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  #1  
Old 02-23-2007, 02:21 AM
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This is bad....

Really bad >>>
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6388585.stm

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  #2  
Old 02-23-2007, 03:01 AM
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You're a pessimist, Vronsky.

First, you should stop reading BBC News. Second, pull yourself out of Iraq.
Make it start!!
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  #3  
Old 02-23-2007, 03:43 AM
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I've been following this story for a while just cause it's so shocking. They spelled the ring-leader's name wrong. It's Stephen Green.

Here he is after he was discharged, for a "personality disorder:"



A photo of him in Iraq and later doing the perp walk:



He was one of those allowed in due to a relaxing of standards regarding such matters as prior convictions or behavioral problems. And now I read they are further relaxing standards in order to meet recruiting quotas. Here's the best article I found about hillbilly boy Green:

An Itchy Finger

Steven Green went to Iraq eager to 'Kill 'em all.' The Army thinks he took things way too far.

By Sarah Childress and Michael Hirsh, Newsweek
August 7, 2006 issue

Even before he went to Iraq, Steven Green scared people. Growing up in oil-rich Midland, Texas, a small community full of pumping jacks, pickup trucks and fast-food restaurants, Green was known as a petulant loner and a hard-drinking druggie. Mostly what people remember is his seething, seemingly random rage. In high school, Green would jump on other kids for offenses like wearing a green shirt, or using a white cigarette lighter—anything he'd arbitrarily claim to hate. His best friend, Mike, recalls remarking to Green once that he wanted to punch another kid standing nearby. "I'll do it!" Green said, and ran over and socked the boy. Another friend remembers the time when they were hanging out at his place and Green wanted to play a Guns N' Roses CD. When the others said they wanted to hear something else, Green put the disc on anyway, blasting the music at full volume until people left, one by one. "A lot of people didn't accept Steve," says Mike, who requested that his last name be withheld.

Green's parents had divorced when he was 4; his parents drank, and he drifted from home to home. But he was anxious to better himself, acquaintances say. And the Army seemed to offer everything Green lacked: money, friends, a place to stay, possibly even fame. Boot camp, Green later told friends, was great. He bragged about being a part of the world's most powerful military, and he was excited to get to Iraq. "He wanted to be a hero," says Hugh Bailey, 54, a Vietnam-veteran Marine who befriended Green. When he enlisted in February 2005, Green exultantly told Mike and others, like the mother of one of his friends, Alma Thomas: "I'm gonna go over there and kill 'em all."

Just a week into his tour, Green's mood changed. His unit, the 502nd Infantry Regiment, was on the front lines of the insurgency in the Sunni Triangle town of Al Mahmudiyah. On his MySpace page, which was oddly titled "imalittlegirl," he sent messages to Mike saying he'd seen body parts flying through the air. It was nothing like Red Faction, his favorite videogame. "Dude, I can't do all this. I thought it'd be cool to kill people, but I saw my buddy get shot in the face. It's not pretty," Green wrote, Mike recalls. After one tough day, he wrote, "Screw this s--t. Every time I make a new friend, they get killed."

Exactly what happened to Steven Green in Iraq is not clear. All that is known is that seven weeks after being honorably discharged for what the Army called a "personality disorder," Green was arrested last month for a horrific crime. According to the indictment, he raped an Iraqi girl in Al Mahmudiyah and murdered her and her family. Five other soldiers in the 502nd have also been charged with complicity in the crime. Among the accused is Jesse Spielman of Chambersburg, Pa., whose mother, Nancy Hess, blames the charges on Green. "That kid should have never ever been let in the military," Hess told NEWSWEEK, adding that her son would refer to Green in conversations as "the total idiot who's trying to get out" of the Army. "Goes to show you what kind of scum the military lets in. The recruiters will take anything with warm blood." Green's lawyer, Patrick Bouldin, says he can't comment on the case but added: "Critical comments about Mr. Green from a codefendant or his camp are always viewed with heavy skepticism because of the high likelihood of bias."

