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  #1  
Old 08-25-2004, 04:28 PM
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Undecided Voters

This originates from another post, but there seems to be quite a bit of pandering to the "undecided" voter. I'd like to hear from anyone here who is infact "undecided" and ask if you could share how it is that your decision for 2004 is still in limbo.

I earnestly request that those who have decided to please sit on the sidelines on this thread so that any responses can be made openly without fear of being subjected to partisan politics.

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  #2  
Old 08-25-2004, 05:20 PM
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How about if I'm undecided on our senate race?

On one hand we have Dem Ken Salazar. The guy is smart and qualified and is our current AG. Therein lies the problem. If he's elected to Senate we get a new AG appointed by our idiot gov. Salazar has been a great AG and I'd love to see him stay there or run for Gov in the future.

Then you have Pete Coors, who is being run by the Rep party because he has a name and tons of dough. Coors has done nothing but step on his schlong all during the campaign and has as a major plank of his campaign the promise of relief from those "greedy trial lawyers"

Now being a greedy trial lawyer I would initially hate Pete but, our state is about as anti plaintiff as it gets, we have peer review, a strong bias towards arbitration and punitive caps of 1x actual damages (I laugh at State Farm and Gore, Narwahl) some of the weakest consumer protection laws in the country and about half of our judges are former DA's that have never worked a day in the private sector. In other words, he can't make it much worse for us being on the federal level.

So I could vote for a really good candidate and screw up the AG's office or vote for a guy I'm philisophically opposed to but know he can't do any real damage.
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  #3  
Old 08-25-2004, 11:43 PM
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I'm undecided. Not sure if I'll vote for an independent candidate or one from that 'colorful' third party. My vote is up for grabs, and may remain so right up until I fill out the ballot. Decisions decisions...
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Old 08-26-2004, 12:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narwhal
..... if he continues to abrogate civil liberties and access to the judicial system.
Just curious -- do you attribute this to the man or to the times?

Last edited by GermanStar; 08-26-2004 at 12:54 AM.
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  #5  
Old 08-26-2004, 01:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narwhal
To further complicate things, I lean toward social conservatism, with a few exceptions.; My wife works for "The Man" and makes a pile of $--she is a devout Republican.
I read this over and over and I just can't figure out who "The Man" is. Is it the government? Is it the police? Is it the local mafioso?

I don't what that means any more.
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  #6  
Old 08-26-2004, 01:28 AM
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I haven't decided yet...except for knowing for sure who I won't vote for.

Not voting for Bush - except for firearms, capital punishment, and some environmental policies, the Republican domestic platform frightens me. I'm also really unhappy that Bush chose to commit the bulk of the military to Iraq in the manner that he did, particularly with not having finished wiping Al Qaeda off the face of the earth. I didn't say that I'm not voting Republican because I will likely vote for the Republican running against Barbara Boxer for the Senate seat.

Not voting Libertarian - while some of what I've heard from their party makes sense, judging by what I've seen from many of the Libertarians on this forum, it sounds like the ideal Libertarian paradise would have conditions similar to that of America shortly before the unionization movement began.

Not voting Green - while I do think that the environment needs some form of protecting, I think that the Democrats aren't going about it right...and the Greens seem to be an extremist version of that. I wish that the supposed "environmentalists" here in America would look more to the European example.

Part of me wants to vote for Kerry, but while I like what he's been saying, I'm not sure he's sincere (nothing personal against him; he is, after all, a politician ). I need to look at the other 3rd party candidates before coming to a firm decision. I would love nothing more than to see the "two-party system" collapse...a multiple-party system may actually allow real people to get into office.
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  #7  
Old 08-26-2004, 03:15 AM
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I'm undecided, except that I've decided I'm less impressed with the choices in this cycle than I have been in recent memory. I've always been a registered republican, with a leaning toward fiscal conservatism and social libertarianism (an old-line Republican attitude before the party got hijacked by the religious right). I'm dissatisfied with the administration's complete lack of fiscal discipline - if there's a program to fund that might buy them votes, they really don't care about the future (neither do the Dems., but that's somewhat expected). I don't like Ashcroft, the Patriot Act or the administration's general lack of interest in constitutional rights, either. I'm inclined to cut them some slack in that dept., as 9/11 is naturally going to lead to some over-reaction (which only becomes apparent as over-reaction later). Except for Iraq, I think they've done a pretty decent job in the war on Islamic extremism; it's been difficult to make it up as they've gone along in a new environment, and I think they've done okay. I'm not thrilled with Iraq - I don't buy pre-emptive war in general, and I think the admin. was particularly ham-fisted with its arrogant unilateralism, but I also think that claiming massive lies, war crimes, etc. isn't credible, and I'm not at all sure that Gore wouldn't have done the same thing, whatever he says today; the Iraqi status quo in 2000-2002 was untenable.

