M104 AMG Engine - Timing set-up procedure - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

OzC36 · #16 04-12-2010, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayRash

ok since it rotated clock wise, come assembly time dont u rest the sprocket to the correct mark? Wouldnt that mean the cam now is retarded to get the correct set up at TDC?
Just asking for its been some 11 years since i played around with cam gears.

If you set the sprocket to the "correct" mark, it would be retarded and defeat the purpose that AMG mofified the sprocket to advance the cam.

Also it would move the sprocket half of one tooth (5 deg). Each tooth (36 teeth) is equal to 10 deg. Therefore the "correct" mark is NOT achievable.

More to the point perhaps, the following link from the Mercedes Worksheet says NOT to use the marks at the head level for AMG engine.

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=2446504&dr_log=-1&linkout=http%3A//www.ps2cho.net/downloads/MB%2520CD/W124/w124CD1/Program/Engine/104/05-2230.pdf

OzC36 · #17 04-13-2010, 10:10 AM

OK, after much research, I have come up with the following setup procedure. My car is running beautifully with this setting. So I believe it is perfect...or pretty damn close!

Set the crankshaft angle to TDC with cylinder on the compression stroke. Then:

1. There are two dowel guide holes on the exhaust sprocket of the 1996 AMG M104 engine.
2. Use the dowel hole that is marked with a "U" (modified by AMG to provide 2.5 deg advance on the exhaust valves).
3. Set the 4 mm guide hole approximately 4-6 mm above the level of the head (as opposed to level with the head on the C280 M104 engine).
4. Set the inlet cam sprocket with the 4 mm guide hole about 2-4 mm below level with the head (as opposed to level with the head on the C280 M104 engine).

Exhaust cam sprocket.

Exhaust cam 4 mm guide hole setting at TDC.

Inlet cam 4 mm guide hole setting at TDC.

OzC36 · #18 05-10-2010, 10:49 AM

The engine still surges about +/-150 RPM at idle...and it is obviously not yet perfect...

I even emailed AMG, but nothing useful in reply as yet.

Any gurus out here that may be able to help?

JayRash · #19 05-26-2010, 02:39 PM

Ok I blew the head gasket on my 36 AMG due to a failed water pump, this is the second gasket in 6 months :S

Any way come assembly time my mechanic set the timing as follows:
1- the exhaust Sprocket set using the U dwell hole.
2- Intake variable set to retard.
3- The 4mm holes with the timing chain firm are slightly over the head level on the intake side and slightly lower than the head on the exhaust cam.

the car idles steady and fine. now as its the engine should be running slight retard.

ill confirm abt the power, top end, low end, idle and driving feel in the coming few days. ill also race several cars i had race before to see if it was setup like before or not, and if its better or worse.

BTW an engine with cams retarded should idle steady, advanced should feel lumpy like its on cams, i for one have no idea how the 36 AMG should idle but slight retard is useful on the AMG since it has enough torque low down, so top end will help me pull gr8 from 5kRPM to 7K shift point.

any input from u guys would be gr8.

OzC36 · #20 05-26-2010, 11:05 PM

Hello JayRash,

Thank you very much for your post and information. It makes sense to me as I have come to the conclusion that my uneven idle is caused by having set my inlet and exhaust too far advanced.

Let us know if you decide to vary your setting after further tests.

Cheers,
Oz

JayRash · #21 05-27-2010, 02:13 AM

OZ
i am glad to help in any way and i sure will keep u posted
but i kinda proved my point regarding the first post on this page on the top.

Any way how is the low down pull on ur car and how is the car on the top end, where does it start to trail?

I will post how mine is on my settings.

OzC36 · #22 05-28-2010, 07:01 AM

Quote:

JayRash,
Any way how is the low down pull on ur car and how is the car on the top end, where does it start to trail?

Strangely enough, the low down pull is very good and seems to improve above about 3000 RPM and then goes very strongly all the way to 6300 RPM. I will live with the uneven idle for a few more weeks then get amongst it to reset the timing as you suggested.

JayRash · #23 05-28-2010, 07:22 AM

when cams are advanced low down pull wil be gr8 rather impressive. I wanna try ur settings in a month or so
then ill see which i would keep

taint · #24 06-04-2010, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OzC36

The engine still surges about +/-150 RPM at idle...and it is obviously not yet perfect...

I even emailed AMG, but nothing useful in reply as yet.

Any gurus out here that may be able to help?

just wanted to ask have you changed the injector seals and cleaned the throttle actuator?

OzC36 · #25 06-07-2010, 10:23 AM

Hello taint,

Yes I had the injectors serviced, and new seals. Also the throttle body was completely cleaned.

I have some information on timing that indicates I am still a bit off on my settings and I will post that when I get around to resetting the timing.

JayRash · #26 06-07-2010, 12:52 PM

OZ
do u want to try the way i set my cams? My car is running gr8 thou i also have a tiny tiny bit of hunting when oil is really hot.

OzC36 · #27 06-07-2010, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayRash

OZ
do u want to try the way i set my cams? My car is running gr8 thou i also have a tiny tiny bit of hunting when oil is really hot.

Hello JayRash,

I am going to set my timing the same as yours (as you previously suggested), unless you have found an even better setting.

JayRash · #28 06-08-2010, 02:33 AM

no man i am still on the same setting, i think its the original settings from AMG its just that this is the second head gasket in a row so the head has been slightly shaved for a clean fit. This will have me running slight retard over any stock setting but it shouldn't be much to make any difference

Brabus 3.6-24 · #29 08-27-2010, 05:14 PM

Does anyone know if the timing is changed as well on a M104.980 BRABUS 3.6-24 engine as I am about to get the last finger slip on my engine refreshment?

I can see that I don´t have dobbel dowel pin holes at least, but I know that brabus fitted the engine with a modified inlet cam just as AMG did and the other cam was as original like the AMG.

But my dowl marks fit right on when I turn the cams and the cam advancer system like it should, they also changed the compresion to 10.5:1 from 10:1

MAG58 · #30 08-27-2010, 07:32 PM

The .98 based 3.6 may be different than the AMG .94 based engine. If you could read me the cam codes we can let you know the differences.