W210 Third Row Seating E320 Wagon?
 

In considering the R-class and ML-class as possible successors to our minivan, we revisited the W210 E320 wagon as another desirable option. Rides much better than the ML, with far better gas mileage too. More proven and much more affordable than the R. However, I would like to know how usable the third row seat is. I understand the seats are mostly designed for pre-teens, and our kids are young enough that these seats should be able to accommodate them for a few years to come, certainly through the useful life of the car.

My only concern is with the lack of rear headrests on those third row seats. I noticed that the W211 wagon has them, but I haven't found a W210 that has them. What if I were to hit something, even at a relatively slow (25 or 35 mph) speed? Wouldn't that translate to certain whiplash for the third-row occupants, since it seems their heads line up perfectly with the spaces between the second-row headrests?

I will say that I like the ML320 third row because I can actually fit back there (I am 6' 1") with the second row moved forward. Definitely not a place I'd want to spend several hours, but one or two hours in a pinch (with a break hopefully) wouldn't kill me. And best of all, those seats face forward so I think they are safer in the event of an accident. Anyone else out there have a wagon with the third row? What are your thoughts? Also, any comments on the usefulness of the wagon versus say an ML320?

This is a good question I have seen the ratings for ML's but not the wagons, the rear facing seat sort of freaks me out but may be OK.

Probably 10-11 years old is how far you'll get with an E-class wagon before the kids no longer fit back there. I have friends that were forced to move from a wagon to a 3-row SUV about the time their kids became teens - they just didn't fit in the rear facing seat any longer.

I think you have a good point about the headrests. Don't think there's any good solution there. How old must the kids be before their heads are above the top of the seat? On the plus side, the 3rd seat has the best cupholders in the entire car. :)

Don't forget that on a wagon when the 3rd seat is in use, there is zero luggage capacity available.

I got 30.1MPG on a College Station-Plano run this past weekend. But that's not a typical number.

- JimY

Is that a W210?

I have a W210 wagon. I'm 5'8" tall (or short, I should better say) and I can sit in the rear-facing seat with my hair brushing against the headliner. If you hit a bump, I'm sure I'd be bouncing my head off the ceiling. I wouldn't want to sit anyone taller than 5'6" back there to ensure that doesn't happen.

Thanks for the very informative posts!

jlomon: That's very useful info, and based on that my kids will easily be fine for the next 4 or 5 years.

jcyuhn: Are you saying there is ABSOLUTELY no storage space with the third seat in use? Can the kids possibly put a backpack and maybe a couple bags of groceries by their feet? Also, with all seats folded, is the vehicle wide enough to accommodate a sheet of 4 x 8 drywall or plywood? That has always been a big qualifier for me when it comes to a family hauler - all minivans can do it, and even the ML can do it, but I don't know about the W210 wagon.

30 mpg or thereabouts would be great on a road trip! Current minivan consistently gets about 21 hwy and 14 city. Can I assume the W210 wagon will get about 20 around town like my W210 sedan?

The minivan is ultimately useful, but we just aren't in love with the driving experience. The ML wasn't a whole lot better, but the R blew us away. I love my W210 for its sporty handling and road feel, but it is a sedan. I have no idea how the wagon would ride.

On another note, oes anybody know how reliable the 4-matic is on the W210? I know on the early W124s it could be problematic and $$$ to fix when something did go wrong. I will do some research too...

No, it wont fit.

Expect to lose 1-2 mpg with the extra weight of the wagon and 4Matic versus your sedan. We get a very regular 27 mpg with a 70% highway/30% city mix. That is still a pretty significant increase over your minivan, but the car typically just hauls my wife and 2 year old son, plus his gear for moving around (folding stroller, toys, etc).

Very reliable. Second generation 4Matic bears no resemblance to first generation, aside from the fact that it is an all wheel drive system. It is much simpler. The only issues I have read about are slight oil leaks on the transfer case. This affected my particular car, but the first owner had it dealt with under warranty with a transfer case replacement. Unfortunately there is no ability to top up the oil on this transfer case.

I read a thread last night where somebody with a W210 wagon stated that he used it to haul drywall. I wonder how he did it? Perhaps on the roof rack?

This is the thread HERE - see post #10. I guess I could also PM the poster...

Maybe on the roof rack, as you suggested? Another option that might work would be to place the drywall on an angle, but I don't know about that. The problem is that an 8 foot long piece of drywall is going to hang way out the back of the hatch and it will sit quite high because the widest part of the interior is above the interior-mounted spare tire, so your hatch will be stuck in the half open position. I can see that putting a lot of pressure on your drywall, potentially even breaking it if you hit a big enough bump and the hatch lip came down hard on it.