Green's case has helped to spur a closer look at the Army's standards for recruitment and training. Green enlisted and passed basic training at a time when the Army was under terrific pressure to bring in new soldiers and had relaxed its entry requirements. In 2005, about the time Green was accepted, the Army raised the limit on the so-called Category 4 recruits it would allow, the designation for soldiers with the lowest scores on its aptitude test. (Green's score is not known.) The Army has also been handing out more waivers—including case-by-case exceptions for criminal offenses—which increased by 3 percent last year. Basic training has slipped as well. In years past, basic was geared to "wash out" those unfit for the stresses of military life. Now it has been reformulated to keep as many recruits as possible. "What you're seeing is the reverse of what made the Army so effective," says Sen. Jack Reed of the Armed Services Committee.

The most recent washout numbers show a dramatic decline in standards: currently only 7.6 percent of new recruits fail to get through their first six months of service, down from 18.1 percent in May 2005, according to the latest Army figures. "That's a heck of a drop," says Leo Daugherty, the Army's command historian at Fort Knox. "The young man who got in [Green] should never have gotten in the Army. He slipped through the system." The Army says it has adapted basic training to lessons learned in Iraq and Afghanistan, and helps soldiers to improve their weaknesses. "We will get rid of those individuals who have no business being a soldier," says Col. Kevin Shwedo, director of operations, plans and training for Army Accessions Command. "We're not going to quit on a soldier when they're trainable. That's a big difference."

In truth, it's not clear whether a candidate like Green would have washed out even if his superiors had known about his alleged personality problems sooner. He had posted adequate scores on his General Equivalency Degree test, or GED, a substitute for a high-school diploma. And his troubles with the law were minor: two prior misdemeanor convictions for possession of drug paraphernalia and tobacco as a minor, and being a minor in possession of alcohol. "Around here, kids get those like candy," says one Midland recruiter who asked not to be named because he wasn't authorized to speak to the media.

Even the most psychologically fit recruits have buckled under the stress of watching their buddies die around them. Troubled kids are often the most susceptible. Certainly Steven Green seemed to snap, judging from the government indictment. On the night in question in Al Mahmudiyah, Green dressed in dark clothes, ducked away from his post and persuaded some of his comrades to come along. According to the indictment, he then led them to the house of a 14-year-old Iraqi girl. At the home, Green herded the mother, father and a young girl, about 5 years old, into a back bedroom while another soldier threw the teenager to the floor. Green closed the bedroom door. Shots were fired, and he emerged with an AK-47, which had been in the home, and said, "I just killed them. All are dead." He and another soldier then allegedly raped the teenager. Afterward, Green shot her two or three times in the head, killing her, the indictment says. (Green has pleaded not guilty.)

Should the Army have seen trouble coming? It's hard to say. Back in Midland, "he didn't fit in, he never got around to knowing people," says B. J. Carr, Green's former stepgrandfather. With so many people coming and going in his life, "he didn't know what side to be on." But to others like Alma Thomas, Green could be kind and full of energy. When he boasted to her, as he had to his friends, that he was going to Iraq to "kill 'em all," Thomas said she warned him, as perhaps no one else had, that serving in Iraq would be "like a real nightmare that you can't wake up from." Green probably never will.
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  #4  
Old 02-23-2007, 04:15 AM
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Yeah, I was just pulling Vronsky's leg ...

But that seems to be a different story?

Here is something else:

Russia warns U.S. on Iran moves

MOSCOW, Feb. 21 (UPI) -- Russia's foreign minister Wednesday warned the United States not to take military action against Iran.
"The Russian foreign minister said Wednesday U.S.-led multinational foreign forces in Iraq must not conduct military operations outside the country, including against Iran," the RIA Novosti news agency reported.
"The multinational force in Iraq should abide strictly by the UN Security Council's mandate, which does not provide for any operations outside the country," Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov told the Lebanese magazine Al-Watan Al-Arabi in an interview.
"The escalation of the conflict and its possible spread beyond the Iraqi borders will inevitably result in catastrophic consequences and not for the Middle East alone," Lavrov said according to the report. "I believe Washington understands this."
Lavrov told Al-Watan Al-Arabi that a timetable needed to be drawn up for the coordinated and gradual evacuation of all foreign military forces from Iraq. He said that was essential to bring stability to the troubled Middle eastern nation.
"But at the same time we believe that U.S. Army detachments and their coalition allies should not leave Iraq tomorrow," Lavrov said.
Lavrov also said that Iraq's own police, army and other security forces needed to be increased in size and strength to prepare for the pull out of U.S. and other forces.
"The long-standing confrontation between the U.S. and Iran deteriorated further Jan. 11 when American servicemen burst into Iran's mission in Erbil (Kurdistan) and detained five officials. American troops disarmed guards and confiscated computers and documents without providing any explanation," RIA Novosti noted.
The Russian news agency also noted that "earlier this month the United States accused Iran of backing the insurgency and unrest in Iraq, and suspects the Islamic Republic of pursuing a secret nuclear weapons program."
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  #5  
Old 02-23-2007, 05:42 AM
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No, it's the same story.

