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Old 08-19-2002, 02:22 PM
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Lowering compression on 500E?

Has anyone lowered the compression on their 500E to around 8.5-8.8 to 1? I'm thinking of some upgrades and need to lower the compression for them to work. Haven't called Renntech yet, but I'm pretty sure they will be pricey. I'd rather not change the pistons, but will do that if I have to.
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Old 08-19-2002, 04:14 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Palos Verdes, CA
Posts: 270
I smell forced induction...
1994 E500
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Old 08-19-2002, 04:25 PM
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Yea, I have an extra closed deck M119 motor laying around (don't ask why) and was thinking of using that as a test case for the limits of what a 500E can really do.
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Old 08-19-2002, 04:51 PM
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Location: BLEW BY U
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Wink pls10

R U thinkin what I M thinkin. 500HP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 08-19-2002, 08:49 PM
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Join Date: Mar 1999
Location: Suwanee, GA, USA
Posts: 4,712
That engine has been known to produce in the 1,000 hp range with a set of turbos and proper fuel and ignition.

Good luck. I'd bet that AMG would have the lower compression pistons. IF not, you could easily have them made.
Donnie Drummonds
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Old 08-19-2002, 10:58 PM
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You might spring for some custom rods and pistons. JE Pistons makes some very nice forged units that can be tailor made to you spec's.

Sounds interesting...
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Old 08-20-2002, 01:04 PM
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Perhaps you can do the engineering for a custom intake manifold with built-in supercharger and intercooler like Kleeman or MKB. . .

:- ) neil
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Old 08-21-2002, 12:19 AM
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From a link of the web on the Sauber Mercedes C11,

General specifications
Country of origin Switzerland
Years of production 1990 - 1991
Numbers built 6
Body design N/A
Weight 905 kg / 1995.2 lbs

Engine M119 90 V8
Engine location Mid, longitudinally mounted
Displacement 4.973 liter / 303.5 cu in
Valvetrain 4 valves/cylinder, DOHC
Fuel feed Bosch Motronic Fuel injection
Aspiration Twin KKK turbos
Gearbox N/A
Drive Rear wheel drive

Performance figures
Power 730 bhp / 544.6 kW @ 7000 rpm
BHP/Liter 146.8
Torque N/A
Power to weight ratio 0.81 bhp/kg
Top Speed 248.5 mph / 400.0 km/h
0-60 mph Acceleration N/A

C11 Review 1.
C11 Review 2.
C11 Review 3
"Peter Sauber was the immediate beneficiary of years of priceless Mercedes-Benz fuel management research. The 5.0-liter M119 32-valve V8s made power and torque in massive quantities while sipping gasoline."
...."Especially after qualifying Sauber-Mercedes gridded one-two after a qualifying battle that was likely equal to the marquee value and tension of a whole F1, Indy Car or NASCAR weekend. Jean-Louis Schlesser, the man who hates Le Mans, won the pole at 155.235mph. Just barely out of the mythic 3:14s where only Hans Stuck had trodden. This lap included a staggering 248mph pass down Mulsanne in a car that had never been in a rolling floor wind tunnel."
...."The C9s were all about engines; the 5.0-liter turbo V8 was the heart and soul of the car. The C9s lacked the poise and driving comfort of the mature (old?) Porsches but were so powerful that they overcame any obstacle with on-demand brute force. (Original equipment on many Mercedes-Benz models since '37.)"
...."Sauber-Mercedes crushed all competition in the '89 Sport-Prototype championship. The Group C fuel consumption rules had become a joke before the technical might of Mercedes-Benz."

One final link that may have gold in it, Race Tech Magazine, Issue 19 list;
Mercedes M119/AMG Le Mans V8
Nissan VRH35Z Le Mans V8
Toyota GT-One Le Mans V8

Sorry for the historical dump, possibly this info could be of some value for a Giant Killer Build-up?
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Old 08-21-2002, 06:37 PM
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Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Matthews, NC, USA
Posts: 133

I am suffering from Increased heart rate, sweating at the brow...Too much excitement just reading the above. I must go lie down and rest.

Thanks for the vicarious journey.

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Old 08-21-2002, 06:50 PM
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Join Date: Apr 1999
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I've posted this before, could this be the fabled Turbo M119 engine, also check out the headers on this parts-view of the M119 engine.

:-) neil
1988 360TE AMG
1993 500E
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Old 08-21-2002, 07:09 PM
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I don't want to let too much of my plans out since I'm not exactly sure what I'm going to do, but as of right now I'm still missing the fuel injection computer and a few other modules. Given the cost of several thousands of dollars to replace these from Mercedes, I'm tempted to replace these with a setup I'm more familiar with, namely a A9L EEC-IV processor wired to for SEFI injection. I already have done a lot of custom work with these setups and are running a similar setup in my Lightning truck with a Vortech and Powerstroke diesel intercooler. Here's a vid of my recent creation. All of the piping and mounting is custom and I'm using a eec tuner that allows me to modify the fuel and spark tables, etc. The truck right now is putting down 405 rwhp on a motor originally rated at 245 from the factory.

Things that still have to be worked out are:

determine the size and impedence of the mercedes injectors (should'nt be a problem since I've used Bosch ones before)

determine what controls will be affected on the transmission

determine how to interface the gauges in the stock mercedes instrument panel

There should be enough room to replace the air pump with a Vortech. I'll probably use an S-trim with a Spearco intercooler. Just don't know where I'm going to put the intercooler since these cars don't have any extra cooling capacity as it stands.
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Old 08-21-2002, 07:15 PM
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Join Date: Apr 1999
Posts: 2,633
How about placing the left & right intercoolers in the appropriate left & right fender well. . .

:-) neil
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