SLs hold value better?

[TheDon]

Originally Posted by rs899

It is for those reasons that I am steering my wife, who wants a roadster, away from an R129 and towards an R107. And SLKs? forget it!

w124 cabriolet..

[winecountryone]

Originally Posted by rs899

It is for those reasons that I am steering my wife, who wants a roadster, away from an R129 and towards an R107. And SLKs? forget it!

Kinda curious about why you would not want the SLK.I have heard fewer reports of trouble with them than the 129's
30 mpg is hard to beat.HP wise they are equal or better than my D-jet 450.I have been thinking about one for a while now.I want a stick which were only made for 2-3 years and are very hard to find though.

[deanyel]

Originally Posted by winecountryone

Kinda curious about why you would not want the SLK.I have heard fewer reports of trouble with them than the 129's
30 mpg is hard to beat.HP wise they are equal or better than my D-jet 450.I have been thinking about one for a while now.I want a stick which were only made for 2-3 years and are very hard to find though.

Don't know if it's true but I once saw a report that painting the SLK roof, without taking off the old paint, would render the top inoperable, so close are the tolerances. Not a good thing for a classic car.

[JimFreeh]

[QUOTE=deanyel;2568009]We may have to agree to disagree about this. I'm not suggesting I have a cyrstal ball but find it inconceivable that any 1990s Mercedes with ASR is ever going to be a desirable classic car. QUOTE]





I've got a good sized lifetime collection of car related books and magazines.

Per this discussion, my two favorite examples relating to whether current or not-too-old-yet cars will ever be worth collecting:

#1: It's an early fifties book on how to buy a used car. Published by Motor Trend. The author makes a strong point to avoid buying any open car, any car with more than eight cylinders, or luxury cars with low production and/or custom bodies. They also make the point to take the little woman along when looking at a car to make sure she can drive it, because, you never know, she might have to drive it in an emergency.....

#2: Mid sixties CCCA book declaring that all the collectable cars have already been made, and nobody will be saving/collecting cars from the sixties. Then they go on to specifically state that the Ford Mustang will never be worth saving....

This is akin to the guy that owns the ponton thinking MB went to hell with the finbacks, the guy who owns a finback thinks the W114/W115 cars are inferior cars to his, the guy that owns the W115 thinks Mercedes lost it's way with the W123 series, the guy that owns the W123 thinks he's got the last good MB, the guy that owns the W124 thinks that his is truly the last model that you can work on..... Wait, maybe that W124 owner is on to something...

I love convertibles, have owned at least one at any given time since my 59 190SL in 1974, currently have 5. If you're correct that the public will shun these cars, then that's great also, it will be less expensive to purchase another down the road.


Regards,

Jim

[JimFreeh]

Originally Posted by deanyel

We may have to agree to disagree about this. Owning a classic car is supposed to be about pleasure and enjoyment, not pain and suffering.

Deanyel,

Obviously, you've never owned a vintage Jaguar!

Regards,

Jim

[alabbasi]

Originally Posted by JimFreeh

Deanyel,

Obviously, you've never owned a vintage Jaguar!

Regards,

Jim

That's a good point, there are cars that are far more complicated then the R129 which are already more collectible today. I would not be too worried about these parts, MB supports its cars better then any other manufacturer and if a part becomes NLA or not a good solution, then re-builders will come up with a solution.

We see this today with rebuilt fuel distributors and digital climate control servos.

[Skid Row Joe]

Originally Posted by JimFreeh

I've got a good sized lifetime collection of car related books and magazines.

Per this discussion, my two favorite examples relating to whether current or not-too-old-yet cars will ever be worth collecting:

#1: It's an early fifties book on how to buy a used car. Published by Motor Trend. The author makes a strong point to avoid buying any open car, any car with more than eight cylinders, or luxury cars with low production and/or custom bodies. They also make the point to take the little woman along when looking at a car to make sure she can drive it, because, you never know, she might have to drive it in an emergency.....

#2: Mid sixties CCCA book declaring that all the collectable cars have already been made, and nobody will be saving/collecting cars from the sixties. Then they go on to specifically state that the Ford Mustang will never be worth saving....

This is akin to the guy that owns the ponton thinking MB went to hell with the finbacks, the guy who owns a finback thinks the W114/W115 cars are inferior cars to his, the guy that owns the W115 thinks Mercedes lost it's way with the W123 series, the guy that owns the W123 thinks he's got the last good MB, the guy that owns the W124 thinks that his is truly the last model that you can work on..... Wait, maybe that W124 owner is on to something...

I love convertibles, have owned at least one at any given time since my 59 190SL in 1974, currently have 5. If you're correct that the public will shun these cars, then that's great also, it will be less expensive to purchase another down the road.


