For posterity; comparison of DOT and ECE headlights in a 1994 W124 E420. The page is self explanatory.

LOOK HERE

Nice, very nice. Thanks for sharing this, and it is Short and Sweet.

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1992 500E (Daily Driver)
2004 Porsche RUF 955 Dakara 550

If you were to adjust your foglights down to 3-4 inches below your lowbeams you would get better light infront of you. At 25 feet, I do about 2.5 inch drop on the low beams, then another 3 inches below that for the fog lights.

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Current Stable:
1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey.

Former Mercedes in the Stable:
1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now)
1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold
1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold
1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold
1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold
1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020)
1992 500E 156k mi sold
etc.

Thanks. Yeah ya know so many people upgrade to ece lights for their benz's and then rave about how much better they are than DOT......but what I never saw was any attempt at quantifying that difference. It’s like they tells us its better but never SHOW us how better it is. As they would say in various lighting forums: "the thread is worthless without picts!"

So I thought it would be a fun exercise to try and see how it would come out.

BTW I see you're from Carlsbad. I've got a condo in La Costa.


Thanks for the tip. I think I'll try it out. The ece fogs have much better lateral illumination. It’s hard to tell from the picts, but the light seems to "wrap" around the car. And to think I thought there wouldn't a diff in the fogs.

Condo at La Costa ... sweet! Next time you are in town, contact me. I live down the road towards the beach.

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1992 500E (Daily Driver)
2004 Porsche RUF 955 Dakara 550

1) Is 'ECE' the same as 'EURO' lights mentioned so often?

2) What's the rationale for the '_/_/' beam pattern?

BTW, thanks for sharing the thread, really short and sweet.

To illuminate the signs on the right side of the road.

RHD cars have a beam pattern that looks like this \_\_

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Current Stable:
1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey.

Former Mercedes in the Stable:
1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now)
1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold
1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold
1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold
1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold
1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020)
1992 500E 156k mi sold
etc.

yes, ECE is what many people call "euro lights"

but besides the tall right hand flare, ECE code calls for different amounts of illumination to different parts of the beam. This results with an even, full spread of light... as opposed to the DOT's blotchy pattern.

Like I said, the picts are at a decreased exposure so you can better see the shape of the light against the wall. Foreground lighting is muted, but I assure you, the lights are very much white and bright. In the 90/130 low beam picts, you can see the ground starting to light up where as that isn’t even close to happening with the lower wattage bulbs.

The DOT specs actually REQUIRE a lot of light leakage up at about 40 deg 'to illuminate overhead signs.'

thats exactly right.

When using higher power lights this causes too much glare. This is the number one reason why "HID retofits" into DOT headlights is a huge NO NO. Most people either dont know or dont care. If you're going to for an HID retrofit, you should use a projector, but if you dont then ECE headlights are a MUST.

Many people do complain about a loss of overhead illumination when they move to ECE headlights. It dosent bother me.

Uh - I gotta ask:

1) Why or how would low AND high beams be on simultaneously? That's a great way to explode an H4 bulb capsule.

2) Were relays used for the overwattage bulbs? If not, the wiring will be FRIED in short order. 90/130 H4's with a 100 H3 pulls double stock current. (I have these in my car and I measured the current draw - it was 30-35A on high beam, including the H3's, since I have 500E lights without fogs. )

3) Note that the 94/95 DOT lights are actually quite good. You may be able to just swap lenses with ECE lenses to adjust the pattern a bit. A more dramatic comparison would have been the old 86-93 DOT lights with the awful 9004 bulb.

4) You don't want fogs on with high beams. When using high beams you want to see WAY far ahead. Fogs put too much light right in front of the car, closing your eyes a little, and actually reducing your long-range vision at high speeds. Keep the fogs on with low beams. To supplement high beams, you need pencil-beam driving lights.

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Dave
Boise, ID
Check out my website photos, documents, and movies!

