K-MAC bushings vs. Adjustable camber arms - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

omegabenz · #16 12-30-2003, 07:35 PM

This happened to me twice so I am speaking with experience, at about 130k miles all the bushings on the car need to be replaced. You could wait a year or two and deal with it then or just do all fo them. If you do, I would higly suggest getting sportline bushings for the front a-arms and also for the rear subframe bushings. Its unlikely that you need to do the subframe bushings yet, but its best to do it all at one time. Just ask ADAM about it. That is pretty much how he did it.

Labor, maybe 3 hours, plus an alignment, I am just guessing. MBracer probably knows for sure.

#17 12-30-2003, 11:02 PM

Since we are mercedesshop's board I will have to say they should have the first opportunity to supply them to you.

If not, feel free to email me with your request.

daulia71 · #18 12-31-2003, 12:40 PM

I just contacted Phil at the shop, per his e-mail, I need 2 each of eccentric bolt kits & bushings for the total price of $193.00.
Does anyone know anything about this? Sure it's cheaper than K-mac if it will fix the camber problem.
Any thoughts?

#19 12-31-2003, 12:58 PM

Is it an OEM kit?

gsxr · #20 12-31-2003, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by daulia71
I just contacted Phil at the shop, per his e-mail, I need 2 each of eccentric bolt kits & bushings for the total price of $193.00.
Does anyone know anything about this? Sure it's cheaper than K-mac if it will fix the camber problem.
Any thoughts?

What exactly is Phil selling for that price? I'm a little confused. And I'm not sure it will correct your camber problem. For that matter, are you sure you have a camber problem? What is the camber set to now? And is it at the adjustment limit where you really need an aftermarket camber kit to correct this? Don't forget you'll need a ~$100 dealer alignment when you're done installing parts... ask them for the printout with the numbers before & after, that will help us figure out if you have a problem, and how to correct it. BTW - how's your tire wear right now?

omegabenz · #21 12-31-2003, 01:10 PM

Maybe he (phil) is refering to the front a-arm bushings and eccentric bolts.

daulia71 · #22 12-31-2003, 02:29 PM

Yes, they are OEM. My tires are worn on the inside & it's already bald on the inside. I lowered the car about 3" & I can see, especially the rear wheels have negative camber, I did alligned the wheels last year but the tire shop said they couldn't allign it properly. I am not sure if the OEM eccentric bolt kits & bushings will solved my problem.

omegabenz · #23 12-31-2003, 02:33 PM

He has to be talking about the front ones. The rear doesnt have an eccentric at the lower control arm. Only on the top, but thats mostly for toe and thrust. I think MBracer might be able to explain more.

#24 12-31-2003, 03:00 PM

If you lower your car 3" it is out of the range of any OEM adjustment.

Now are we talking front or back suspension. Either way, a 3" drop is a lot and probably out of the range for, (K-Mac too?), to take it back to Zero.

Do you know what the offset is now?

daulia71 · #25 12-31-2003, 03:13 PM

My tires are a bit tucked in inside the fender using 18' rims.
I forgot what the offset is now, I have to look it up at home. The front tires do not wear as bad as the rear on the inside. I am not trying to adjust it to 0, if I can get somewhere around -1 that will be great. I don't know if the kmac will help at all, if not, I just have to buy a chepo tires & replace them every year.

ksing44 · #26 12-31-2003, 04:23 PM

Hello daulia71.

There is not an OEM eccentric bolt and bushing assembly to adjust the rear camber on your car. The front camber is adjustable, to a point, but not the rear. My 1995 E320 ( I think your W202 is the same) does have an eccentric bushing for the rear toe adjustment, but there is no rear camber adjustment. You need the K-MAC bushings or the adjustable rear camber arms that are being discussed on this post and you need to have the car aligned after installing the parts. 3 inches sounds like a big drop so your car may need the adjustable camber arms, because it was mentioned above that they had a bigger range of adjustment. My camber was almost –3 after I added the Eibach springs (about a 1-inch drop) and now the camber is about –1 with the K-MAC bushings. If you read a bit further, you will see that I included everything about my alignment.

If your car is too low and too far out of adjustment range in the front and the rear, even with aftermarket parts, you could add back some height by increasing the spring pad thickness. With a 3 inch drop and 18" wheels, it seems like you must have some rubbing issues, so maybe a little higher would solve a couple of problems. If you raise it just a bit, the camber won’t be as negative and the K-MAC kit should be able to get you close rto –1 camber in the rear.