Green is being tried as a civilian because he was discharged from the army before his superiors knew of his suspected involvement. He denies the charges against him.

I heard an Iranian guy on the radio giving his perspective. He believes that with all of our arresting Iranians in Iraq, barging in, weapons drawn, it's only a matter of time before some Iranian bodyguard says F*** that S*** and shoots a couple of Americans. Uh-oh, pretext for invasion.

What, we thought they would just sit by quietly while we tried to mold Iraq, their neighbor, into our image?

Boggles the mind.
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  #6  
Old 02-23-2007, 05:55 AM
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Second US carrier arrives off Iran

From correspondents in Manama
February 20, 2007 08:12pm
Article from: Agence France-Presse


A SECOND US aircraft carrier arrived in Middle Eastern waters today as promised by US President George W Bush amid an escalating crisis with nearby Iran over its nuclear program.

The USS John C Stennis and its accompanying strike group joined the USS Dwight D Eisenhower in the Sea of Oman but has not yet entered Gulf waters, the US Fifth Fleet said from its base in Manama.
The Stennis "entered the US 5th Fleet area of operations ... to conduct maritime security operations in regional waters, as well as to provide support for ground forces operating in Afghanistan and Iraq", said a US statement.
Mr Bush on January 10 unveiled his new strategy for Iraq which included deploying a second aircraft carrier group and a Patriot anti-missile defence system "to reassure our friends and allies".
Washington accuses arch-foe Tehran of stoking the insurgency in Iraq and of seeking to develop a nuclear bomb, charges denied by the Islamic republic.
Days after Mr Bush's announcement, US Defence Secretary Robert Gates said the Stennis's redeployment was a signal to Iran, which, he said, has a "very negative" attitude.
Iran has also been carrying out military exercises in the region, including test-firing missiles and building drones that military commanders boasted could hit the US navy.
The White House has repeatedly insisted it has no plans to strike Iran, and downplayed the significance of reinforcing the US military presence in the Gulf region.
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Old 02-23-2007, 06:01 AM
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In my opinion, it's unfortunate as it is inevitable.

What's frightening is, that under a called out 'Martial Law' a regularly due Presidential Election can be suspended until further notice ... so to speak.
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Old 02-23-2007, 06:12 AM
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Fema


Some people have referred to it as the "secret government" of the United States. It is not an elected body, it does not involve itself in public disclosures, and it even has a quasi-secret budget in the billions of dollars. This government organization has more power than the President of the United States or the Congress, it has the power to suspend laws, move entire populations, arrest and detain citizens without a warrant and hold them without trial, it can seize property, food supplies, transportation systems, and can suspend the Constitution.

Not only is it the most powerful entity in the United States, but it was not even created under Constitutional law by the Congress. It was a product of a Presidential Executive Order. No, it is not the U.S. military nor the Central Intelligence Agency, they are subject to Congress. The organization is called FEMA, which stands for the Federal Emergency Management Agency. Originally conceived in the Richard Nixon Administration, it was refined by President Jimmy Carter and given teeth in the Ronald Reagan and George Bush Administrations.

FEMA had one original concept when it was created, to assure the survivability of the United States government in the event of a nuclear attack on this nation. It was also provided with the task of being a federal coordinating body during times of domestic disasters, such as earthquakes, floods and hurricanes. Its awesome powers grow under the tutelage of people like Lt. Col. Oliver North and General Richard Secord, the architects on the Iran-Contra scandal and the looting of America's savings and loan institutions. FEMA has even been given control of the State Defense Forces, a rag-tag, often considered neo-Nazi, civilian army that will substitute for the National Guard, if the Guard is called to duty overseas.

