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  #1  
Old 02-14-2001, 08:42 AM
ocpdba
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Given the dearth of performance upgrades for my wonderful 400e, I am considering a 500e.

I've located an example with full books-'n-records. It is calling me.

Anyone have any input about what I should look for in the pre-purchase inspection? I know that this subject has been covered exhaustively in previous posts, and I have been reading them over the past few days, but just want to see if I missed anything.

Also, anyone want to assuage my fears that this car will become a sulphuruous pit into which I will be forced to ritualistically fling onerous and oppressive amounts of legal tender?

Thanks,

Jack
93 400e
Member, MBCA, North Texas section

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  #2  
Old 02-14-2001, 08:49 AM
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Hey keep your 400e. The 500e is a great car but consider the trade up difference. Also the performance is the only difference so if you have to have a faster 0 - 60 or better skidpad, etc then.... But I would stick to the 400e. Good Luck !
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  #3  
Old 02-14-2001, 10:23 AM
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I know for a fact that every possible maintenance issue concerning 500Es has been discussed here, so if you've dona a search then you've read it all.

Drive both cars, then decide. The 500E has a completely different feel than a 400E; a 400E is much more like a 300E than it is a 500E. When new, the 400E only cost $7-8k more than a 300E as I recall, whereas the 500E was about $20k more than a 400.
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  #4  
Old 02-14-2001, 11:24 AM
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You should go for it! It’ll make a *much* better streetlight rocket than a 400e. You should sell your 400 outright, however, as dealers will hammer you on trade in value.

…Tracy

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  #5  
Old 02-14-2001, 12:13 PM
Ernest Dixon
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Depending on the condition of the 500E, go for it. As you have read, the production process and resultant quality put into the build makes this car in a different class. Also, given that many of the parts are found on other MB lines, costs to maintain will not be out of line with other MB models. Biggest indicator to you - drive the beast! You will see why we love our 500Es. I think Roas did a trade up from a 400 to 500 - so he has the best experience with this decision.
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  #6  
Old 02-14-2001, 03:51 PM
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That's my former 400E on the left and my current 500E on the right. As the others have said, they are two quite different animals. I commute 75 miles a day and the 400E was certainly a more practical commuter car but the 500E is DAMN SURE a more entertaining way to spend that two hours every day!

Is it more expensive to maintain: certainly. I will probably have to put a fresh set of Z-rated tires on it every 18 months (if I'm lucky). I have to put $30 worth of 92 octane in at least once a week. Do I regret it: not one bit.

You said you were concerned about the lack of performance options for the 400E. I agree with you. It's a great touring car, but that's it. The solidity of the 500E is remarkable. You have to drive one to believe how much stiffer the chassis is than the 300E-400E, yet it does not ride harsh at all.

The 500E is not for everybody. It does take a bit of financial commitment for the reasons I mentioned above. Ernest is right, a number of parts are not 500E exclusive, but some are. For instance, benzmac replaced a couple of transmission lines for me. They ARE exclusive to the 500E. Cost me over $100 for the pair.

I had almost given up on finding a 500E like I wanted and was looking at a similar era Porsche. It didn't take much research to show me that I needed to be patient. The 500E gives you surprisingly close performance for a lot less maintenance-money.

Like everyone else said, you have to drive it and make up your own mind. All I can do is tell you I'm glad I decided the way I did!

Tim Vacula
'92 500E
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  #7  
Old 02-14-2001, 05:14 PM
roas
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I recently traded up to a 500E, but not from a 400E. I went from C280 and dove right to the pinnacle of the W124 Class.

What are the miles on the example you found? My car had higher miles than I might have wanted, but in a Mercedes anything under 150k in not high in my book, remember these cars are Designed to last with proper maintenance.

I have had no problems develop since my trade several months ago, but time will tell. The only problems I have currently are a leaky power steering pump (1 drop every 2 days) and a leaking transmission pan gasket (under $4 to purchase and will replace with next service). Also I have a undiagnosed noise when the car is moving in reverse (might be driveshaft center bearing?), and of course typical rock chips in the paint (these WA roads are far from "paint friendly").


I would say go for it, you need to drive both and then like Ernest said, "Why we love them" will become more clear. If you are performance oriented in the first place, then the choice is the 500E its that simple. We all work hard for a Living and there is nothing wrong with treating yourself to a 500E if the opportunity is apparently presenting itself.

Ask your self how long you are going to keep this car? If the answer is for a while then the 500E will make you happy from a driver's point of view. Like I said, I have not owned the car that long so my input on the repair and maintenance issue is not much of a help, sorry.

I can confirm the increase in fuel costs as well, 18 mpg highways is what I am getting with the average weight of foot during the work week. When the weekend comes and the weight of foot increases (funny how that happens), you can expect as low as 11-12 mpg but who cares! The cost of gas and tires are to be expectedly higher.

Oh, and Jack....., when you mentioned "Its Calling Me" I had to chuckle, that does not go away with time, trust me.
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  #8  
Old 02-15-2001, 07:30 AM
ocpdba
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Thanks all for the responses. They really helped to define the issue for me.

