Come laugh at the newbie
 

I'd post this in Diesel Discussion or Tech Help, but frankly I'd feel too foolish, and I think it's best left to professionals at this point anyway.

Today I set out to do my first oil change on the 1985 300D I picked up from a forum member about 3 or 4 weeks ago. With oil, filter, tools, and the car up on ramps in the garage, I set out first to remove the top of the oil filter housing. The first danger sign was that I couldn't budge either bolt. I marinated them in WD-40 for a while to no avail, then asked my boyfriend to have a try. I wanted to know if they were really stuck, or if I was just 'being a girl'. He had to apply considerable effort, but he was able to dislodged both -- strike one for the girl :)

Next, remove the drain plug from the oil pan. The boyfriend, confident that nothing could possibly go wrong now, is on his way home, ten minutes into his drive when I call him: "So, how long should I have to turn this thing, anyway?"

When I first started ratcheting on the plug, it was tough -- very tough. So tough, in fact, that remembering with shame my earlier 'girl trouble' trying to dislodge the bolts for the oil filter housing, I resolved to brace myself and/or apply any leverage necessary to get that thing turning. The alternative, after all, was to wait until tomorrow, when the boyfriend would turn back up to rescue me, and I didn't want that.

I braced my feet against a tire and really hauled on the ratchet. Nothing happened. I tried again. It was verrry hard, but it moved a bit. I hauled on it some more, and slowly it started to give. Soon, I could ratchet one-handed. Five minutes later, I could still ratchet with one hand. Shouldn't something have happened by now? I expected the plug to fall out by now. Haynes didn't say anything about ratcheting until your arm fell off.

That's the point I called my boyfriend. "Do you see any threads?" he asked. Well... no. "If you turn it the other way, does it tighten up?" I tried it, and nothing changed. But after several seconds of ratcheting, it turned even more easily! I turned some more with renewed enthusiasm, but soon realized, I'm still not seeing any threads. At his suggestion, I tried loosening it by hand, but couldn't. There's no play in it at all, either, although more oil seems to be getting on my fingers at this point. It certainly can't be pulled straight out, and no matter how many times it's turned, it isn't coming out.

The conclusion seems obvious: I've singlehandedly managed to strip the threads on the drain plug, rendering my new Mercedes undrivable the first time I tried to do any maintenance on it.

I've gone inside for the night to ponder how to get the thing towed to someone who knows what they're doing well enough to fix my problem and maybe change the oil while they're at it. I'm also wondering how much the tow truck guy is going to laugh at me, and what this means for my future attempts at working on this car.

How bad a screw-up is this? Does this happen to everyone, or is this an indication of my blinding lack of aptitude? Has anyone else done anything this unforeseeably silly the first time out?

Maybe you stripped the pawl on the ratchet?

What direction did you try to turn the drain when you 'really hauled on the ratchet'? Clockwise tightens.
Counterclockwise loosens. If you're lucky, you stripped the tool.

Happy Motoring, Mark

Dah!
 

Yikes! I guess I don't know my own strength. I even use new drainplug washers each time too, and clean and de-crud the threads; replace the plug if it looks messed up at all... I didn't torque any of those bolts, and I certainly didnt take it to any crummy lube shop that would have...
I had mobil 1 15w50 full synthetic in there too... (was only about 2k miles on that oil/filter, by the way)
SORRY!!
(still, it's pretty easy once you've done it once or twice)
hope it is better in the morning!!
k

Just checked... clockwise was my original direction of turn :(

Oh no, I'm certain this is me not knowing what I'm doing, and not a fault in previous maintenance. Somehow I need to learn the difference between a bolt that is hard to turn because it's part of a 19-year-old vehicle, and one that's hard to turn because I'm doing something drastically wrong. I hope I can start learning that in a way that isn't quite so destructive... :(

Cannot laugh anymore
 

Hello,
You just had some bad luck, that's all.
Over the years, I have scrapped good carbs and other expensive car parts by applying too much force to screws, nuts and other fasteners.
I hate to tell you this, but it happens.......even to the pros.
DO NOT be shy of asking for help if unsure about repair procedures.

sorry to hear of this dilemma.

gosh now it seems you have nothing to lose. get an adjustable or right size wrench and try to turn the plug counterclockwise. if it won't start to come out try to wedge a thin screwdriver between the plug and the oil pan, and with the screwdriver still in there, use the adjustable again.
good luck.

It's likely, if that drain bolt has any threads left inside the oil pan, they're so mangled it will never come out. (At least not with any force you can apply with a thin screwdriver) But, at this point, what have you got to lose? You'll probably need to remove the oil pan, cut the bolt head off and drive the stub INWARD to clear the hole. If the oil pan threads are ruined you'll need a new oil pan.

Now for the good news. According to my manual, the 5 cylinder diesel has the older style 2-piece, upper & lower oil pan. The lower section, containing the stripped drain, should be easily removeable, without having to pull the engine. Worst case - you'll need a new lower oil pan & gasket and drain plug & washer.
You'll need an allen wrench for the oil pan bolts. Just don't turn them the wrong way!

