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Old 03-23-2006, 10:15 PM
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Oopsie, the march of freedom takes a holiday

March 24, 2006
Kabul Judge Rejects Calls to End Trial of Christian Convert
By ABDUL WAHEED WAFA
and DAVID ROHDE

KABUL, Afghanistan, March 23 — The judge presiding over the prosecution of an Afghan man facing death for converting from Islam to Christianity said Thursday that he would resist any interference, despite mounting international condemnation.

A day after President Bush mentioned the case, Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice called President Hamid Karzai of Afghanistan to discuss it "in the strongest possible terms," said the State Department spokesman, Sean McCormack.

"She called specifically on this topic," Mr. McCormack said, "and she urged President Karzai's government to seek a favorable resolution to this case at the earliest possible moment."

But Ansarullah Maulavi Zada, the judge who heads the public security tribunal in Kabul, said, "There is no direct pressure on our court so far, but if it happens we will consider it interference."

He added that he expected to rule in the case in the next several days.

The case involves Abdul Rahman, 41, whose family opposed his attempt to regain custody of his two daughters and apparently told authorities last month that he had converted about 15 years ago. The resulting furor has exposed the unresolved tensions in the Bush administration's effort to meld democracy and conservative Islam in Afghanistan.

It also threatens to become a political liability for both the American and Afghan presidents.

For Mr. Bush, who finds support for his war effort in Iraq waning, the case could further alienate his political base among those in the Christian right, who have already accused the administration of putting too little pressure on Afghan officials.

For Mr. Karzai, the case traps him squarely between his Western backers and Afghanistan's conservative religious council, the Ulema, an important source of domestic support.

"The international community is saying you must stop this," said Barnett R. Rubin, a New York University professor and expert on Afghanistan. "The Ulema is saying, 'Are you an Islamic ruler?' "

The case illustrates a central contradiction of the compromise Constitution that Afghanistan adopted in 2004, which has been cited as an example for other Islamic countries. One passage declares Islam Afghanistan's supreme law, while another states that the country grants its citizens religious freedom.

In an intentional effort to avoid a standoff, the Constitution leaves certain crimes to be handled by religious judges, according to J. Alexander Thier of the Hoover Institution, who was an adviser on the Constitution. One such crime is converting from Islam to another religion.

Under conservative interpretations, a convert can be sentenced to death. Many moderate Muslims reject that interpretation as too severe. Afghanistan's laws are silent on the matter, and the country's criminal code does not specifically declare converting from Islam to Christianity a crime.

After meeting with Afghanistan's foreign minister, Abdullah, earlier this week, Ms. Rice called the minister into a second meeting on Thursday, according to Mr. McCormack, the department spokesman. In a 15-minute meeting, she told Mr. Abdullah (who uses only one name) that the prosecution was "contrary to universal democratic values," which include freedom of religion, Mr. McCormack said.

The same message came from the White House, where President Bush's chief spokesman, Scott McClellan, said the case "clearly violates the universal freedoms that democracies around the world hold dear."

"And we are watching it very closely," he added.

On Wednesday, President Bush said Washington expected Afghan officials to "honor the universal principle of freedom." Germany, Italy, Canada and other countries that have deployed troops in Afghanistan have also issued statements of concern.

To Afghan prosecutors, the case appears equally clear cut. One described Mr. Rahman as a "microbe," said conversion is illegal under Islamic law, and requested the death penalty.

Mr. Rubin, of N.Y.U., said he believed most Afghans did not support putting Mr. Rahman to death.

A friend of Mr. Rahman, who did not want his name published, could only speculate on why Mr. Rahman had converted. The two men worked together at a government radio station during the war against the Moscow-backed Communist government in Afghanistan in the 1990's.

"Abdul Rahman was living in neighboring Pakistan when Afghanistan was governed by a Communist regime," the friend said. "He was working for a foreign aid organization and converted to Christianity in Pakistan, and over this issue his wife got divorced, as she was not happy to follow her husband."

Mr. Rahman recently returned to Afghanistan after failing to gain asylum in Belgium, the friend said. He is a poorly educated laborer, and questions have been raised about his mental competency.

In images broadcast on Afghan television, Mr. Rahman told reporters: "I am not an infidel. I am Christian. I believe in Jesus." Islam considers Jesus one in a line of prophets culminating in Muhammad.

Mr. Rahman's case is only the most prominent of recent years to show how religious conservatives try to exert their influence through Afghanistan's decrepit and corrupt judicial system. Conservative judges, who dominate many courts, have threatened to close Afghan television stations that broadcast material they deemed indecent and have charged journalists with publishing material they declared blasphemous.

This week, Mr. Karzai introduced a new slate of ministers and Supreme Court justices, a step intended to produce a more effective government and less conservative judiciary. The nominations require approval by Parliament, the first in 30 years.

Critics of Mr. Karzai have long accused him of appeasing religious conservatives and warlords. In the past, he has defused clashes with conservative judges by failing to implement their rulings or striking closed-door compromises with them.

But Mr. Rahman's case has attracted far more attention, and comes at a time when Afghans have grown increasingly critical of the international presence in their country, which they say has brought too few benefits and spawned enormous corruption.

"The people feel that they are so weak that they need all these foreigners there," Mr. Rubin said. "They hope they will help them, but they are establishing brothels in Kabul, they are drinking."