It is just a money thing. I know that I will love the car, and I have found a nice example with less than 30k, but $33+ large for a 9 year old car without a warranty? Yikes! And only 800 or so made? That has to affect parts costs. And labor costs on an e-class with a 5 liter stuffed into it is probably high.

I guess I still feel like I should be driving the 73 Plymouth Scamp I drove in college! Now there was a car - slant six, low-tech construction, vinyl so tough that it could probably be used to make car tires, and ..... oh sorry, wrong forum.

My wife has even given me permission for the 500e.

I am sure that some people have real problems, unlike me, who can't seem to decide between two high-performance Mercedes!

Jack
93 400e (for now), MBCA, North Texas section
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  #9  
Old 02-15-2001, 07:46 AM
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Given the amount of fun you'll have, that's CHEAP

When I got the "ATP" (Authorization To Purchase) from my wife, within 48 hours I was on my way to pick mine up! It was funny...She says "Where are you going?" and I respond "To PA to get my 500E (it was 5 hrs. away)!". So, there she was with this baffled look on her face, and there I was bombing to PA in my TE to get the car.

And not one regret.

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  #10  
Old 02-15-2001, 03:49 PM
roas
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ocpdba,

You would be suprised by the amount of Life left in even high mileage Mercedes (130+). This might be a consideration if price is an obstacle!

And besides, if you already have the "ATP" then half the battle has already been won! I can tell you that my wife took about 3 months of detailed explantion of the merits of the 500E before she finally "Saw the Light"!

I haven't looked recently but you might find some nice 500E's with 80-100k (average use) for about 25k+ out the door? Closer to the mark?
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  #11  
Old 02-17-2001, 12:36 PM
Ernest Dixon
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Still Cherry

I purchased my 500E with 28K on the clock - and I have had quite a time breakn' her in. The major thing I was concerned about was the condition of the "rubber" parts. A good inspection revealed I needed to replace the engine mount bushings as they had collapsed from lack of use. Other than that I had to replace the front bushings on the sway bar as one also failed. The warranty is in the build quality and dependability of this classic. I have not seen an increase in labor cost unless I am getting charged for the time gawkers stop to "check" her out My mechanic tells me that he gets numerous questions about the car - mostly am I interested in selling!
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  #12  
Old 02-20-2001, 02:10 PM
Bigshot
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I know it is not the same but how do you like your 400E? I drove a 500E and a 420E and the 500 was more sporty and had a bit more grunt but 40hp is 40hp on a 4000lb car. I loved the agressive looks but could not justify the price. I opted for the 420 for the wife. The car is gorgeous and has 65k and I paid 20K+ from a MB dealer. I have an 89 560 SEC with 66k and I would not trade that anyday for the e-class. If I was gonna drop 3 stacks of high society, I would want a s-class. The milage is right on that 500 but have a MB dealer give her a lookover. If it is at a dealer, you can buy a warranty for about $2500 for 1 year(ouch)! Good luck!
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  #13  
Old 02-21-2001, 11:21 AM
ocpdba
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Thanks for the input all, I have decided to stay with the 400e for now. I love the 500e, and will have one some day, but don't feel comfortable making that leap right now. "Some day soon though..." he said hauntingly. I will have to console myself with AMG wheels and euro lamps for the 400. Pity me.

I love the 400e, Big. It is a great car, I have owned it for 2.5 years, and have never had any problems with it. It glides down the highway and really comes to life at higher speeds. The stoplight performance is somewhat marginal because of the .224 rear gear and costs $3000 to upgrade to a .282/.307. Other than that, the car is absolutely great. Great brakes, good handling, timeless styling, great build quality, pretty easy to work on. I am convinced that it is one of the best cars ever built.

The problem is that I love the 400e, but it does not inspire me. I have a hankering for a heroic car, and the 400 is nothing more than a stock 300e with a few performance tweaks and a bigger motor. The 500e is a Mercedes/Porsche hybrid supercar in a 4dr body.

It is easy to have the utmost respect for the 400, but it is difficult to be passionate about it. That is the difference.


Jack

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  #14  
Old 02-21-2001, 01:45 PM
Bigshot
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I understand your last statements. I also am not googoo'd by the 420.Even though it hauls ass, it still looks like a 320. I am still not sure if it has ASR or not but in a straight line it just goes. Around a turn I'll boil the tire off, what gives?. I love the styling of my SEC, always did since I drove a new one in 87 at age 18. 12 years later I got one and I just adore that car. It is no 911 but it moves pretty good and has lots of room and rides like your in a vault. As you can tell, over a year later and I am still in love. I would like the E more if it was a bit more quiet. Wind noise is way more noticable than s-class. That's why I said if it was me, go with a s500 or something. Hell keep the 400 and get a 911.
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  #15  
Old 02-21-2001, 03:03 PM
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400E ASR

Nick,

No way your car has ASR, unless it's malfunctioning. ASR would never ever let a tire "boil", heck it's tough to get much more than a chirp and I have a 500E!


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