Happy Motoring, Mark

I dont' know... I might be wrong on this but...

If the drain plug was in correctly and wasn't turned
the wrong way, wouldn't it be hard to strip the
threads?
Now, if someone cross-threaded it while putting
it back in then I can see this happening.
No doubt some smart a$$ used an impact wrench on it.

Just a thought.


Louis.

webwench don't worry we all make mistakes. I have stripped many fasteners, I just stripped the head out of the 9mm hex head bolt that holds my passengers side engine mount on. Who ever put that bolt in was sick! If you want a challenge you could pull the lower pan yourself and replace it? I have never been under a 617 but from what others have said it is not to hard.

Thanks for the moral and technical support
 

Things look a little less dire this morning...

I will try the screwdriver trick, after which, if unsuccessful, it looks like the next project is dropping the bottom half of the drain pan. You are correct that it is a two-part pan and it looks easy enough -- messy though! I'll report back tonight with results.

OK, No big deal. A new lower oil pan, gasket and drain plug is only about $40 and very easy to change, even though it's a bit messy. I had to do this on my 240D when the oil pan got a hole punched in it. With the car on ramps you can do this in about 15 minutes.

Except for propane bottles
 

Webwench always chant this mantra when you're working on the Benz....'Lefty loosey , Righty tighty', even when you're upside down if the wrench is at the 12 o'clock position turning it to the left will loosen it and to the right will tighten it. Also always look for where your knuckles will end up if the wrench slips or loosens suddenly , don't ask how I know this :rolleyes: .Good luck , Kyle.

nope. I put it in, by hand. no impact wrench.

No laughing. That would be rude, incensitive and impolite.

I must commend you on your writing skills. You tell a story very well. Great style.

You seemed to have tightened your drainplug instead of loosening it. Tightened it so much that you stripped all its' threads. You should be proud. Not many would have had the strength to do what you did.

Always remember: Righty tighty, lefty loosey.

Good luck.

OMG, I wish one third of my screw-ups were as cheap to fix as this. You can get the pan and other parts from FastLane (see top of window). You are going to make a mess. Don't worry about it. Just run down to the local autoparts store and buy a big bad of oil-dry (kitty litter). You just cover any oil you spill with it and sweep it up later.
Have one person (strong) hold the pan up while you remove the screws. They can lower it down, holding it level, to the ground. Then just remove the old gasket (gently) and clean up the gasket surface. Put everything together with a new gasket. Be sure to put the new drain plug (with copper washer) in the pan before you add oil or you will learn the do-it-yourselfers' mantra: "Don't ask me how I know". BTW, you may now officially use it.
Little tip: use a small screwdriver to remove the crud out of the allen wrench hole in the oil pan bolts. That way, you can get the allen driver deep into the bolt and not round out the hole. Anyone remember what size it takes so she can buy the right one?
BobK

I believe it's 5mm. There are about 20 allen screws to remove. Since the oil pan is toast anyway, you might want to carefully punch a small hole in it and let the oil drain out in a controlled manner. That way removing the pan is not so messy.

A squirt of carburator or brake cleaner into the allen bolt holes before beginning should clean them out. An allen socket and extension will make the job much easier than an allen wrench.
If you have a Pick and Pull junkyard nearby you should be able to get a pan and drain plug for about $5.

An even simpler solution is simply to buy one of the suction devices that removes oil thru the dipstick and simply forget about the drain plug unless it is leaking.

What a great and classic story! Thanks for sharing! Once you get through it, a really good tool is this:

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=6970&langId=-1&catalogId=4006970&PHOTOS=on&productId=390306&categoryId=325609

And some latex exam gloves to keep yer hands clean.

Edit: Oops - Kerry you beat me to the topsider!

I'll never forget that clockwise=tighten, for certain. Because that's exactly what I did -- turned it clockwise :P The whole 'lefty-loosy' mnemonic just doesn't seem to make sense when you're looking at something upside down and off to one side for fear you're going to dump warm oil onto your head :)

No work has been done tonight, I came home pretty wiped out from a Lake Lanier afternoon, and I won't have a helper until tomorrow after work to help with the drain pan bit. I have a set of metric hex wrenches already, and will come home with a steel drill bit (to drill out a hole to release what oil's still in the pan) and a couple of bags of kitty litter for the inevitable messes. Also will call around for prices on a replacement pan. I'd take the suggestion of just leaving the stripped plug in and using the topsider pump, except the plug is leaking a bit now, and I'd rather just fix it properly.

That topsider pump, though, may see use for future oil changes and other things. Also, and this may be a silly question: could that pump have application for vacuum system troubleshooting? I have a hand vacuum pump on my shopping list already.

As someone told me today, now that I've broken it, it's really mine, with apologies to djugurba, of course.

Webwench,
Don't feel bad about being confused on which way you were turning. I've been turning wrenches for 40 years or so. I still can get turned around, especially when standing on my head in some contorted postion. To prevent getting the wrench backwards, I set the ratchet to loosen while I am in a "normal" position, THEN I can get all contorted, but the wrench stays set for "off". Some ratchets even have " off" and "on" engraved on the mechanism.
Count it all as part of the learning experience.....its still cheaper than paying someone else to do it.

