount of money would be required. Even to go to the route I described, with the displacement and compression bump, you are probably talking $20,000+ including labor.

I would stay away from the 12-cylinder motors because of their complexity. The 12-cylinder M120 differs from the M119 8-cylinder and M104 6-cylinder by essentially being a pair of M104s grafted together. Many if not most engine accessories are duplicated, meaning there are two of them. This includes things like two throttle bodies. This increases costs dramatically both for building and for repairing.

The 8-cylinder motor is more reasonable in this regard and I think with appropriate tweaks, capable of output levels not too far off of the 12-cylinder engines. I would shudder to think of what it would run to "hot-rod" a Mercedes-Benz M120 12-cylinder motor.

If you are not prepared to drop $20,000 RIGHT NOW to mod an 8-cylinder motor, if that number gives you the creeps, then you should probably stick to a Ford or Chevy.

Cheers,
Gerry

Yes! :eek: RennTech's 7.4 liter V12 conversion with all the "goodies" runs $44,500, but results in a 575hp monster. :D

Add turbos!
 

AS I understand, the early (pre-'93) closed deck M119s are the same blocks that they used in the early 80s Sauber race cars. With twin turbos, in race trim the engine put out 900+ HP; in qualifying trim, 1,200+.

Mercedes engines dont need to Rev, they develop good torque. if you want a tach that reads 9000 get a Honda, they cant do anything thus need all kinds of RPMs to move. But, if you like tearing into engines and junk, get it balanced, titanium rods and rings, nice high compression pistons, billet crank, bore it if you want. Paying someone else is no fun and not rewarding, i think, they built the car so you dont really get any bragging rights. Just get someone else to do the machine work and make the parts. I read about a Jaguar got 50HP just from engine balance, but I bet Mercedes are in better shape. Searching on the internet are people who make what you need. Labor is where most of the money goes anyway. It can be fairly cheap if you do it yourself. And like ADAM said it will be custom but not really all that hard, an engines an engine. 20K sounds like a lot, but it can go about as far as you want to stretch it. I'd bet more would be spent on a decent trans. to handle it all.

Heres a thought, if the C36 gets about 270HP and the V12 is two 104's of 3.0,bore it to about 7.2 litres (or two 3.6's), then thats 540HP. The C36 is pretty reliable isnt it? Machine work is usually about half of what Renntech wants, just find a good shop. I'm in So. Cal. so i can find a gazillion places, I dunno about the rest of the country though.

Contact Donnie Drummonds at MB Autowerks. He builds bad-ass MBs :)

Link.....

http://www.mbautowerks.com/

If you want reliable high revs one thing you may need to consider is lightening your valvetrain.