THE MOST POWERFUL ORGANIZATION IN THE UNITED STATES

Though it may be the most powerful organization in the United States, few people know it even exists. But it has crept into our private lives. Even mortgage papers contain FEMA's name in small print if the property in question is near a flood plain. FEMA was deeply involved in the Los Angeles riots and the 1989 Loma Prieta earthquake in the San Francisco Bay Area. Some of the black helicopter traffic reported throughout the United States, but mainly in the West, California, Washington, Arizona, New Mexico, Texas and Colorado, are flown by FEMA personnel. FEMA has been given responsibility for many new disasters including urban forest fires, home heating emergencies, refugee situations, urban riots, and emergency planning for nuclear and toxic incidents. In the West, it works in conjunction with the Sixth Army.

FEMA was created in a series of Executive Orders. A Presidential Executive Order, whether Constitutional or not, becomes law simply by its publication in the Federal Registry. Congress is by-passed. Executive Order Number 12148 created the Federal Emergency Management Agency that is to interface with the Department of Defense for civil defense planning and funding. An "emergency czar" was appointed. FEMA has only spent about 6 percent of its budget on national emergencies, the bulk of their funding has been used for the construction of secret underground facilities to assure continuity of government in case of a major emergency, foreign or domestic. Executive Order Number 12656 appointed the National Security Council as the principal body that should consider emergency powers. This allows the government to increase domestic intelligence and surveillance of U.S. citizens and would restrict the freedom of movement within the United States and grant the government the right to isolate large groups of civilians. The National Guard could be federalized to seal all borders and take control of U.S. air space and all ports of entry.
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Old 02-23-2007, 06:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaRondo View Post
What's frightening is, that under a called out 'Marshall Law' a regularly due Presidential Election can be suspended until further notice ... so to speak.
The Stephen Green story is fascinating.

I lost you here, however. Do you mean "martial law"?

"Martial law is the system of rules that takes effect when the military takes control of the normal administration of justice.

Usually martial law reduces some of the personal rights ordinarily granted to the citizen, limits the length of the trial processes, and prescribes more severe penalties than ordinary law. In many states martial law prescribes the death penalty for certain crimes, even if ordinary law does not contain that crime or punishment in its system."
Wikipedia

Did Zbigniew Brezinsky actually write an article entitled "The Marshall Law Government"?

"Marshall Law was an Australian television series, which aired for one season in 2002." Wikipedia

I haven't followed him closely, but I seem to remember Brezinsky taking some weird positions recently.
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Old 02-23-2007, 07:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by al76slc View Post
The Stephen Green story is fascinating.

I lost you here, however. Do you mean "martial law"?

"Martial law is the system of rules that takes effect when the military takes control of the normal administration of justice.

Usually martial law reduces some of the personal rights ordinarily granted to the citizen, limits the length of the trial processes, and prescribes more severe penalties than ordinary law. In many states martial law prescribes the death penalty for certain crimes, even if ordinary law does not contain that crime or punishment in its system." Wikipedia

Did Zbigniew Brezinsky actually write an article entitled "The Marshall Law Government"?

"Marshall Law was an Australian television series, which aired for one season in 2002." Wikipedia

I haven't followed him closely, but I seem to remember Brezinsky taking some weird positions recently.
Yes, you are perfectly right. It's 'Martial Law'. Yet the article is online as I copied it. Zbigniew Brezinsky, may not have written it, it's just part of the post.

Sorry, my mistake. Here is the link:

http://www.wealth4freedom.com/FEMA.html

Well, this is what can happen at 3AM. Thoughts are faster than light.

From Iraq to Iran to Martial Law in the Homeland ... that's the train.
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Old 02-23-2007, 07:18 AM
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The ultimate dishonor, huh.
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Old 02-23-2007, 07:43 AM
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No **** its bad. What kind of moron would have to have this pointed out? So what is the point of this thread, Vronsky? That the US is good at prosecuting criminals?

CMAC--you should flagellate yourself for having the bad taste to have been born in this country.
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by John Doe View Post
No **** its bad. What kind of moron would have to have this pointed out? So what is the point of this thread, Vronsky? That the US is good at prosecuting criminals?

CMAC--you should flagellate yourself for having the bad taste to have been born in this country.
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:25 AM
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apologies for threadjacking, but if you scroll down to the bottom of Vronskys
link in the opening post, click on "Pride of Ireland" to learn a little about the monumental happening in Dublin this weekend.
ps - i have tickets, C'mon Ireland!
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Old 02-23-2007, 08:27 AM
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Yes, but, the title of the thread just seems utterly stupid to me and intended only to beat Vronsky's worn out drum that he hates this Country.

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