In the United States this week, Christian talk shows and advocacy groups rallied their supporters, who flooded the White House and the Afghanistan Embassy with complaints.

At the State Department briefing, Mr. McCormack denied that the administration had been slow to respond to the Rahman case. As soon as the department learned about it, "we stated our concerns immediately with the foreign minister," he said. "After our initial conversation with the Afghan government, we thought it was important that we spoke in the strongest possible terms in public on this issue."

Maulavi Muhaiuddin Baloch, Mr. Karzai's adviser on religious affairs, said that the case belonged in the court and that Afghanistan's judiciary was independent.

Fazil Ahmad Manawi, a former deputy chief justice, said: "It is a dilemma for Afghan courts. The international community's presence in Afghanistan, with military and financial support on one hand and the prestige of Afghan courts and religious people of Afghanistan on another hand, makes the issue very difficult."

If he is convicted, Mr. Rahman will be able to appeal his sentence to two higher courts. Maulavi Zada, the judge overseeing the case, said Thursday that the next court session would be held in several days. It was unclear whether Mr. Rahman would present any defense. To date, no lawyer in Kabul has been willing to represent him.

Moderate Afghan officials are eager to quietly dispose of the case, but the vocal criticism from American and Western officials makes that more difficult, according to Mr. Rubin. One possible compromise would involve the court's declaring Mr. Rahman mentally ill and allowing him to leave the country.

Abdul Waheed Wafa reported from Kabul for this article, and David Rohde from New York.

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  #2  
Old 03-23-2006, 10:19 PM
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well this must give some, infinite pleasure to read.
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  #3  
Old 03-23-2006, 10:20 PM
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I assure you, the pleasure is demonstrably finite.
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  #4  
Old 03-23-2006, 10:34 PM
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that there is pleasure at all is instructive
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  #5  
Old 03-23-2006, 10:49 PM
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Yes, yes it is.
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  #6  
Old 03-23-2006, 11:50 PM
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It's more than instructive, it's telling.
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  #7  
Old 03-24-2006, 12:12 AM
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[QUOTE=H2O2]March 24, 2006
Kabul Judge Rejects Calls to End Trial of Christian Convert
By ABDUL WAHEED WAFA
and DAVID ROHDE

KABUL, Afghanistan, March 23 —

For Mr. Bush, who finds support for his war effort in Iraq waning, the case could further alienate his political base among those in the Christian right, who have already accused the administration of putting too little pressure on Afghan officials.

QUOTE]

Help me out here:

Too little pressure on Afghan officials for what?
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Old 03-24-2006, 12:17 AM
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[QUOTE=pxland]
Quote:
Originally Posted by H2O2
March 24, 2006
Kabul Judge Rejects Calls to End Trial of Christian Convert
By ABDUL WAHEED WAFA
and DAVID ROHDE

KABUL, Afghanistan, March 23 —

For Mr. Bush, who finds support for his war effort in Iraq waning, the case could further alienate his political base among those in the Christian right, who have already accused the administration of putting too little pressure on Afghan officials.

QUOTE]

Help me out here:

Too little pressure on Afghan officials for what?
Pressure to convey to them who's actually supposed to be calling the shots around there.
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Old 03-24-2006, 12:22 AM
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[QUOTE=H2O2]
Quote:
Originally Posted by pxland

Pressure to convey to them who's actually supposed to be calling the shots around there.
Why do the johnny bible-thumps care?
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  #10  
Old 03-24-2006, 12:22 AM
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The Koran asks for a tax to be paid by non believers, some fundamentalist muslims think the tax can only be death, most muslims will take money. Funny too because the Prophet was known to have studied Christianity and Judaism, which were the established religions of the time. And served as templates for Islam, in a way. (Very simplistic statement, I know.)

I think we as a country have to seriously consider not supporting any government that persecutes people for their beliefs. For everyday they persist in this maddening persecution, we should reduce by half our financial support of the government. If it fails, then so be it. We have proved that we can keep the terrorists busy and on the run. But proping up this type of government, in some kind of politically correct effort at not offending one religion while another is persecuted is not American.
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  #11  
Old 03-24-2006, 12:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlssmith
The Koran asks for a tax to be paid by non believers, some fundamentalist muslims think the tax can only be death, most muslims will take money. Funny too because the Prophet was known to have studied Christianity and Judaism, which were the established religions of the time. And served as templates for Islam, in a way. (Very simplistic statement, I know.)

I think we as a country have to seriously consider not supporting any government that persecutes people for their beliefs. For everyday they persist in this maddening persecution, we should reduce by half our financial support of the government. If it fails, then so be it. We have proved that we can keep the terrorists busy and on the run. But proping up this type of government, in some kind of politically correct effort at not offending one religion while another is persecuted is not American.
of course you are right, but the Left would have a field day.
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  #12  
Old 03-24-2006, 01:06 AM
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The whole thing makes you quite appreciative of the freedom of religion that we have here.
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  #13  
Old 03-24-2006, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Surf-n-Turf
Seems to me that the PC crowd is persecuting the values and religious beliefs of our founding fathers.
We are already picking and choosing when it comes to the values and beliefs of our founding fathers. As a group, for instance, they believed slavery was OK. They also believed there was nothing wrong with smoking pot.

The only founding father whose core value is still being followed is Mr. Hancock's; he believed in making money.

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