The K-MAC kit is a bear to install, because removing the rear subframe bushing is tough work. The K-MAC supplied bushing puller is useless. A good Mercedes specialist will have proper tools to remove the bushings and you can remove parts of the suspension so that you can push out the OEM bushing using a press. You can also drill a ton of holes and chisel out the old bushing, but it is tough work. Since installation isn’t easy, you can expect to pay for at least a couple of hours of labor just for the installation. I suppose the adjustable camber arms would be much easier to install. As I said above, you will need an alignment after you install either part and it is important to get the alignment at a good shop that understands Mercedes and the fine points of sport tuning the suspension.

I think "mbracer", on this post, said that he can get the K-MAC kit. I got mine over a year ago by contacting Jeff Owens from K-MAC. Se contact information below.

Jeff Owens
K-MAC Suspension
http://www.k-mac.com.au/makes/merc.htm
Phone: 714-628-9555
Cell Phone: 714-206-8794
204 West Carleton Avenue
Orange, CA 92867

Rear Camber/Toe Kit - part# 502026H

As for the alignment, I have included information about what I did to align my car.

I have the alignment specifications from when my 1995 E320 was aligned after I added the Eibach springs. The Porsche race-tuner mechanic found specifications for Mercedes Benz, 92-95, 124.034, "Sport Suspension". I asked for the minimum front toe so that the tires would not get worn-out on the outside edge, like they did with the OEM set-up. I also asked to have the rear camber adjusted to within the same range as specified for the front camber. I figured the rear camber wasn’t specified because it isn’t adjustable from the factory, but I installed the K-MAC rear bushings so that it could be adjusted.

Front
Camber: Min -1.33, Nominal -1.00, Max -0.83, Actual Left -1.2, Actual Right -1.1
Caster: Min 9.92, Nominal 10.42, Max 10.92, Actual Left 10.5, Actual Right10.1
Toe: Min 0.08, Nominal 0.17, Max 0.25, Actual left 0.09, Actual Right 0.08

Cross Camber: Min -0.33, Nominal 0.00, Max 0.33, Actual -0.00
Cross caster: Min -0.50, Nominal 0.00, Max 0.50, Actual 0.8
Total Toe 0.17 0.33 0.50 0.18

Rear
Camber: Actual Left -1.2, Actual Right -1.3
Toe: Min 0.13, Nominal 0.21, Max 0.29, Actual Left 0.14, Actual Right 0.15

Total Toe: Min 0.25, Nominal 0.42, Max 0.59, Actual 0.29

It was nice that the mechanic found a published range of measurements that specified Minimum, Nominal, and Maximum. In a general way, however, I suppose you could say Camber = –1, Castor = 10, and Toe = 0.1, just to keep rather simple.

My car has a sporty look with the visible negative camber, it handles very well, it tracks straight, and so far my tires do not seem to be worn on the outside edge like they were when the car was stock. I have seen no indication that the tires have any kind of unusual wear pattern. In fact, the wear is so uniform I almost don’t feel like I need to rotate the tires.

I hope this helps you,

Ken

omegabenz · #27 12-31-2003, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by daulia71
My tires are a bit tucked in inside the fender using 18' rims.
I forgot what the offset is now, I have to look it up at home. The front tires do not wear as bad as the rear on the inside. I am not trying to adjust it to 0, if I can get somewhere around -1 that will be great. I don't know if the kmac will help at all, if not, I just have to buy a chepo tires & replace them every year.

Speedybenz sells rear camber arms for 202 cars.http://www.club202.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2030

here is the post

#28 12-31-2003, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by daulia71
My tires are a bit tucked in inside the fender using 18' rims.
I forgot what the offset is now, I have to look it up at home. The front tires do not wear as bad as the rear on the inside. I am not trying to adjust it to 0, if I can get somewhere around -1 that will be great. I don't know if the kmac will help at all, if not, I just have to buy a chepo tires & replace them every year.

If you decide to use camber arms you can check out my parts. Thay also include all new grade 8 hardware. They start at $149.00 plus 15% off forum the forum. The come red anodized or plain aluminum. 15% discount doesn't apply to the red anodized.

or with poly bushings:

omegabenz · #29 12-31-2003, 05:21 PM

MB racer, Do your camber arms work on the 202 as well as the 201 and 124? Also, are your arms using american hardware?

gsxr · #30 12-31-2003, 07:52 PM

Ya know, the steel arms with poly bushings at ~$170 after forum discount is looking like an awfully tempting option compared to the K-Mac setup for W124, which I believe is over $300 - right? I don't need extra toe adjustment, just camber adjustment. Hmmm. If that steel arm had a poly bushing at both ends it would be a no-brainer. The one bushing might offer enough "give" to make it acceptable for daily street use. I might give it a shot when I rebuild my rear suspension, either this spring or fall (I plan to actually DRIVE the car in summer instead of wrenching on it all the time for upgrades!)