I'm not commenting on Kerry, because I think he'll pretty much do everything the current admin. does, but with a different spin (except for energy policy, where I do think Kerry would be a meaningful improvement). It'll be interesting to watch the disillusionment of the current frothing critics of the administration if Kerry wins as it slowly dawns on them that...nothing really changed except the new guy speaks in complete sentences, occasionally in French.

I'll probably vote Libertarian, though I could vote R at the last minute, especially if some notable Hollywood jackasses promise to move to France if W's re-elected. Friends call the former a wasted vote, but in Utah my vote's meaningless anyway, so it may as well be an honest one. There are no local races that are really races, except for governor; the Demo. candidate (one of the state's three current congresscritters) was a classmate of mine in college and his cousin's a friend, so I'll vote for him even though he'll lose.
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Old 08-26-2004, 04:23 AM
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I apologize about how this really doesnt have much of a directon...

I too am undecided. If Kerry and Bush are close, like within the margin of error, in my state, then I will be holding my nose and voting for Bush. Otherwise, its Badnarik (LP) all the way. My vote for Bush also depends heavily upon the death of the Scary Cosmetic Features Ban. Have you noticed how unenthusiastic the NRA is towards Bush?

I want the issues to be discussed. This political BS is nauseating. I dont care if Bush flew one of the most difficult planes to fly in the Guard, but missed a physical. I dont care if Kerry piloted a boat and shot himself and got some highly controversially-awarded medals. I do care about how these men have conducted themselves after their service. I am not voting for Kerry because his record is absolutely frightening to me. And if I get into that here, we WILL have a flamewar just like every other post to this miserable forum, Open Discussion. I have over 3000 posts on a forum I have been a member of for 3 months less than I have here. Yet I only have 600 here. I wonder why.

Without getting into a flamewar, I will simply say that Kerry represents almost none of my views. Bush isnt much better though. Its like 30% to 53%. And those things that Bush "represents" me on, he has only given lipservice to.

I will end this with a letter I sent to the GOP after finding a link on a different forum for the "GOP suggestion box" and to tell them to actually be conservative. Nationally, they have been nothing of the sort, its the local guys holding the conservatives in the GOP's tent.

Quote:
With my political beliefs, I should be an ardent Republican. But, like so many, I find that it is not I that has moved away from the party, but that the party has moved away from me.

I believe that the borders should be protected from illegal incursions, and illegal aliens living here should be deported. I believe that the government should stay out of my life as much as possible. I believe that a smaller government is a better government. I believe that my earnings are MY earnings, not income to be redistributed to others by the government. I believe that getting people off of the government dole is a top priority, and that it is not the government's job to assure income and jobs for all. I believe that firearms in any configuration should be lawful everywhere and that the 2nd Amendment trumps all firearm-restrictions, from machine-guns to concealed carry prohibitions. I believe that actual crime should be punished, and punished hard.

Now, aside from my belief that drugs should be legal and abortion should be left to the states, the Republican Party should be for me, right? Sadly, it is not. I have seen very few Republicans on the national level fighting for a smaller government, and it is safe to say that NO ONE in the White House has been leading or even a part of that fight.

I will be voting Republican in my House and Senate elections, because they are TRUE Repubicans and have vowed to fight, and in the case of my Representative, have fought, for a smaller government. However, I can not in good conscience do that for POTUS. My views are represented better by a Libertarian candidate, and I will vote that way until the GOP decides that it wants me as a voter.

Sincerely,
(moparmike)
I have not yet recieved a reply.
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  #9  
Old 08-26-2004, 09:23 AM
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I'm with you, Mo. Except I'm voting for a Demo senator, but for the same reason.

Mr Bush was never on my list of presidential candidates, nor was Gore, nor Kerry, nor Clinton.

But somehow these 4th pagers get in.

If it looks like a Bush landslide here in LA then I'll vote for the Libertarian.
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  #10  
Old 08-26-2004, 11:59 AM
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They interviewed Badnarik on KUOW the other day. I was pleasantly surprised to hear him outline his views on the role of the military and Bush's misuse thereof. He articulated a policy perspective that I found to be not unlike my own. Surgical police strikes against the criminal perps of 9/11, and none of the funny business in Iraq et al. Refreshing....

...but, then he went on to discuss his views on social policy -- pee eiuew! Whacko social-Darwinism run amok...ssssscary.
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  #11  
Old 08-26-2004, 04:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narwhal
Big Corporate Evil Silk Stocking Law Firm (actually, the lawfirm the book The Firm ws based on)

I can't comment on the local mafioso thingy.

Is that "can't" comment or "won't" comment?
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  #12  
Old 08-26-2004, 09:38 PM
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Is it true that if you're still undecided after next week, Ed Gillespie or Terry McAuliffe will come over and paint your porch for you? Or do you have to live in a battleground state?
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  #13  
Old 08-26-2004, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTI
Is it true that if you're still undecided after next week, Ed Gillespie or Terry McAuliffe will come over and paint your porch for you? Or do you have to live in a battleground state?
I dont know about my porch, but I know if Ed came over and paid for my car to repainted I would give Bush my vote. $5000 is 2/3 my yearly income...

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