M104 long block in a 190E 2.6 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

#1 07-21-2002, 01:14 AM

Can the intake manifold with CIS type injection on the 190 2.6 and 300E be bolted to a M104 head. What years if so. Is the injection system the same on the 300CE and 300SL as the 190e 2.6 and 300E. I would like to swap long blocks and maybe change injectors and throttle body, if need be.

Alain V. · #2 07-22-2002, 11:20 PM

I'm pretty sure it won't work. The intake from a 190 2.6 (103 engine) has round ports,,,,,and the 104 series engines have oval shaped ports since they are 4 valve per cyl configuration.

I have seen an early 104 complete engine (CIS-E system) installed in a 190,,,,,,

and am currently awaiting the delivery of a C36 engine form my 190 racecar. I won't be using any of the MBZ management stuff though. I will be using a custom programmable ignition/fuel management set up. The C36 engine should be here sometime this week.

#3 07-22-2002, 11:30 PM

So what did they change from the M104 CIS combo. Is it a different intake manifold or different head.

Alain V. · #4 07-22-2002, 11:33 PM

103 engine is single cam 2 valve per cyl,,,,,,,
104 is double cam 4 valve totally different head and intake manifold than the 103.

#5 07-23-2002, 09:59 AM

I realize this. But at one time mercedes did mate the M103 type CIS injection to the M104 long block, ie 300SL & 300CE.

My question is what is different in the configuration. Provided the CIS injection is the same on M103 190 and 300 cars as it is in early M104 cars like the 300 SL/CE.

The intake runners on the intake manifold to accomodate the M104 Head

or

Are the ports different on the early M104 Head to accept a M103 intake manifold with CIS?

Scott P. · #6 07-23-2002, 06:09 PM

The 104 cylinder head and intake manifold are completely different. You will need the engine, complete with intake and exhaust manifolds, the fuel and ignition wiring harnesses as well as both computers (fuel and EZL (ignition)). A 103 intake will not fit the ports at the head.

Scott P.

#7 07-23-2002, 06:40 PM

Thank you, I will evaluat this and formulate it into my projects direction.

So there is no benefit in ease of installation in using a older CIS-E M104 3.0L vs a M104 from a Later model Like a '94 320 I6.

Benzmac · #8 07-23-2002, 08:16 PM

I have a complete 3.2litre, 104 engine with EFI. It is out of a 93 s320.

I would like to get $1,500 for the engine. I have almost everything needed. It even has the engine mounts still on it.

#9 07-23-2002, 08:36 PM

What is the condition. Does it come with The ECU, fuel management, etc. Will be interested if it's ready to run. Does it have it's accesories too?

Alain V. · #10 07-23-2002, 11:04 PM

1500 bucks for a complete 104 engine is cheap! Youd have to pay about that for a decent used 103 series powerplant in this area!

MBRACER, I wouldn't worry too much about using the factory management stuff. Replacement parts are high and there were enough "quirks" with the factory stuff that make an aftermarket set up look real appealing. (stock wiring harnessess are notorious for spewing, as are oem mass air sensors,etc)

You might want to look into systems like ones from Haltech. Motec, Electromotive, SDS etc.

I am going to use an SDS system on my C36 motor and it is completely programmable, comes with a wiring harness, is very simple to install & set up, and I can eliminate the factory wiring, the oem mass air sensor, and am even going to eliminate the MBZ throttle body assembly & replace it with an aluminum adapter and a ford 5.0 liter TB. (the ford TB's are available in a wife variety of sizes and are no where near as expensive as the oem MBZ units,,,which also like to spew)

The SDS is a cheap and basic system, yet is capable of fast idle, cam timing control, closed loop etc if I want.

Since my car is a track only car, the only thing I am concerned with is HP,,,,therefore I am going to rent a dyno for a day to get my system totally "dialed in".

You don't have to do it with a dyno,,,,,,but I want to be able to actually "see" the results from my tuning & adjustments.

here is SDS website
http://www.sdsefi.com/index.html

#11 07-24-2002, 01:27 AM

Yes, but am waiting on a reply on its condition to determine if it's cheap. I have not heard of SDS, what is the reliability history. RC-Imports has steered me clear of the Electromotive Units because of problems. MOTEC is nice, but for 5 grand???

Either way I really want a 3.6L motor. A C36 mototr would be nice but are hard to find and expensive for my budget. I need to budget the whole power plant before I make a move. If I start buying portions on impulse the project will never get done.

I have access to a chasis dyno where my car is being built.

Alain V. · #12 07-24-2002, 07:51 AM

The SDS system is pretty reasonable at around a grand for a complete ign/fuel system for a 6 cyl.

I have seen two or three of them on Ford V8's on cobra replicas.
It is not as "fancy" as some of the other systems, but I like simple and functional.

I bet if you spend a little time on their site, you will see that these guys have their "stuff" together.

Also, Jim Villers (a member of this group) is using an SDS on his custom 16v 190 with a supercharger. Maybe do a search to see some of his posts?

Finding a 3.6 won't be easy, as it will have to come from a dead C36. I was real patient/lucky to find mine after looking for about a year. I also got real lucky to get mine at the price I got it for.
Expect to pay around 4k or more if you find one.

Potomac Pat · #13 07-24-2002, 09:14 AM

Mbracer, you should jump all over that M104.994 that Donnie has. That price is too good to pass up on.

#14 07-24-2002, 09:37 AM

Pat it's a Done deal.

Thanks Donnie.