Regards,

Jim

So true Jim!

However, I can honestly say that the W211s (diesel) are better than my car a diesel W210. I don't get hung-up on thinking my car is better than the latest model. That's just foolhardy. And it may be envy at work too, by claiming their old stuff is better than new. Some have class envy going on - whatever for I haven't a clue.

[rs899]

Kinda curious about why you would not want the SLK.I have heard fewer reports of trouble with them than the 129's

Maybe I am just too old, but I honestly don't see the point of the excessive use of electronics in modern vehicles. The thought of trying to locate a module, board or electronic device on an SLK 10 years from now makes my head spin. I am perfectly capable of raising or lowering the top without the use of 12 hydraulic cylinders, and once the seat is adjusted it's adjusted. I don't need ABS, traction control, back-up cameras to get from A to B. I don't fancy paying for repairs or the headaches associated with keeping all that stuff working. The R107 (non D-jet) would be for my wife, who drives maybe 100-150 miles a week, so mileage isn't really important. Heck- I would prefer she use the TR4, if she would ever learn to drive a stick.

Look at the vehicles in my sig. Global thermonuclear war? Bring it on....my rides will survive....

Rick (the barbarian)

[winecountryone]

Originally Posted by deanyel

Don't know if it's true but I once saw a report that painting the SLK roof, without taking off the old paint, would render the top inoperable, so close are the tolerances. Not a good thing for a classic car.

Wow,that's amazing! I guess these aren't quite old enough yet to have these problems surface but when they get to the age of our 107's you probably won't be able to give one away.I for the most part appreciate simplicity,but was really smitten with these after driving them and seeing that retractable top in action.
On a hypothetical note I wonder how much that retractable top adds to the cost of the vehicle? They never made a "soft top" SLK but the 3rd generation Mazda miata comes in both versions.The retractable is about 5-6K more than it's soft top sibling!

[alabbasi]

Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe

I can honestly say that the W211s (diesel) are better than my car a diesel W210.

That's so true that I can't even imagine people arguing otherwise. MB has 8-10 year production runs for the most part and there is a lot of progress that can be made in that time.

I would get into discussions with W123 owners who thought that they on a car that is better then the W210. If you think that 20 years of progress resulted in a worse car, you have to be bonkers.

More charming, simpler maybe but it cannot be a better car.

Originally Posted by rs899

Maybe I am just too old, but I honestly don't see the point of the excessive use of electronics in modern vehicles.

For the most part, they make the job of a mechanic much easier and repair costs cheaper as less time needs to be spent diagnosing the problem.

This is because there are computers in place constantly monitoring what the car is doing. These computers can be scanned in order to tell you exactly what is wrong with your car.

Case and point is my last modern ride. A 1997 E420 which I sold about 2 years ago. I owned that car for about 6 years and it was extremely reliable. If the check engine light ever came on, I would plug in my OBDII scanner and it would tell me exactly what was wrong with it.

In most cases it was a faulty coil pack but I did have a couple of broken vacuum lines also. I knew where to look and replaced the faulty part in about 20 minutes.

The E420 is easily the best car that I have ever owned. It was blisteringly quick, silky smooth, extremely comfortable and got 25mpg on the highway which is something else when you consider that it's a 275hp 32valve v8.

Even though it was 11 years old and had 140,000 miles when I sold it, it looked brand new. If I ever valet parked it, it would be parked up front.

I sold it because I had owned it for a long time, and I became more attracted to the old school charm of the 70's and 80's models. I figured that if I ever wanted another one, it would not be too hard to find.

I do regret selling it sometimes for the above reasons and also for some odd ball reason, women don't find my beaten up old 560SEC with the clear coat peeling as attractive as my old E420.

Complex components do not necessarily have to be problematic or unreliable. 10-12 years ago, when i first started getting into these cars, people would scare me away with horror stories about the complexities of a 450SEL 6.9. This is when they were 13-20 years old. It turns out that the hydro-pneumatic suspension on the 6.9 is very reliable and with the exception of the air cells, very little goes wrong with it. It's basically a 4 wheel version of the rear SLS that you see in a W123 300TD.

Now that the R129 is around the same age as the 6.9 when I was first introduced to them, and I'm hearing about the same horror stories about the complexity of these cars as I did about the 6.9 then.

If these stories can bring the price down of a nice black 1998 SL500 with black leather down to less then $6, then I'm all for them to be spread around :-)

[deanyel]

Originally Posted by alabbasi

That's a good point, there are cars that are far more complicated then the R129 which are already more collectible today.