Yup, that's a 210. Here's the caveats. That's filling up an already warmed-up car and reseting the trip computer. From a cold start it would have been lower. There was a 20-25MPH tailwind behind the car the entire trip. Going the other direction it probably would have gotten 25...

- JimY

What do you get around town? My 97 E320 gets around 19/20 with 89 octane. I have never taken it on a highway-only trip, so I have no idea what the highway would be. I'm guessing 24 or 25?

I don't expect drywall will fit. Max load size is something like 3.5' x 7'. Maybe a bit longer than 7 feet with the seat bases removed.

It's tight around the 3rd seat when in use. There's room for a backpack or a couple bags of groceries, but even then it will be crowded. The well for the base of the 3rd seat is where the kids legs & feet go.

The wagon drives substantially the same as the sedan - I've had both. The wagon is a bit heavier with more rearward weight bias. But the difference between sedan and wagon is about the same as sedan with empty fuel tank vs sedan with full fuel tank - it's small. I'm talking about my RWD wagon here. I drove a 4matic or two when shopping. The extra weight was noticeable, and the steering feel was heavier. Didn't really see the point of 4matic in Texas, so I opted for a RWD car.

The 4matic system is the same as on the R and ML.

On a RWD wagon you should be able to match economy numbers vs. your sedan. Actually, the M112 is more efficient than the M104, so it should be better. But the extra weight and friction associated with 4matic will likely mean that car cannot quite match economy numbers vs. your sedan. The EPA numbers for the 4matic car are 1MPG lower both city and highway, as I recall.

- JimY

I'm looking at something like THIS or newer. M112 (trying to avoid the 98 or 99 due to the supposed FSS issues on some) and no 4matic. This one has NAV - I wonder if it can compete with my Garmin? It also appears to have MB Tex. One-owner and Carfax looks clean. I just might run out there and test drive it. If the car checks out fine and appears well maintained, the miles won't scare me. My sedan is a 97 with 170,000 miles but performs as new with very few minor issues. Any thoughts?

My W124 E320 averaged 21 mpg in mixed driving, and got 25-26 mpg in all highway driving several times.

My dilemma right now is I have to get a new car and I'm not going to go $crazy$ because due to the current RE situation in Michigan I need to play it safe. Right now I'm thinking 1995 E320, or find a screachin deal on a W210 or buy and average W124 and wait until a perfect W210 presents itself.

There are tons on ePray but I'm scared $hitless with some of the shady dealers these days.

Many here are more familiar with their W210 Wagons than me, but here's my perspective of the buying process.

Compared to sedans, wagons are typically beat up. On average, they show nowhere near the pride of ownership that sedans do. Expect to find stains, dents, scratches, and just general thrashing that comes from buying a kid/dog/stuff hauler. My experience - it took 2 months of looking, to find one I found acceptable - and there are tons of them for sale around me. Were I not looking for a 4-Matic, the search might have been quicker. The 2WD models outnumber them about 4 to 1 around here.

Yes, I'm picky...which combined with the average wagon condition, added significantly to the wait when buying used. But I think being so, paid off in the long run.

First - I'd avoid non-MBZ dealers and lease backs like the plague, as you typically can't get service records on these vehicles. This eliminates more than half the available cars around here. And while you might occasionally find a Starmark wagon at an MBZ dealer that has been gone through top to bottom, you'll pay a huge premium for it.

Folks here stress how important good service records are, and I'm glad I took that advice. They not only give you specific information on whether known issues were addressed, but they are a key indicator of how well the vehicle was maintained over it's entire life. Was maintenance done on time and properly? Or were there near zero records done for the first few years, only to be followed up with numerous visits to fix neglected issues? Even when complete records are found, inspect them carefully - two 2000+ cars I looked at, had been serviced at generic auto repair centers, and had their factory installed and mandated synthetic oil replaced with dino. Of course, the owners were quite happy to wait 10K miles between changes, as that's what the reset display was telling them.

And finally...I know it's been stated before, but the absolute best thing you can do, is get a pre-purchase inspection at a qualified independent. Around here, the dealers won't even do them.

First car I looked at that passed the documentation check, was taken to my mechanic. Records looked great, drove like a dream. Mechanic hooked it up to his scanner, and got nothing - the CEL was burnt out or disabled, and the diagnostic system was fried. Buying that car would have resulted in a very rude and expensive surprise at SMOG time.