No need for a new oil pan. Had the threads on the 533 do the same thing kind off. Well, I just vought a Heli Coil and drilled the hole put the coil in and flushed the motor with oil to get the shavings out.
The cost ended to be something like 42 dollars 40 for the coil and 2 for the new drain plug. :)
I wish you luck

The pan is out
 

The bottom of the oil pan is out, and holy crap was that messy. I did try to pry the plug out as some of you suggested, but it just wasn't budging, so the pan had to come out. I never acquired the pan-holding helper I kind of wanted, so just did it myself tonight... holding the full pan up one-handed while removing those last two screws was challenging, but doable. However, after all was said and done I even had to coat my bag of cat litter with cat litter :D

There's interesting stuff up in there, by the way. I posted pics here: http://webwench.net/gallery/mb-oops1

Talked to my mechanic this morning on the way to work, and he said if I'd bring the pan in he'd rethread it for me, if at all possible. With any luck I can put the whole thing back together Wednesday (tomorrow) night.

And now I must scrub every inch of exposed skin...

A woman who'll get THAT dirty has got to be a prize! No kidding, congradulations for sticking it out. Used diesel motor oil has got to be among the dirtiest substances on earth. It seems to penetrate into the pores of skin and be very hard to remove. You deserve a medal, but all you'll get is the self-satisfaction of completing a really thankless task. Here's to you!

Get rubber gloves to work on cars with. It only took me from the age of 15-19 to learn that lesson after having blackened arms for a week many times...


Never change the original motor-mounts out of a 1983 Buick w/ over 200k on it without a way to molt out of your current skin...:eek:

I used some rubber gloves, but still got oil on my arms, jeans, even some splatters on my face from degreasing/scrubbing the bolts! :D Next time: long sleeves...

Whoa, not on Open Forum!

Wow, this week went fast. Just got a chance to check on your project. So Is the pan back on and the car back on the road? Sounds like you had things under control. BTW, I like to use GoJo Orange hand cleaner to remove grease & oil. Really helps with diesels. I get it at AutoZoo. Comes in a big plastic can with an orange lid. I buy them two at a time (hate to run out before I'm clean)

The new pan is on the car as of Thursday morning. (I had a flight to catch midafternoon Thursday, and just returned yesterday afternoon.) The car is this --||-- close to being back on the road. I lost one of the oil housing cover bolts, and without it I think it can't be driven. I will be ordering another one today. And that I think constitutes an excellent lesson in Workshop Management!

As it turns out, the original pan couldn't be reused. For one, I left the old pan to the shop around the corner, and they were unable to wrench that bolt out -- I watched them stand on the pan and pull on the bolt head, and when I left for work, they were getting out the torch -- guess I'm stronger than I look :) More importantly, though, at some point someone had run into something with the pan on the car, and the bottom had been dented up and was in contact with what I believe are the oil intake and outlet. It wasn't obvious whiole there was oil and crud in and on the pan. Once the pan was cleaned up very well, the marks inside the pan from the impact of the pan on the internals was obvious, so I have to think oil flow was no longer optimal.

And I do have a small tub of that GoJo stuff! Spent some quality time in the shower with that stuff and a good brush. I'm not sure how it happened, but I even had spots of oil on my face and in my hair.

I guess it worked out to be a good thing that you pulled the pan! See you fixed a problem you didn't even know you had! :D

We've all done silly things!
 

Webwench,

When I bought my '86 420SEL, I decided I would change the oil myself -- something I hadn't done on my cars in a few years, but the oil filter was easy to reach on the M117 motor. Everything went OK . . .

. . . except for the "comedy of errors" part. I was all set up, had taken the oil filler cap off and put it on the air cleaner, had the car up on the curb -- then my socket adapter sheared off when I was trying to unbolt the oil filter housing cap. Okay, change clothes, drive down to the Checker and get a proper 13mm socket, drive back and get the car repositioned, change clothes. Oops, where's the oil filler cap? I hadn't put it back on when I went to the store! I actually walked the 1/4 mile back to the store, examining the road, hoping I would see where it had dropped off. No such luck. Some $15.00 and a new cap later, I walk back to the car and *finally* get started on the oil change itself.

No problems from that point on, but that first hour -- whew.

You done good.

OMG I did almost exactly the same thing and pretty much at the same time, except I stupidly used a torque wrench on the poor plug and stripped the threads by overtightening. I bought a rubber plug to put in the hole but it leaks slowly. So I bought a replacement pan and a fumoto drain valve (you don't have to unscrew to do an oil change, just flip the lever!). I haven't installed it yet; can anyone confirm that the allen bolts require a 5mm allen head?

Good to know I'm not the only one...

Gabriel

Yes, they are 5mm, and there are a whole bunch of them.

Just changed the oil on my 16v 2 days ago. Everthing went smooth as silk.

OH, this falls into the "don't ask me how I know" category. Always .. and I mean always check that the oil filler cap is in place BEFORE you drive off.

What a stinking mess.