Repair shop thinks I should sell car while I can??? Comments on these repairs please

[2quik6]

I bought a '87 560SL knowing it had a few issues, but nothing serious... My step-daughter used to work at a popular MB repair shop so we dropped it off..they called and said I should sell the car that it was not safe to drive?? wth..
Here's the issues, none of which are a safety issue I believe..and I'm sure I'll be posting up lots of questions later for each.

1) Transmission sometimes shifts very firmly into 2nd gear when very light on the throttle, if normally accellerating it shifts fine... Shop said the #2 cylinder in the tranny was blown and to replace would require tearing the tranny completely down and should probably rebuild it while apart..$2200.

2) Power steering fluid leak...how easy is it to replace the steering pump on these cars? Shop claimed it was pouring fluid out...it is wet underneath, but leaves no drops on the ground even after being parked for a day...

3) Transmission pan leaks..again not enough to leave a drop on the ground, but does blow by onto the exhaust and smokes a bit at shutdown...how difficult to change a trans pan gasket?

4) Steering coupler rattles under the dash...how hard to repair that yourself? Shop said nothing about this.

5) Shop said the head gaskets are leaking to...I inspected these and there is some wetness at the rear from oil, but not enough to even puddle any oil on the motor to drip off...I know this is a common issue with the 560's but this does not need to be tended to at this point.

6) How easy is it to replace dash indicator lights, such as the "hi beam" indicator?

7) Radiator needs flushing out, I see the drain, but how do you refill these on this car??

Shops says it would take $8-9k to fix all the issues so I should sell it...I think that is a bunch of hot air or am I wrong? Interior is mint with the exception of a dash cover covering sun damage on the dash as it was a CA car. Underside is pretty clean too, paint is beautiful and both tops are in perfect shape.

I've read about the timing chain and the center AC vents, but those too do not need tending to at this time, chain is quiet.

I do much of my own work on other cars, all the way to building motors in the past for my truck, and I have a lift in my garage, its just that I know nothing about this car so I may ask a lot of dumb questions on here

Any comments on any of the above issues is much appreciated.

[SunGuy]

You'll probably want a deeper answer other than what I would do in your situation, but, if it were my car, past relationship or not, I'd get a second opinion before doing anything. For example, the harsh shifting at low speeds may be what you were told, but in my car the same symptom was corrected by adjusting the shift cable.

The point is you've gotten 1 shops opinion, get another without telling the 2nd shop what the first one said. In your area there are a number of excellent indy's. The Good Shop Forum here lists many.

Good luck with the car-

Bob

[Roncallo]

All of these issues are quite common for these cars but usually they dont all happen at the same time. But your leakage isses seam exagerated no puddles I wouldent worry about them.

Transmission make sure the guy is diagnosing this correctly the car normally starts out in second gear. I would start buy changing trans fluid lubricating and adjusting all linkages. And I'm not sure but I belive this transmission has an adjustable or at least replaceable vacume modulator.

Power stearing leak more than likely is from the stearing gearbox. There again no puddel ???.

Changing the aintifreez, I would recomend you do yourself because most shops will only drain the radiator anyway. I recently posted a proceedure for doing this. You add antifreez to the system by putting it into the expansion tank, which is the round plastic tank over on the right with a radiator cap on it.

Dash lights are easy. You will need to disconnect the battery and remove the airbag and stearing wheel. The instrument cluster is just held in with friction and is removed with a hook type tool theat you can make out of a thick coat hanger. Search this forum for details. If anyone charges you more than $100.00 to change these bulbs they are scewing you. When you do this replace all the bulbs and also replace the one in the light switch.

The only thing I would focuse on here is the transmission as far as a should I sell it issue.

Also how many miles are on this car

John Roncallo

[2quik6]

Thanks for the replies.
As for all the leaks, none leaves a single drop on the ground after parking for as long as 24-hrs, the seepage does blow back onto the exhaust and a little smoke bellows up after parking it but thats it, the bottom is pretty wet, I'm surprised there are no drips on the driveway.

Car has 92k miles on it.

I see there are seal kits for the gearbox available, there's no noise so I take it redoing the seals would probably fix that leak.

I read a lot till late last night on the tranny issues, its seems like it could just be vac related and maybe an easy fix, seems like it the piston was bad it would flare causing soft shifts and higher revs and its not doing that, but could it also cause firm shift at low rpm?
Hopefully just a vac line, mod replace pr cable adjustment there.

Overall, I don't think there's anything here I can't tackle myself, so you'll probably see alot more detailed questions on each task as I get to them if I don't find everything searching thru here.

I don't think all these items went bad at once, just the previous owner who owned the car 15 years since 1992 didn't fix the little things as they went worng but just continued to drive the car.