1) The lows and highs are on simultaneously when you pull the stalk towards you - as in a flash-to-pass signal

2) Yes, relays with 12 gauge wire (and actually some 10 gauge...which I know can cause a bit of a voltage drop) and fuses.

3) That would be nice, but I can’t do it since I no longer have a pre 1994 W124. You can just swap the lenses on the 94/95 cars and use the OE bulbs. The results are the middle column on my page.

4) You are correct about the night vision. I was only demonstrating what it looks like.

Don’t think that I drive around using those various modes (fogs and highs, or lows and highs) I was merely being complete in my comparison; showing every possible configuration (thats what I get for being a scientist). You never know when you'll be peer reviewed!


Thus far nothing has blow, neither fuse nor bulb. The 100 watt fogs get hot! The fog lens is very hot to the touch. I think I am going to install an exhaust fan. 99% of the time I am driving with only the "parking" or "running lights” on. When it gets dark I run just the lows. I only the fogs on dark scary roads or when the weather gets foul.

I used to run the fogs all day long as my "DRL's". Not so much anymore. If you search under my name I have been frantically posting/searching for a source of city lights. I want to use those as my DRL's.

Anyways, any more questions?

What are "city lights?" My car is a 1995 E320 Wagon, and in the thumbnail in my posts (the avatar) is a front side pic of my car. I know it has Euro lenses (you can see the clear side lenses) I think the car was imported from Europe (Its a long story) When I switch on the "parking" lights I would expect the outer turn signal lens to glow orange. On my car, the main headlamps glow dimly but look cool. The taillights also light. I can also switch just one of those dim lights on in the front and the same side in the rear for either left or right sides of the car. Turning the main switch all the way results in the main low beam headlights. Pulling it out once gives you the clear driving lights. I can also switch on just the dim front lights and the driving lights. Many times I have driven around on these because they are nearly as bright as the low beams. I also have a single rear red fog light, and high beams. I can run the driving lights and the high beams together. There is also a switch next to the light switch for leveling the headlights electrically. I just leave it at zero.
One problem the lights causes is if I leave the main low beam and the driving lights on for 2 hours, the battery is flat. Its a new battery, Interstate not the cheapo.

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2002 Mercedes-Benz E320 4Matic
1995 Mercedes-Benz E320 Wagon
2005 Land Rover LR3 V8 SE
1999 Audi A8 4.2L quattro

Interesting! I have been using my low beams as DRL's on my 300D. The city lights are not bright enough by themselves. What did you have in mind for DRL's? I have no fogs at all on that car (the H3 is an auxiliary high beam) and I don't use high beam enough to notice the heat buildup on the lens. I did notice that when using low beams as DRL's, with 100/130 bulbs, the bulb holder (as viewed from the front with the lens removed) was yellowish from heat damage! I'd like to find an 80/130 bulb but apparently nobody makes one. Next time I'll drop to 90/100 bulbs, I think, or perhaps an 80/100.

On my E500, that has fogs in the bumper, which is waaay cool. I use the fogs as DRL's and the city lights come on with the fogs. Looks nice overall. I can run 100/130's there since I'm not burning low beams all the time, only at night, when I actually need them.

Both cars have the full relay treatment, one 8ga feed to each side, splitting into one short 10ga to each relay (high & low), then 12ga out to the 6-pin headlight connector, with a 10ga ground. Oh, and I have a 150A alternator as well, which pumps out over 100A at *idle*!

Troverman,

1) You have a true Euro setup. (I won't ask. )

2) The main lights glowing dimly ARE the city lights!

3) Those are't driving lights, they are fog lights, but with a clear lens instead of amber. They are good to supplement low beams, but not high beams, for the reasons mentioned in my earlier post.

4) The leveling dial is not electric, it is vacuum operated. It allows you do *lower* the lights when you have a heavy load in the rear, so you don't blind oncoming traffic. You'll usually leave it in the highest position, if they were adjusted properly.

5) Why would you leave the lights on for 2 hours with the engine off? I'm not entirely surprised that drains the battery. Do you have the full size Group 49 battery, or a smaller one?