advice on a v12 600e coupe 1996

[mus]

Need some advice from the wise and experienced.

My 1992 400e is coming up to retirement. I put about 2600-3000 miles on a car a year only, though whatever I get would be my daily driver. For that milage I don't want to spend a tremendous amount on a new car, it simply does not make sense in terms of depreciation; and I like older german cars with some soul in them. But I also need something solid and reasonable in terms of upkeep. The 400e has served that purpose well for 6 years. bought it for 4k never had it break on me, had some years with 1k or more of repairs, and others with none beyond oil changes and other maintenance, etc.

I am beginning to look around for a suitable replacement and have recently been tempted by a 1996 s600. black on black/grey; visibly it is great shape, perfect interior/leather and paint minus a minor scrape on the front corner fender. everything seems to work. drives like a dream. both throttle bodies just replaced along with rear shocks. about 70k mileage 12k but probably could get it for a bit less, also would sell or trade the 400e.


Before I send the car over to my trusted swiss german mechanic for checking just thought I would ping the forum, which has given me some great guidance, on whether I have am simply delusional on the ability of a 1996 v12 to fit the needs listed above.

The forums are a bit split on the v12s between whether they are a relatively reasonable in terms of maintenance, with the m120 being not much different than the m119 in terms of costs of upkeep, and those who say that if you have to even ask about maintenance costs of a v12 then you have no business even thinking about getting one. the 1996 has done away with caps and rotors, does not have the biodegradable wiring harness, etc. The heat build up is a concern as I live in a hot and humid place and almost all of the issues I have had with the 400e are perhaps reasonably attributed in part to age and in part to a really hot engine compartment adding wearing parts (belt tensioner, every 2 years, caps and rotors, every 2-3 years, cracked tubes, worn out cooling fans, electronics baked, etc). plus the mono-wiper that had to be replaced because of baked/dried grease in the gears, headliner collapsing due to dried out glue, etc. Thus, I am a concerned about a v12 in a coupe body baking everything unless they figured out a better cooling and airflow system. Then there is the factor that the 600s coupes are not as common as the sedan models, making replacement parts, engine or otherwise, rather more rare and thus costly.

I can do some things, caps/rotors/plugs, minor fixes, belts, new headliner installation, r&r an instrument cluster, that sort of thing. But I am not looking for a hobby.

for the money or a bit more i could get a 2000s era c or e class merc or a 3 or 5 series bmw with similar miles however. or I could jump the germanic ship ( I rented a g37 a year ago on a trip and i have to say I was quite impressed and it made me think there may be non-german, more reliable, alternatives. Doubt either the newer mercs nor alternatives wil have the same "soul" as the old w124 or w120s however. But soul can be high maintenance. on the other hand, its a nice nice ride.

[Gilly]

Nice when they are running good, absolute nightmare when they fail. Run.

[mus]

thanks skid row joe. I am down the road from you in houston actually...glad the new old car is good. my first mercedes was a 1977 300D. wonderful machine. though you had to time road crossings differently as it was so slow in acceleration. I'd be fine with a deisel, well maybe a w124 or newer one at least.

The depreciation is exactly the thing; buying a new car, be it a mercedes or ford would mean eating huge sums in depreciation relative to miles used. simply does not make any sense. Warren buffet has never bought a new car, either, btw; once heard him explain that to him it simply made no sense to do so given depreciation as that first year effectively costs you up to half the price of the car. Though I doubt he drives around that much anyway.

In any case, I would rather have something I enjoy driving for those 2500 miles a year. The balance to look for therefore the price and depreciation of a new car or recent used car vs the price plus maintenance on an older model.

But I have to admit that the tales of newer mercedes (post merger) quality being lower and reliability issues concern me. and there is something about the older w124/w140 era models. Though I still dont think the w124 is as solid as the w123. everything on the w123 oozed quality to me, from the leather to the window switches (they really "clicked" and were in a chrome frame (not just sitting in a cut out in the wood veneer as in the w124, though having said that the veneers in the w123 seemed thin an warp prone), even inserting a tape into the otherwise awful Becker Mexico Cassette radio was a real mechanical and solid event.

not sure how any of that ties into s600...i love the way it felt and drove. but then again, I have to say that the seatbelt arms thingy's seemed sort a cool but also less like a great engineering solution and more like a kludge to compensate for a design issue elsewhere, and a really expensive maintenance issue waiting to happen when the gears inside it strip out due to age, etc.

And one last thing, the buttons that release the door pocket covers--those could have had a more solid tactile response. maybe its just the one I looked at, but they seemed too flimsy relative to everything else.


but that v12....it was amazing overall. though my m119 v8 is, I would say about 75% as smooth and powerful when running optimally.

I kind of fell for the v8 and v12s I think...

Ah, the solution, a 1993 -95 500e w124...anyone in houston want to sell theirs?

[tdoriot]

I have a 93 600 SL. Bought it with the infamous A$$Reamer (ASR) issue. I rolled the dice and with the help of the gang @ BenzWorld I bird dogged the problems and with a few hundredin military grade teflon wiring, I had a new car ! Amazing cars. Bargain of the century. $130,000 car for less than 5 %. Leaves me around $123,000 for repairs before I catch up with the original owner. The driving experience of the V12 is turbine like in it's power. Top speed way above what I can find apace to stretch its legs.
Of course considering it was built 20 years ago, it is amazingly complex. The systems are complicated and parts and mechanics labor expensive. These cars are not for the timid of heart, mechanically disinclined, or financially challenged. (but I love em anyway !). I may have even bought another V12 129 today