Not sure where the shop was coming from saying it was a safety issue for my daughter except maybe the fact they didn't think the car was dependable and may leave her stranded somewhere, she will be driving this car a whole alot once its fixed...about 60 miles round trip to work and 60 miles round trip to school, she probably racks up 30k miles a year easy.

[230/8]

You know, these do not sound like fatal flaws.

Leakage is fairly common and as the car ages can often be addressed adequately by a fluid change and a new gasket. Here is something to consider, the refiners are now providing what they call high mileage fluids. BAsically the same fluids, but with a bit stronger additive package to keep seals and gaskets soft as they get older. Consider a trans and PS fluid change with something like Valvoline High Mileage Dexron III/Mercon ATF fluid. Good quality stuff that meets the original specs for your trans and PS.

The shifting does sound like adjustment is the issue.

Steering coupler is under the hood, I believe and can be replaced. If there is a rattle under the dash it may be a wire bundle knocking around. Did anyone replace the radio with an aftermarket? Check under the dash...remove the cover panel and see if there is anything loose in there.

You need to remove the steering wheel to pull out the dash. It just sits in the binnacle with a friction fit. Once the wheel is off, no sweat on the lamps...replace them all at the same time.

Lotsa of varying opinions on the coolant issue...MB fluid only or aftermarket?? Methinks there is too much obsession over this. The latest "global" coolants seem fine so long as you do a proper flush and fill. I have used the dreaded green stuff for years with absolutely no problems. I just change it regularly. Others swear that the green stuff is certain death with any system having plastic components. If true, that would seem to suggest using the latest global coolants for newer systems with plastic, and Zerex G05 is available at Checker, etc. Or, do it easy on yourself, go to goofy lube and have them use G05 with their flush machine which simply jumpers into your radiator hoses and gets all the nasty stuff out. Another bit of coolant heresy for you to consider.

Finally, consider another indy shop, and another opinion for anything we suggest or that was suggested by your first shop. Most well-informed mechanics will admit that conscientuous regular preventative maintenance by a knowledgable owner is far more important than using a specific brand of something.

My two-cents,

230/8

I have seen this situation before, my advice is to laugh at the shop and collect your fine auto before they convince you to sell it to them for a bargsin price.

The issues you describe are common to all of these cars, and a honest mechanic can help you deal with these issues at a fraction of the prices quoted.

[450slcguy]

Originally Posted by 2quik6

Not sure where the shop was coming from saying it was a safety issue for my daughter except maybe the fact they didn't think the car was dependable and may leave her stranded somewhere, she will be driving this car a whole alot once its fixed...about 60 miles round trip to work and 60 miles round trip to school, she probably racks up 30k miles a year easy.

Mostly common issues and not safety related. (Fix that steering knuckle ASAP)

30k miles a year is alot for the ole 560 though. I can understand why your mechanic would discourage having your daughter trust putting that kind of yearly mileage on a 20 year old car. The 560sl is a great car, but at 20+ years old I wouldn't use it as a 30k a year commute vehicle.

[GSMITH]

With 92k miles on the car you will need to replace the timing chain and upper guides soon. $300-400 DIY $900-1200 at shop lots of posts on this site. The rest does not seem to be a big deal cost wise if you DIY.
Get the CD from www.mbusa.com. Best $20 you will spend on this car.

Before you go replacing parts try retightening the bolts around the gaskets. The power steering pump top cover oring seal can get hard with age and not seal well. If the front of the pump is wet and the rest is dry then you can get a reseal kit for it. If it is leaking alot the fluid will kill all of the rubber parts on the sub frame.

Having read most of your posts you or your step daughter at least seem to have a good relationship with this shop. But I have seen good shops go bad after a change of managment. I also hate scare tactics and will never go to a shop after they try to scare me thinking I do not know any better.
I had one go as far as signing a release of responsibility for a non issue.

I do not really understand why you would buy this car for your step daughter knowing she would put 30k miles a year on it. At 15 mpg that is going to be costly and after 3 years you will have to do the timing chain again.

If it were me I would either do the following fix the leaks, change the timing chain and flush the brake lines before she starts to drive it or sell it now and find a easier to fix anywhere and more cost effective commuter car. Unless you are willing to pay $tealership prices for parts you will have a hard time finding them at your local parts store.

Ask yourself this would you be willing to loan her one of your other cars while you are waiting for parts??? Your 87 Grand National would be a better choice for her than the 87 560SL. Better mpg and easier to get parts.