You have to keep mind the numbers. There are some very exotic, complex and rare cars that have become valuable, and are almost always owned by the very rich. 129s don't have the rareness to ever be that. Market value, or the lack of it, has an impact on the appetite for expensive servicing. There needs to be a very broad ownership market to support a car that was manufactured in the hundreds of thousands.

[Skid Row Joe]

Originally Posted by alabbasi

That's so true that I can't even imagine people arguing otherwise. MB has 8-10 year production runs for the most part and there is a lot of progress that can be made in that time.

I would get into discussions with W123 owners who thought that they on a car that is better then the W210. If you think that 20 years of progress resulted in a worse car, you have to be bonkers.

More charming, simpler maybe but it cannot be a better car.



For the most part, they make the job of a mechanic much easier and repair costs cheaper as less time needs to be spent diagnosing the problem.

This is because there are computers in place constantly monitoring what the car is doing. These computers can be scanned in order to tell you exactly what is wrong with your car.

Case and point is my last modern ride. A 1997 E420 which I sold about 2 years ago. I owned that car for about 6 years and it was extremely reliable. If the check engine light ever came on, I would plug in my OBDII scanner and it would tell me exactly what was wrong with it.

In most cases it was a faulty coil pack but I did have a couple of broken vacuum lines also. I knew where to look and replaced the faulty part in about 20 minutes.

The E420 is easily the best car that I have ever owned. It was blisteringly quick, silky smooth, extremely comfortable and got 25mpg on the highway which is something else when you consider that it's a 275hp 32valve v8.

Even though it was 11 years old and had 140,000 miles when I sold it, it looked brand new. If I ever valet parked it, it would be parked up front.

I sold it because I had owned it for a long time, and I became more attracted to the old school charm of the 70's and 80's models. I figured that if I ever wanted another one, it would not be too hard to find.

I do regret selling it sometimes for the above reasons and also for some odd ball reason, women don't find my beaten up old 560SEC with the clear coat peeling as attractive as my old E420.

Complex components do not necessarily have to be problematic or unreliable. 10-12 years ago, when i first started getting into these cars, people would scare me away with horror stories about the complexities of a 450SEL 6.9. This is when they were 13-20 years old. It turns out that the hydro-pneumatic suspension on the 6.9 is very reliable and with the exception of the air cells, very little goes wrong with it. It's basically a 4 wheel version of the rear SLS that you see in a W123 300TD.

Now that the R129 is around the same age as the 6.9 when I was first introduced to them, and I'm hearing about the same horror stories about the complexity of these cars as I did about the 6.9 then.

If these stories can bring the price down of a nice black 1998 SL500 with black leather down to less then $6, then I'm all for them to be spread around :-)

I may be kicking myself after I buy a 2006/'07/'08 E320 (W211) diesel and have some sort of massive problems/costs after selling off my W210 '99 ETD, but I am probably going to take the chance on the desired upgrade. I am not a multiple car owner - just me.

The charm factor is something that cannot be measured, nor always needs to be justified in a person's mind and soul. That enters enthusiast territory - and does not need to be justified.

The 107s are beautiful cars! My fav. would be the '89 560SL.

Another factor is the newness factor - I feel I'd like a newer diesel E-Class. I don't need one, but I would like one. I was going to go 15+ years owning this W210 - but I have the itch for a newer (not new) diesel car. So, it goes.

[Dee8go]

Originally Posted by abiby

Hey, if you need someone to agree with you so you can convince your wife....

Of course they hold their value better.

How was that?

No, the lady in my life has had 2 SLs and currently is driving an SLK. She doesn't need convincing of anything.
This post was based solely on my impressions from looking at used SLs. It seems to me like they retain their value better than other models like the sedans, for instance.
Maybe that's my impression because I want an SL rather than one of the other models . . . .

[elau]

The value of any car goes up if you hold on to it long enough. Junk tends to turn into treasure the older it gets.

[Skid Row Joe]

Originally Posted by Dee8go

No, the lady in my life has had 2 SLs and currently is driving an SLK. She doesn't need convincing of anything.
This post was based solely on my impressions from looking at used SLs. It seems to me like they retain their value better than other models like the sedans, for instance.
Maybe that's my impression because I want an SL rather than one of the other models . . . .

If you don't want the CLS, I'd understand why you would want an SL. But if you are keeping the CLS, for my money I'd rather have a Corvette as my fun car than an SL any day. Corvette clubs and enthusiasts all over the country would be a lot more fun than most MB clubs. If I fit better w/o feeling claustrophobic, I'd probably have another Corvette.

An SL is not a sports car, especially in the last 50 years or so. It's a personal luxury car - just like the CLS, that only has two doors and two seats. I don't get the draw to them, my 300 ETD is every bit as fun/responsive to drive as most any mundane 107, it just doesn't look like one.