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  #1  
Old 10-18-2006, 10:07 AM
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Federal pension benefits and marriage

Gary Studs' same sex spouse was denied federal pension death benefits on the basis of the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act. He was not a legal spouse according to that legislation. What do people think of this? I have a close friend who retired from the feds a year ago. He had been common-law married to his opposite sex spouse for about 30yrs. A few weeks before he retired he learned that his wife would not be eligible for any of his pension benefits because his Colorado common law marriage was not recognized by the feds for purposes of pension benefits. They had to go to the courthouse and get 'married' by a judge after being married for 30yrs in order for her to gain eligibility.

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  #2  
Old 10-18-2006, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by kerry edwards View Post
Gary Studs' same sex spouse was denied federal pension death benefits on the basis of the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act. He was not a legal spouse according to that legislation. What do people think of this? I have a close friend who retired from the feds a year ago. He had been common-law married to his opposite sex spouse for about 30yrs. A few weeks before he retired he learned that his wife would not be eligible for any of his pension benefits because his Colorado common law marriage was not recognized by the feds for purposes of pension benefits. They had to go to the courthouse and get 'married' by a judge after being married for 30yrs in order for her to gain eligibility.
If you want the benefits of being married coulple, then get you should get legally married. And concerning same sex marriage, I agree with the federal legislation 100%.
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Old 10-18-2006, 10:35 AM
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Eliminate pensions for elected officials. Let them get a job and SSI.
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  #4  
Old 10-18-2006, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by kerry edwards View Post
Gary Studs' same sex spouse was denied federal pension death benefits on the basis of the 1996 Defense of Marriage Act. He was not a legal spouse according to that legislation.

Soo you are saying that before the evil Defense of Marriage Act passed, the guys gay husband would have collected? Do you have a link?

I think the law is the law, and clearly, the Feds are following the law. Should it be changed? No, I'm ok with it as is.
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Old 10-18-2006, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by 450slcguy View Post
If you want the benefits of being married coulple, then get you should get legally married. And concerning same sex marriage, I agree with the federal legislation 100%.
Both my friends and Studs were legally married in the states where they resided. Common law marriage is legal in Colorado and same sex marriages are legal in MA. The Federal government is simply refusing to recognize marriages legal in States when it comes to pension benefits.
Do private pension plans have the right to trump State laws on what counts as being married?
My friend was not an elected official. He was an employee of a Federal agency.
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  #6  
Old 10-18-2006, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Botnst View Post
Eliminate pensions for elected officials. Let them get a job and SSI.
Hey! We Agree! I wish I could work for two years and have a great federal pension for the rest of my life. The fox is watching the henhouse and we are getting screwed.
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  #7  
Old 10-18-2006, 11:17 AM
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Originally Posted by John Doe View Post
Soo you are saying that before the evil Defense of Marriage Act passed, the guys gay husband would have collected? Do you have a link?

I think the law is the law, and clearly, the Feds are following the law. Should it be changed? No, I'm ok with it as is.
I'm not entirely sure of the timeline, but I don't think any States recognized gay marriages before 1996. But many (all?) states recognized common law marriages. Prior to the legislation, my friend's spouse would have been eligible for his benefits as a common law wife as I understand the situation.
I don't have a link to the legislation but AP had a story on Studs' partner in the Rocky Mountain News today.
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  #8  
Old 10-18-2006, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by riethoven View Post
Hey! We Agree! I wish I could work for two years and have a great federal pension for the rest of my life. The fox is watching the henhouse and we are getting screwed.
Where do you get this? They have to work for 5 years even to vest in FERS and have to be over 50 and have 20 years in to draw. Just like any other Federal employee.
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  #9  
Old 10-18-2006, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by kerry edwards View Post
I don't have a link to the legislation but AP had a story on Studs' partner in the Rocky Mountain News today.
Yeah, a story tyring to hang Stud's denial on that silly Act, whereas he would have been denied anyway. Spin--someone is getting paid well to handle Stud's case.
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  #10  
Old 10-18-2006, 11:28 AM
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Where do you get this? They have to work for 5 years even to vest in FERS and have to be over 50 and have 20 years in to draw. Just like any other Federal employee.
True for federal employees. But members of Congress only have to serve one term to get a pension for life.
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  #11  
Old 10-18-2006, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by retmil46 View Post
True for federal employees. But members of Congress only have to serve one term to get a pension for life.
From US.Gov.:

Congress: Benefits
Members of Congress receive retirement and health benefits under the same plans available to other federal employees. They become vested after five years of full participation.

• Members elected since 1984 are covered by the Federal Employees' Retirement System (FERS). Those elected prior to 1984 were covered by the Civil Service Retirement System (CSRS). In 1984 all members were given the option of remaining with CSRS or switching to FERS.

• As it is for all other federal employees, congressional retirement is funded through taxes and the participants' contributions. Members of Congress under FERS contribute 1.3 percent of their salary into the FERS retirement plan and pay 6.2 percent of their salary in Social Security taxes.

Members of Congress are not eligible for a pension until they reach the age of 50, but only if they've completed 20 years of service. Members are eligible at any age after completing 25 years of service or after they reach the age of 62. Please also note that Member's of Congress have to serve at least 5 years to even receive a pension.

The amount of a Congressperson's pension depends on the years of service and the average of the highest 3 years of his or her salary. By law, the starting amount of a Member's retirement annuity may not exceed 80% of his or her final salary.

Data compiled in 2003 showed 413 retired Members of Congress were receiving federal pensions based fully or in part on their congressional service. The average age of those retiring under CSRS was 75.5 and had at least 20 years of federal service. Those who retired under FERS had an average age of 68.3 years and 21.6 years of federal service. Their average retirement payment was $3,909 a month.
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  #12  
Old 10-18-2006, 12:19 PM
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Yeah, a story tyring to hang Stud's denial on that silly Act, whereas he would have been denied anyway. Spin--someone is getting paid well to handle Stud's case.
I don't get your point. Studds died. He had a federal pension. The benefits that would have gone to his spouse had he been married to a woman have been denied to his male spouse. Same rule would have been applied to my friend and his spouse because they were only legally married in Colorado via common law.
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  #13  
Old 10-18-2006, 03:09 PM
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Originally Posted by kerry edwards View Post
I don't get your point. Studds died. He had a federal pension. The benefits that would have gone to his spouse had he been married to a woman have been denied to his male spouse. Same rule would have been applied to my friend and his spouse because they were only legally married in Colorado via common law.
The Federal govt. says Studds didn't have a spouse. My point is that I [think] the same result would have happened before 96 so the Defense of Marriage Act had nothing to do with Studd's stud getting the survivor benefit. Even if 96 was first state sanctioned gay marriage, that has nothing to do with the fact that the guy still wasn't a Federal beneficiary before the DoM act, so bringing the DoM Act up as an excuse for the alleged wrong just seems like a cheap way for someone to get standing to challenge the DoM act.

As I have tried to make clear, I don't know what the law was before 96, but strongly suspect you couldn't name a same sex survivor--and the FERS handbook is pretty clear (and available online for those who want to look at it).
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  #14  
Old 10-18-2006, 04:35 PM
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He wasn't a beneficiary before the DOM act of 1996 but would have become a beneficiary had his state permitted same sex marriage. (I think) The DOM act was a pre-emptive strike to avoid this. While I don't see the precise reason in the text of the DOM, my friend's wife would have been a beneficiary before 1996 but not after. (according to what he told me)

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