[2quik6]

Thanks for all the replies and helpful info this gives me alot to go on. I am taking it to another shop for a second opinion. I have no relationship with the shop we took it to, my stepdaughter does as she used to work there and her Dad has 2 80's diesel MB he has serviced there so we figured they would be fair, but the guy that I talked to that looked at the car is very young and my stepdaughter did not get along with him so I'm not weighing what he said very heavy, and if the shop owner lets him talk to customers with the attitude he had when he talked to me then I don't care to ever go back.
The next shop is actually a very good aquaintance in the local Buick club, services almost 75% of the turbo Buicks in teh club and has some LT1 cars he races as I do. I did not know his shop actually started out as a MB repair so I just chatted with him and he knows these cars very well it sounds so it will go there in a couple weeks.

See if I can answer the questions/comments so far:
230/8, yes the radio had been replaced and it works off and on. I've always used the green stuff, Prestone in every car I have and never had an issue, never heard of it eating plastic parts and the entire rad tank ends on most new cars are plastic. This radiator threw me for a loop since there was no top filler cap..only the overflow bottle seemed strange.

John, yes I agree with that, I alway try to do most everything myself because of that, but I'm just out of time this summer it seems.

450slc and GSSmith, great advice on the seals, yeah its not my #1 concern since its not leaving any on the ground. She also has a '84 300D diesel to drive for now, has been her 1st and only car for the last 7 years with almost 300k on the clock, so I think we'll be hanging on to that for a while. Yes, its alot of driving and I'm trying to encourage her to keep the diesel, her dad has 2 80's diesels also and he has the relationship with the shop still. The guy that talked to me about the car was just too imature IMO for what he was claiming and his attitude saying it. For her graduation I told her I would get her a car, anyone she wanted...her response was a mid 80's SL or a 70's Trans Am...either one of those IMO doesn't make a very good daily driver, but that was all she'd have and the MB being a lot safer stronger built car we went that direction, plus her Dad would not agree about the TA.
The turbo Buick was totally out of the question...I tried that route, her Mom said that was waayyy tooo much power for her, and I'd have to agree with that...not to mention their stolen rate is pretty high now.
So, hopefully she'll keep the 300D and not drive this one near that much...it is a beautiful car that I hope she can keep a long time.

But at the same time, I did not do all of my homework on these that I should have before buying this one due to hectic times and quit frankly got tired of trying to find the perfect car and she liked this one so we got it. Appearance wise the car has been kept nice.

FYI, the second shop which I know from the Buick club said he could fix the leaks but they would just start leaking again and the heads leaking a little is common too, he could fix that as well but it would start leaking again, if its not leaking enough to leave drips and there's no lose of compression not to worry about it...this is something the other guy made a big production out of so that shows his honesty plus he's considered a friend in all the local Buick community. He's just going to evaluate fixing them once he sees the car.

[GSMITH]

Two dads that like older Benz's.
Glad you found someone you can trust.

If you are going to do any work on this car yourself a good set of Allen/Hex wrenchs and or sockets are needed.

Fix the tranny leak soon. Since you have a lift it will not take long to do a fluid and filter change since the drain pan has a drain plug in it. At 92k miles it is probrobly due for it anyway. And the kit is less than $30.
http://catalog.worldpac.com/mercedesshop/sophio/wizard.jsp?partner=mercedesshop&clientid=catalog.mercedesshop&baseurl=http://catalog.peachparts.com/&cookieid=21V0I9EQT2310PDMQJ&year=1987&make=MB&model=560-SL-001&category=J&part=AT+Filter+Kit

The power steering pump leak will not be this cheap or easy.

Let us know what your new mechanics says after he sees the car.
Good Luck

[2quik6]

Just FYI, haven't made any progress with this, I did get it to my buddy's shop last week, but he hasn't had time to get to it knowing they we had another car to drive and he's had a few customers come in with their only driver that he needed to get to before ours...no big deal.

[2quik6]

Alright, got the car back earlier in the week! THis baby drives sweet now. The tranny was simply a cable adjustment, shifts smooth as glass now..the other shop claimed it was toast..
Steering is very firm now, steers like a sports car now. Engine is very quite, starts on first try too now.
The shop pulled the tranny and put in new seals, and put in a new rear main seal while it was out, changed all the fluids, tranny, oil, radiator. Replaced the power steering pump, left gear box alone, replaced the steering coupler, totally replaced the AC and converted it to R134A, new compressor, drier, etc. Also fixed the vacuum motors for the vent, all vents work now and defrost works, however he did say the middle 2 will always blow until there is reason to tear the entire dash apart to fix it correctly..but at least the center 2 and defrost work now. Replaced timing chain and all the upper guides too.
Total cost was $6k, the most I've ever spent for repairs, but there was a lot of repairs and I didn't have the time to do them all, overall very happy and all repairs have a 12 month 12k warranty...and I picked up a starter for my next door neighbors '83 500SL grey market car from him.
I'd have to recommend him to anyone in DFW area, International Motor Cars in Rowlett.