In short...if your schedule allows, just take your time, and wait for the right one. There are great cars, and great deals to be had...if one has a little patience. You just gotta wade through a bunch of crap to find the right one.

I absolutely agree with this statement. Ours is a perfect example. There is a small stain on one of the rear seats and there are some odd cut marks in the rear door panels that are only visible when the doors are open. The car was mechanically strong and passed the PPI with my MB Indy, and my wife isn't as picky as I am when it comes to these things, so it was the right car to move forward with. But these cars definitely get a different kind of use than the sedans do, and it shows.

So true, but I am not going to be picky because wifey and the rugrats trash a car in one day so I'm more interested in so-so interior with a solid service history.

Me too - I'm more interested in overall reliability of this model. A few minor stains, nicks and scrapes don't worry me too much.

I think when I am firm on the price I am willing to pay I am going to put a bounty out for Mbshoppers to find a good example $1000 reward to find a good one....I bet I will have a perfect example at the right price in days,,if not hours.

Heh...mine, while 95% or so overall, had "dog damage". The third row seat belts were munched a bit from the previous owner's Labs. Given that the vehicle is used to haul my own three pooches around, I was willing to overlook a bit of canine bad behavior.

Still...when it comes to abuse, I'll take dog thrash over kid thrash any day. :D

I usually see about 22-23MPG average on a tank. That's probably 60%city/40% urban highway. Most tanks involve a trip out to DFW or downtown.

+4 on the difficulty of finding a clean wagon. I wasn't looking very hard, but it was almost a year before I stumbled across one clean enough to bother. Many I saw were amazingly beat at 5 years of age. Mine has a very clean interior, low miles, and is Starmarked. Well, the interior was perfect - I own a 75lb dog and a fleet of dirty bicycles.

Agree with the importance of service history. Since these cars get an oil change once every 10-12K miles, it is imperative the correct synthetic be used.

Overall reliability is the same as the sedans. I don't know of any wagon specific problem areas. In about 4 years of ownership I've had one window regulator go out, replaced the instrument cluster due to 2 bad pixels (gotta love Starmark), a new MAF recently, and a flaky headrest motor. The broken window mechanism was the closest thing to a service affecting problem.

I did get a BAS/ESP/ABS error a few weeks ago, but that hasn't happened again. Just last week I finally replaced the original 7 year old battery. It's not a bad car.

The wagon at the Lexus dealer seems awfully low priced. Not sure I know what market is on these, though. Could be a good value if nothing major is broken and the service history isn't too scary. The pictures don't look too bad, but I find you cannot really tell anything from digital photos. Nav on a wagon is rare, most of them have only a few basic options. Worth a look, you know how they should drive.

- JimY

Wagon impressions
 

I have had my 1999 E32 wagon for almost a year now, it is my 3rd MB, first two were 124 sedans, wife still has the 400e. It dives like a tank, fast but somewhat deliberate, and gives the impression that is armor plated. W210 is a whole different driving experience, much more responsive, my wife describes it as twitchy. I also have a GMC Suburban desert truck, I bought the wagon to take over 90% of what I used the 'burb for. I waited until I found a 2wd with MB-Tex, as we scuba dive and the wagon seemed a perfect replacement for the 'burb, short of off-roading adventures. I live in the desert, so the 4-matic seemed like extra weight for little gain. Don't have to worry about leather seats in a wetsuit!

It doesn't have quite the hauling capacity of the 'burb, but uses half the fuel and drives much better. Mine has the 3rd seat, but since it is back to my wife and I, we don't use it. I put a cargo net on the floor in the back to keep the milk jug from rolling around on the way home from the grocery store.

I get about 20 in town, and got 26 on my last trip to Lake Havasu, running 80 the whole way.

It took me several months to locate what I wanted, bought it on eBay out of Miami, as they are very scarce (as in none) in the Phoenix area. It is everything I wanted and expected out of a car/wagon/light hauler. Is it an S-class prestige car, no. It was a reasonable cost ($9K with 64K miles), do almost everything well hauler that drives like, well, a Mercedes E class.

Forget the R class
 

The rear doors are so wide that they're virtually unusable in a tight parking spot.

I'd pick a wagon over an ML, with or without the 3rd row seat. If you have more than two kids, might want to consider something with more seating than what the 210 w/3rd row offers.

I remember seeing '70's-era slow-motion video of crash tests involving station wagons with rearward-facing third seats as they were struck from the rear by another vehicle. Unbelted occupants wound up traveling through the wagon's rear window and landing on the hood of the striking vehicle. Pass.

I just found a similar video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESLf2m2yt1Q